Winter or mud n snow tyre (1 Viewer)

[Jac Sprat]

Can I ask your advice as a newbie (soon to be) as we take possession of our Hymer and drive pretty much straight to the alps. The tyres need changing soon anyway - only from age not from any visible deterioration. We plan to spend two- three months in the year on snowy terrain (Alps Dolomites etc) probably two months in the UK touring including highlands etc and probably four month in hotter climes. This is my question;
Would you get mud / snow tyres permanently and accept that you may need to change tyres 5000 miles earlier due to softer rubber etc
Or would you get winter tyres and steel rims and summer tyres that you rotate?
Got an eye on safety as well as economy. Want to be as safe as possible.(obviously!)
(61 y o female driver never driven motor home any distance so far) can't share driving as hubby can't drive any more. Newly retired and off to live the dream.
Tips and thoughts very much appreciated.

 

[irnbru]

You will soon get used to driving the MH. Its easy Sorry cant help with your tyres but we got stuck in mud at the weekend. Thankfully the mud flaps I picked up new at a car bootsale came in handy.
Enjoy your travels.

 

[Jaws]

We had a set of Hankook M & S fitted to the Miller..
Could not believe the grip they gave even in deep mud.
After fitting we never got stuck once.. not even on the quagmire that was the Newark field a couple of years ago.

I certainly could not afford two sets so they were on all year round and nary a single issue.. By the time the van was sold I had more than 30k miles on them and they still had about 60% left in thim

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[sdc77]

A lot of people in the snowy areas do use summer and winter tyres. You're going to have to have chains though so you could probably just manage with your original tyres

 

[SMB]

I spend a lot of my time abroad so I changed my tyres to Continental Fourseasons 2 M&S tyres in case I was in any of the countries in which tyres with the snowflake symbol are required during certain months. As per Jaws, I have been able to extricate myself from poor conditions without any problems. I don't have a set of summer tyres as I am fulltiming and don't have a garage! The tyres handle well but if you have them fitted then it is my understanding they have to be changed when the tread is 4mm in depth. t

 

[SteveandSue]

It very much depends on your winter plans -
If going to Austrian ski resorts in the winter then I am fairly certain you will need or should have winter tyres with the snow flake symbol as opposed to just mud and snow tyres -
France I think you are OK with just carrying chains on the passes -?? Though we wouldn't do it as the cost of decent tyres far outweighs the hassle

We have used 2 sets of wheels - summer and winter -There is a big difference with snow tyres - We have only had to use our snow chains once (this was with summer tyres in the UK !) because of the levels of grip afforded by winter tyres- It also gives a significantly better feel when approaching the point of should you/should not stop and put chains on - several miles of chains aint fun.

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[SMB]

I believe that in Austria and other european countries M&S tyres with the snowflake symbol are legal for wintry conditions and in other countries between winter months (November to April seems to be the main period). In Germany it is compulsory to have them fitted in wintry conditions and I understand that if you don't and you find yourself stuck in snow on a road they can fine you or have you towed away if causing an obstruction!

 

[Jac Sprat]

Thank you
This is so helpful
So is there a difference between winter tyres and snow tyres? If we are obliged to use tyres with a snow flake symbol in some countries anyway - can we use those the whole year round or would that be silly? I'd prefer not to use snow chains if I can rely (for the most part) on better tyres.

 

[Jac Sprat]

Sorry only just realised M and S tyres means mud and snow!
Assume nothing ! I know nothing!

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[Badknee]

Sorry only just realised M and S tyres means mud and snow!
Assume nothing ! I know nothing!

I will stand correcting but I believe that there are also tyres sold as winter tyres as some of the Eunos lads fit them. These are not M&S tyres just tyres more suitable for cold wet weather

 

[SMB]

There are winter tyres and M&S tyres, I really only got the M&S tyres to remain legal if I ended up in countries where they are required but the added bonus was not getting stuck in muddy fields! I am happy to change the tyres at 4mm for the peace of mind both legally and convenience!

 

[Jac Sprat]

Ok thanks!! Mud and snow tyres it is!
What a blessing this forum is!!
(Now to find out where to go near norwich to have it done)

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[JeanLuc]

I have Continental Vanco Winter tyres on my Hymer and use them all year-round. Excellent grip on muddy fields and much shorter braking distances on snow and at low temperatures.
A mud and snow tyre will have "M+S" marked on the side wall; a true winter tyre will have an icon of an alp containing a snow flake.

 

[Jac Sprat]

So are mud and snow not sufficient legally for the snowflake requiring countries?

 

[Lenny HB]

I certain all European countries accept M&S tyres for winter use, I have Hankook RA10 all season tyres on my van not had any conditions to fully test them yet. Full winter tyres are not recommended in the summer in hot countries and some they are illegal. Italy has heavy fines (€1000) for using winter tyres in the summer. If you only want one set of tyres and are traveling all over Europe M&S 4 season tyres are your best option.

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[JeanLuc]

Italy has heavy fines (€1000) for using winter tyres in the summer.

Interesting - I had a puncture in August 2014 in Italy and had to get a new tyre. The tyre depot supplied a winter tyre!!!

 

[Jaws]

Interesting - I had a puncture in August 2014 in Italy and had to get a new tyre. The tyre depot supplied a winter tyre!!!

That will be Italy summed up in a nutshell then !!

 

[Lenny HB]

Just looked into it a bit deeper only applies to tyres with speed ratings of M, N, P or Q, therefore it would be legal to fit R rated tyres, early reports I read didn't mention it only applied to certain speed ratings. Info here.

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[JeanLuc]

Lenny, you prompted me to do some research and I discovered the same as you. It relates to the tyre's maximum speed rating which, if using winter tyres, must not be lower than the vehicle's maximum speed.
Phew!

 

[Jac Sprat]

So is everyone agreed with Lenny that these tyres will do me summer in Italy and winter snow? And are not only legal but effective for snow and ice:
@lennyhb says 'If you only want one set of tyres and are traveling all over Europe M&S 4 season tyres are your best option.'

 

[jonandshell]

Plenty of snowflake marked all season tyres about.
We have Yokohama All Season tyres on ours for year-round use. Wear is quite acceptable for motorhome milages. They will be ready for replacement at around the magic 5 year point.
Don't go without a snowflake for Germany, Austria and Switzerland. The French don't care as long as you have chains.
You should carry chains in any case. Even winter tyres cannot cope with all snow conditions.

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[jonandshell]

Broken Link Removed

 

[JeanLuc]

I think a good all-season tyre will suit you well. I just decided to go the 'whole hog' and fit winter tyres, having first consulted the Continental technical team who advised that they would be fine for year-round use.

 

[knokinonabit]

This thread is very interesting as I was contemplating switching to winter or M&S tyres due to the poor front wheel drive grip of our MH.

I have a question for the knowledgeable Funsters.
Initially I only want to change the front two tyres as they are down to barely legal, whereas the rear four have lots of life left in them.
Prudent (tight) Yorkshireman.
Eventually I would end up with all six on the same tyre.

Is this legal ?

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[jonandshell]

This thread is very interesting as I was contemplating switching to winter or M&S tyres due to the poor front wheel drive grip of our MH.

I have a question for the knowledgeable Funsters.
Initially I only want to change the front two tyres as they are down to barely legal, whereas the rear four have lots of life left in them.
Prudent (tight) Yorkshireman.
Eventually I would end up with all six on the same tyre.

Is this legal ?

Yes!

However, it is industry best practice to put new tyres on the rear of a vehicle first. This is to help prevent oversteer if you corner too hard. -Killjoys!
Apparently understeer is preferable to oversteer unless you are The Stig!
On a Moho or any commercial vehicle, it doesn't really matter. You won't be driving like a nutter and the weight of the vehicle prevents aquaplaning.

 

[JeanLuc]

It is not recommended as the grip performance will be different.
Winter tyres on the front and summer (standard) tyres on the back is a very bad idea for low temperature conditions (or even worse in snow). The winter tyres are designed to have much greater grip at low temperatures and the effect would be to promote oversteer since the front end will 'hold-on' and the rear will break-away and cause you to spin. There is a graphic video showing this effect - I think it was posted on Fun a while ago, otherwise search on YouTube.

 

[knokinonabit]

Yes!

However, it is industry best practice to put new tyres on the rear of a vehicle first. This is to help prevent oversteer if you corner too hard. -Killjoys!
Apparently understeer is preferable to oversteer unless you are The Stig!
On a Moho or any commercial vehicle, it doesn't really matter. You won't be driving like a nutter and the weight of the vehicle prevents aquaplaning.

With front wheel drive I wouldn't have thought that would be the case as the rear wheels aren't pushing.
But thank you for the info.

It is not recommended as the grip performance will be different.
Winter tyres on the front and summer (standard) tyres on the back is a very bad idea for low temperature conditions (or even worse in snow). The winter tyres are designed to have much greater grip at low temperatures and the effect would be to promote oversteer since the front end will 'hold-on' and the rear will break-away and cause you to spin. There is a graphic video showing this effect - I think it was posted on Fun a while ago, otherwise search on YouTube.

Something along the lines of what I was afraid of.
I have it in my head that the ABS would get all confused and lock the rear wheels etc.
Thank you for your input.


.

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[JeanLuc]

I have just found the video - have a look:

 

[Chockswahay]

Snow flake is not mandatory whereas M+S is (in countries that require 'winter tyres).

Best grip tyres on the back......... Period!

 

[knokinonabit]

Best grip tyres on the back......... Period!

After just watching the video that JeanLuc posted I would have to disagree with that.
The Merc at the end of the video with winter tyres only on the rear was all over the place.

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