Underslung Gas (1 Viewer)

Chris Jackson

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We are blowing the kids inheritance and have plumped for a new Bessacar 424 which is on order. No van is perfect so we are looking at a few extras to set it up how we would like. The gas locker is a bit small so we are contemplating going with a Chassis mounted LPG tank (also gets us better outside locker space). Has anyone fitted one, if so are there are any installers who are suitably gas qualified in the midlands? Are there any pitfalls to avoid in our search. Thanks in anticipation.
Chris
 
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Chris Jackson

Chris Jackson

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Hi Dave - prompt reply - very impressed. I believe it is the standard Fiat.

Chris

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Oct 20, 2014
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Underslung Gas in Belper

I hope you can get a doctor's appointment soon, it sounds painful. :whistle: :whistle:
 

dave newell

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Assuming standard Fiat chassis then yes underslung should be possible, usually mounted just behind the silencer but Swift/Bessacar have a habit of putting water tanks there so we really need to know the layout underneath.

D.
 
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if the van is long term definitley go for underslung if possible if your the type to change regular i would have refillable bottles fitted which can be swopped to the next van but you dont gain the locker space
 

Glandwr

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Underslung another vote for as big as possible too. While about it is it possible to have a BBQ point put in? This makes it more convienent if you go to somewhere that does not have autogas (Morocco, parts of Spainand parts of Eastern Europe) you can always reverse feed in the gas (with a suitable regulator) from a bottle bought locally if you run out.

Dick
 

Bertie Bassett

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Underslung another vote for as big as possible too. While about it is it possible to have a BBQ point put in? This makes it more convienent if you go to somewhere that does not have autogas (Morocco, parts of Spainand parts of Eastern Europe) you can always reverse feed in the gas (with a suitable regulator) from a bottle bought locally if you run out.

Dick

With this lead from gaslow you can feed any European bottle (with the right adaptor) through the original gas filler and the regulator once the underslung is empty.
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Chris Jackson

Chris Jackson

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Useful ideas coming in. Thanks very much. Any more experience or recommendations most welcome.

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dave newell

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Purely for clarity and balance not all professionally tanks are "crap" jobs, here's one I prepared earlier:
DSC07865.JPG


D.
 

Minxy

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According to the blurb the payload is only 421kg so I'd suggest waiting until you get it and then filling the fuel tank, and an empty water tank, then putting all your kit in and taking it to a weighbridge, this will tell you your travelling weight without water as this can be left empty if necessary to reduce the weight you're carrying, once you've done this you'll know your true payload and from that can decide whether or not you've got the spare capacity for an underslung tank and also being able to then use the extra locker space you've created.

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Minxy

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Just to add, looking at some more spec it appears that the gas locker is supposed to take 2 x 6kg refillable bottles (same size as 2 x 7kg Calor) which equates to roughly 23 litres (give or take) of LPG, you might be able to get an underslung tank fitted that takes more possibly 25 litres, but unlikely to be much larger and the cost will be a LOT more. The other option would be to see if you can get a single 11kg refillable in there which will give you around 21 litres of LPG and leave you some storage space at the side - our PVC's gas locker is only supposed to take 2 of the smaller cylinders but I managed to 'persuade' my 11kg refillable to go in! If you do this though please ensure that you keep the gas drop out vents clear AND a way of any gas escaping form the top of the bottle to be able to get down to them ... my locker looks in this photo as I'd been snuffling around in it for something but it is normally much tidier!

16 - Gas locker.JPG
 

Techno

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Personally I chose to install a full frontal stone barrier rather than cover my kit in that black messy stuff. Stako tank paint is often scratched and chipped on delivery but I gave mine four extra coats.
I also used a pre regulator filter.
CA_01261517152347-XL.jpg
 

dave newell

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Easy to do for yourself Andy but when doing it for a paying customer time is an issue so no extra coats of paint prior to installation and that "black messy stuff" is rubberised stonechip paint, not just underseal so provides a good barrier to the plastic coating getting chipped. Our supplier (Autogas 2000) ships the tanks well wrapped and protected against paint/coating damage. I also fit a metal heatshield/physical barrier in front of the tank which is right behind the exhaust silencer (hence the heatshield).

D.

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Seajay

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Hi, has anyone had any experience in fitting an external LPG tank to a 1996 single rear wheel drive transit?......The van is a CL Meridien and as getting the spare wheel out from under the rear just behind the back axle was a sh*t job I now carry it on the front, so without the spare being there it means hopefully there is space for a big LPG tank thereby releasing a good sized side locker......I have asked around Cornwall if there is anybody willing to do the job,but as yet no takers!.....Chris.
 

Minxy

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Hi, has anyone had any experience in fitting an external LPG tank to a 1996 single rear wheel drive transit?......The van is a CL Meridien and as getting the spare wheel out from under the rear just behind the back axle was a sh*t job I now carry it on the front, so without the spare being there it means hopefully there is space for a big LPG tank thereby releasing a good sized side locker......I have asked around Cornwall if there is anybody willing to do the job,but as yet no takers!.....Chris.
When they install LPG for car propulsion they sometimes put a doughnut shaped tank in the spare wheel space (I assume they then carry the puncture repair stuff instead of the wheel)) so it might be an idea to contact someone who does car LPG propulsion installs as well as MH LPG tank installs as they'll have the knowledge of both systems and be able to advise if this could be done, or whether you'll need to remove the spare wheel holder completely and just have a standard 'sausage' tank installed. Be aware that the cost of getting a tank installed isn't cheap though, probably twice the cost of cylinders.
 

Seajay

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Hi, The only thing that holds the spare on a Transit, certainly of that year, is a little winch and wire cable, which due to being in all the sh*t and weather being thrown up under a wagon always seizes up, so when needed is unavailable without bolt croppers!.....a Ford cockup design!.......I spent over £500 for 2 Gaslow bottles for my last van and did the fitting myself. I have looked at various sites & it would seem I can buy a good sized cylindrical LPG tank for less, but fitting under the chassis is going to be more of a job than the Gaslow one.....I have been told that LPG systems for an engine takes liquid from the bottom of the tank whereas for providing gas for cooking etc it comes as a gas from the top of the tank?........ps, my spare now sits firmly on the bull bar where I can get at it without grovelling under the back!!...(y)

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Minxy

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Hi, The only thing that holds the spare on a Transit, certainly of that year, is a little winch and wire cable, which due to being in all the sh*t and weather being thrown up under a wagon always seizes up, so when needed is unavailable without bolt croppers!.....a Ford cockup design!.......I spent over £500 for 2 Gaslow bottles for my last van and did the fitting myself. I have looked at various sites & it would seem I can buy a good sized cylindrical LPG tank for less, but fitting under the chassis is going to be more of a job than the Gaslow one.....I have been told that LPG systems for an engine takes liquid from the bottom of the tank whereas for providing gas for cooking etc it comes as a gas from the top of the tank?........ps, my spare now sits firmly on the bull bar where I can get at it without grovelling under the back!!...(y)
You are right that the 2 systems draw the gas/liquid differently, hence my suggestion to see a place that does both systems to advise on the suitability of the doughnut liquid draw off tank as a gas draw off one.

I'm now wondering why you didn't simply keep your existing Gaslow system and install it in your current one?
 

dave newell

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Nice Job Dave but I notice it is strapped in rather than a cradle, I understood straps alone were no longer legal, have I been misinformed.
To OP do check your payload before having it fitted.

Hi Roger, there are no legal requirements in fact. But they are not "straps" as such, they are in fact 4mm thick rolled flat bar shaped to go round the tank and are part of brackets fabricated by Autogas 2000 to mount tanks on Ducato/Boxer/Relay chassis, the brackets are bolted through the chassis cross members in front and behind the tank with 10mm bolts in crush tubes. This mounting is in full accord with the NCC/LPGUK code of practice.

D.

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Dipstick

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https://www.dropbox.com/s/uicmb1flsl562se/stako tank.jpg?dl=0
stako%20tank.jpg
I see lots of Stako underslung tanks with the valve plate installed at 90 degrees so it is effectively vertical. Having studied the drawings showing the internal arrangement of the vapour draw off pipe, level sensor and 80% shut off valve (see drawing) it seems to me that the valve plate should be rotated downwards by 38 degrees in order for the draw off pipe to be vertical and therefore have the least chance of liquid gas getting into it when the tank is full and under cornering/sideways inertia/acceleration/deceleration. And also for the level sensor and shut off valve to function satisfactorily and accurately.

I will be pleased for someone to tell me I am talking nonsense !
 
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Seajay

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Hi Mel,.....Evidently the doughnut shaped tanks are designed to replace a spare wheel, hence the shape.....I almost had one fitted in my petrol engined Renault but would have had to clock up a load of miles before it paid for itself!.....The reason for not keeping the Gaslow bottles was that this wagon is smaller than my last one (so I can store on my drive instead of storage costs) and that being said is that this wagon's gas locker is needed for a generator plus odds 'n sods.
 

Techno

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I see lots of Stako underslung tanks with the valve plate installed at 90 degrees so it is effectively vertical. Having studied the drawings showing the internal arrangement of the vapour draw off pipe, level sensor and 80% shut off valve (see drawing) it seems to me that the valve plate should be rotated downwards by 38 degrees in order for the draw off pipe to be vertical and therefore have the least chance of liquid gas getting into it when the tank is full and under cornering/sideways inertia. And also for the level sensor and shut off valve to function satisfactorily and accurately.

I will be pleased for someone to tell me I am talking nonsense !
Yes to ensure correct fill level the tank air box must point to about 20 past the hour when the van is on level ground. The worst that can happen is the 80% shut off will shut off sooner.

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PeteH

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Hi

Having had experience of both. here are my thoughts. Fixed tanks have the advantage of being refillable, often at "gas" Stations (Excuse the yank jargon!!) , but you will pay road fuel prices (tax/Vat)@ most outlets, (not all) I used to get domestic rate at flogas but they have now stopped that and it`s road fuel prices. Gas "bottles", Have some advantage, you only pay domestic gas prices, They can be exchanged (in the UK) quite readily and if you run 2 then one on one reserve means less chance of freezing when you run out!!. I experienced that once at a winter caravan rally! and SWMBO was NOT amused!!.

If you are desperate for Locker space. I cannot see you gaining a huge amount? in this manner. Would you not be better with refillable Bottle(s)? and look elsewhere for storage?. Finally as one poster has already said best weigh the Van first as the payload will almost certainly be compromised by a fixed installation IMHO. 120l of LPG is not an issue on an R-V weighing 9 tonne. But will be a bigger issue on a sub 3tonne Euro machine?

Pete
 

Techno

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54.7 ppl at ASDA sod the VAT

domestic fuel accounts are often dearer than that despite only 5%
 

PeteH

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Talking LPG cost. Some nearly 20 years ago, a gent of my acquaintance, who shall remain nameless for obvious reasons. Had himself a Winnebago, Big 36ft 7.4 litre petrol job, which he had converted to run on LPG. The same gent also owned and ran a large Nursery/Market Garden. Who`s heating was LPG. supplied at commercial prices and with the benefit of being VAT registered etc;. Subsequently he purchased two fork lift trucks, LPG powered, for use in the Greenhouses, AND had installed a pump for replenishing said FLT`s. (And the cheapest road fuel for his Winnebago!!!! hence the anonymity)!!!.

In the USA currently LPG is about the same price as "gas" nudging $1.8ish per (US) gallon regardless of usage.

Pete

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