Aires Petition UK (1 Viewer)

[Cat53]

Hubby sent me this link to a petition to get councils to provide Aires in the UK

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[irnbru]

Don't think its very well written.

 

[paulmold]

It got a mention in new MMM mag that came through the letterbox today.

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[MR. FUSION]

Cash strapped councils just don't have the manpower & money to regularly extract the consequent piss takers from aires. like the guy who spent months camped up on Ayr sea front on his blue badge and of course travellers.

And besides which does'nt every council have a campsite owner on it ???

Anyway signed it

 

[Deleted member 29692]

The same as all the others, it's a complete waste of time. Nobody is ever going to force councils to spend council tax payers money on the off chance that a small minority of people might visit their area. The idea that they should be compelled is ridiculous. I know I would be pissed off if the local council here spent money on something like that without clear, documented evidence that it would be at least self financing and also generate significant revenue for the local economy.


I thought it was about time for another aires thread. We haven't had one this week.

 

[Jaws]

Cash strapped councils just don't have the manpower & money to regularly extract the consequent piss takers from aires. like the guy who spent months camped up on Ayr sea front on his blue badge and of course travellers.

And besides which does'nt every council have a campsite owner on it ???

Anyway signed it

And yet they have the man power to set up dedicated sites ( similar in many ways to aires ) for travelers.. at least they have done in this area..
And guess what.. The travelers rarely use the sites, and when they do they refuse to pay a penny and always leave a total mess when they leave.

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[magicsurfbus]

I'd query the need to state a 24 hour limit but I've signed it anyway. It'll be interesting to see what the level of response is, given that DVLA recorded over 200,000 UK registered Motor Caravans in 2012.

For comparison over 350,000 were registered in France last year.

 

[nelly]

They have aires in Northern Ireland so not all UK is without them

 

[MR. FUSION]

And yet they have the man power to set up dedicated sites ( similar in many ways to aires ) for travelers.. at least they have done in this area..
And guess what.. The travelers rarely use the sites, and when they do they refuse to pay a penny and always leave a total mess when they leave.

Isn't there is a legal obligation to do so ?

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[Don Quixote]

Some reading:
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[Badknee]

I'm not bothered about having loads of facilities just a big enough space to park our MoHo for 24 hrs. Hawick has the right attitude, room for six vans, 24hr max and toilets too.

 

[chaser]

Strange one this, when I go to the link it says , you have already signed, but I definitely havnt, and if I go to the sign thingy it lets me go to sign again.

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[parknride]

Just signed, but there's only 2,449 signatures.
It did come up "you have already signed" I hadn't, but did anyway.

 

[Jaws]

Isn't there is a legal obligation to do so ?

And there is a legal obligation to PAY to use the facility and to CLEAR up all the crap which last time included a pile of human excrement !!
So why are the rules not enforced ?
Welllllll.. all the 'rules that are ignored and should be enforced by either the council or the council with police and or court officials in attendence ..
In the case of one of the one lot, I quote .
We are sorry but we have not received training in this area.
And the other bunch .. We cannot do anything as we cannot proceed without a full risk assessment being carried out

I am sure you can work out which
said what

Now then.. imagine what would happen if you were a full timer and pulled on to a travelers site.. which you are legitimately allowed to do.. and pulled the same stunts ? Methinks you would proly end up in deep doodoo.
On the other hand, if said site was used an an aires type place, the council would be paid for its use and I doubt very much there would be any mess to clear up one month to the next

 

[GJH]

Strange one this, when I go to the link it says , you have already signed, but I definitely havnt, and if I go to the sign thingy it lets me go to sign again.

It did for me as well and I certainly haven't signed it before as it is a complete and utter waste of time.

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[GJH]

And there is a legal obligation to PAY to use the facility and to CLEAR up all the crap which last time included a pile of human excrement !!
So why are the rules not enforced ?
Welllllll.. all the 'rules that are ignored and should be enforced by either the council or the council with police and or court officials in attendence ..
In the case of one of the one lot, I quote .
We are sorry but we have not received training in this area.
And the other bunch .. We cannot do anything as we cannot proceed without a full risk assessment being carried out

I am sure you can work out which
said what

Now then.. imagine what would happen if you were a full timer and pulled on to a travelers site.. which you are legitimately allowed to do.. and pulled the same stunts ? Methinks you would proly end up in deep doodoo.
On the other hand, if said site was used an an aires type place, the council would be paid for its use and I doubt very much there would be any mess to clear up one month to the next

As with so many other matters to do with "travellers" the law is cr*p and almost impossible for councils and the police to enforce.

 

[Gorse Hill]

It did for me as well and I certainly haven't signed it before as it is a complete and utter waste of time.

Optimistic as usual then Graham

 

[GJH]

Optimistic as usual then Graham

It's pointless to be optimistic about something which wouldn't even have a hope of succeeding even if it had the genuine support of its signatories.

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[Khizzie]

Don't see the problem of setting up Aires in the larger towns . Most have a park and ride system set up with an attendant..ok there maybe a height barrier,but with the attendants available to raise it there should be no extra cost to the council...even unattended ones could have a pay system to allow you in...IMO.

 

[chaser]

Not very often, but this time I fully agree with graham, it's just not going to happen, Aires are a European thing , more ground , better laws as to, "travelers", and far more motorhomes compared to other vehicles ,the whole countries are geared up for it .
As long as councils can point to CS/cls, and the numerous campsites, they are quite happy to be building houses or industrial estates on any spare ground they won't be spending thousands on something that won't make a penny.

 

[Deleted member 29692]

even unattended ones could have a pay system to allow you in...IMO.

They could. That's the system in place at Canterbury.

But. There's always a but.

In each and every case before paying to install such a system and doing the other alterations needed the local authority in question will require accurate data about demand and projections as to how many units will pay to use the facility in the first month, quarter, year and so on. They will have a target time period to recoup their investment.

Who is going to provide them with that data? Remember it will be different for every location.

Vague pronouncements on an internet site that "oh, loads of people will use it" and stories about France aren't going to cut it I'm afraid.

Canterbury had the identified demand of being enroute to two major channel crossing points which obviously most other locations won't have.

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[chaser]

They could. That's the system in place at Canterbury.

But. There's always a but.

In each and every case before paying to install such a system and doing the other alterations needed the local authority in question will require accurate data about demand and projections as to how many units will pay to use the facility in the first month, quarter, year and so on. They will have a target time period to recoup their investment.

Who is going to provide them with that data? Remember it will be different for every location.

Vague pronouncements on an internet site that "oh, loads of people will use it" and stories about France aren't going to cut it I'm afraid.

Canterbury had the identified demand of being enroute to two major channel crossing points which obviously most other locations won't have.

Nothing wrong with park and ride, as long as there are spaces for motorhomes, you can get into the towns, and they can be used for all vehicles but overnighting just for motorhomes is a different kettle of fish altogether.

 

[Deleted member 29692]

Nothing wrong with park and ride, as long as there are spaces for motorhomes, you can get into the towns, and they can be used for all vehicles but overnighting just for motorhomes is a different kettle of fish altogether.

I agree. My post was answering Roy's comment about installing pay barriers.

 

[chaser]

I agree. My post was answering Roy's comment about installing pay barriers.

I have seen quite a few complaints about the parking in Whitby on here but a couple of months ago we were there and used their park and ride and thought it brilliant, easy to get to plenty motorhome spaces, and the fare to the centre of town was less than you have to pay for parking in some places, now, a petition for more of these would hold more water, the council get their money back the people have cheap parking , keeps traffic out of town, obviously won't be barriers else the bus's wouldn't get in, everyone's a winner

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[Deleted member 29692]

obviously won't be barriers else the bus's wouldn't get in, everyone's a winner

If you look at Canterbury there are barriers there that everyone, cars and motorhomes have to go through. The buses don't go that far into the car park though so aren't affected. They also serve to keep the undesirables out as once you are through the entry barrier you aren't getting out again unless you pay.

Also this thread is specifically about aires and overnighting, not day time parking which is a completely different matter and not an issue at all in most places.

 

[chaser]

If you look at Canterbury there are barriers there that everyone, cars and motorhomes have to go through. The buses don't go that far into the car park though so aren't affected. They also serve to keep the undesirables out as once you are through the entry barrier you aren't getting out again unless you pay.

Also this thread is specifically about aires and overnighting, not day time parking which is a completely different matter and not an issue at all in most places.

I know that but as there isn't a hope in hell of getting Aires , these have got to be the next best thing.

 

[GJH]

Don't see the problem of setting up Aires in the larger towns . Most have a park and ride system set up with an attendant..ok there maybe a height barrier,but with the attendants available to raise it there should be no extra cost to the council...even unattended ones could have a pay system to allow you in...IMO.

I haven't checked the figures lately but I don't think it is correct to say that most large towns have a park & ride system. Where they are in place there might be an opportunity to allow overnighting but it all depends, as Nick said, on making a sound case. I've suggested to several councils that they should do it and some are considering it but until the evidence is there to make a case for spending the money then they wont take the step.

As regards the "problem" of setting up aires, the factors against are varied between different places. As I have done before, I invite anyone who supports the idea of aires to identify a piece of land in their home town and approach the owner about creating an aire. Easier, legally, if the land is owned by the council but not impossible for private owners.

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[MR. FUSION]

I read some of the govts responses to these petitions, talk about banging your head against a brick wall......The thinnest veneer of democracy is operating here!!!

 

[GJH]

I read some of the govts responses to these petitions, talk about banging your head against a brick wall......The thinnest veneer of democracy is operating here!!!

I didn't think any of the aires petitions had reached the necessary threshold for a government response. Do you have any links?

 

[MR. FUSION]

I didn't think any of the aires petitions had reached the necessary threshold for a government response. Do you have any links?

I was looking at the ones that had reached the threshold for a response, not the Aires ones, sorry for the confusion. On the governments petition website there is a link to their responses.

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