Winterising ?

Discussion in 'Motorhome Chat' started by Nemo, Jun 10, 2013.

  1. Nemo

    Nemo Read Only Funster

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    We intend to go snowboarding in French Alps which will reach temp. of around minus 25c.
    Has anyone got any information on 12v trace heating or does anyone know where I maybe able to buy it ??
     
  2. BgClick

    BgClick Funster

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    What is trace heating? Maybe a wire element in the tanks?
     
  3. pappajohn

    pappajohn Funster Life Member

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    Haganap (Paul) is the man to ask about alpine insulation.

    The nutter goes ski-ing in all kinds of temperatures :Laughing:
     
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  4. Ed Excel

    Ed Excel Funster

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  5. Nemo

    Nemo Read Only Funster

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  6. Whatton

    Whatton Read Only Funster

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  7. haganap

    haganap Funster Life Member

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    Hi Daryl,

    You can fit it and run it via an inverter if you freeze up as the heat will defrost meaning that you don't actually need to run the inverter constantly.

    However, TBH, I found that the adjustments I made to my pipe work by using good quality pipe lagging, then having it covered to prevent it from getting wet and holding cold water, removing the waste traps and moving some exposed pipe indoors worked better and negated the use of the heated coil pipe. Any exposed pipe work I could not cover, I used expanding foam on.

    I also added a tank heater to the inside tank which has proved invaluable as was the new over front screen we purchased which covers the whole cab area much the same way as exterior blinds do. I infact left exterior blinds on as well.

    There's loads more I done, but you got plenty of time. :Wink:
     
  8. jonandshell

    jonandshell Funster

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    Hi Nemo

    You are quite local to us.
    If you want to meet up and discuss how the cold might affect your van, you are more than welcome.:thumb:
     
  9. Rapide561

    Rapide561 Read Only Funster

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    Winter

    Hi

    We have 12v tank heaters in the fresh and waste tanks but it is better to leave the waste water drain tap open, so the water runs out without freezing anyway. We found the water could freeze in the drain pipe itself rather than the tank!

    Russell
     
  10. Ed Excel

    Ed Excel Funster

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    Good point, but it would only be an issue if the numbers were different eg if the heater was designed for 230V ac. That being the case you'd get about 0.1 W out of a 12W ac unit run at 12V dc. As long as the RMS value of ac voltage and the dc voltage are the same you should get the same heat output.
     
  11. jonandshell

    jonandshell Funster

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    Haggers has given good advice.

    You need to look carefully at preventing loss of heat before throwing money at extra heating for pipes and tanks.
    The key to success in prepping a motorhome for extreme winter use is being efficient with your power management primarily. There is no point in heating every part of your water system to make up for a design which is unfit for winter use in the first place.
    Your power consumption will be massive and you will spend more time worrying about battery charging than enjoying yourself on the slopes.
    You don't need to worry about heating your grey tank. A good size discharge valve and bucket is the low-energy solution that little problem!
    You don't mention which MH you have. The positioning of the key elements of your water system will dictate what measures, if any, you will have to take to ensure you don't freeze up.
    A better method of preventing the frosting of internal components would be to direct blown-air ducting close to those components. For instance, in our Chausson, EVERY water pipe is followed by hot air ducting. Haggers has modded his van with extra ducting branches to help in this way.
    There are lots of ways to supplement the manufacturer's original insulation. Silver screens are one, a complete cab cover is even better! We supplement our cab insulation screens with an internal curtain made from 2 sleeping bags. The cab area is much warmer as a result. We also place bubble-wrap between the rooflights and their blinds to help prevent heat loss.
    All these measures will not only keep you warmer, but also your water system. You will also find it helpful in reducing your gas consumption.
    Do you intend using aires or campsites for your adventure?
    If aires, you will probably be away from EHU. You WILL need quality batteries and a supplementary battery charging system to keep your heating going. You can't rely on Solar alone, the winter sun is low and hours of daylight limited by mountains getting in the way! Gennies are popular, but you can't run it 24/7! There are other gadgets available which better utilise your engine's alternator for efficient charging.

    Anyway, hope this all helps!:BigGrin:

    Any other questions, fire away! There are lots of seasoned skiing Funsters about!:thumb:
     
  12. Nemo

    Nemo Read Only Funster

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    Dad reckons it'll work cos basically it is just a resister :Smile:



    Cheers Paul, not sure what way to go yet, think I need to climb about underNeath first before purchasing trace heating as its well expensive.
    Did you box pipes in order to use expanding foam ?





    We're off on hols Sunday but would love to meet and pick your brains upon my return.
     
  13. jonandshell

    jonandshell Funster

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    Definitely PM us when you get back, we could have a night out and a drink at Little Lodge Farm at Santon Downham!:BigGrin:

    Cheers!

    -Jon
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2013
  14. Nemo

    Nemo Read Only Funster

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    Cheers Russell, where do I purchase 12v tank heaters ?.
    Think there definitely worth investing in.
     
  15. Nemo

    Nemo Read Only Funster

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    Will do, cheers guys look forward to it, have a good'n :Cool:
     
  16. Nemo

    Nemo Read Only Funster

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    Wow, I guess you guys done it before, love the bubble rap idea !!:BigGrin:

    I have a 2000 w reg bessacarr on a fiat Ducato cab
     
  17. Jaws

    Jaws Funster Life Member

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    Yesssss... ok, so given the rms of 12v AC is 16.9 v it would be reasonable to expect performance in the 8w area.. quite sufficient to keep things moving :thumb:
     
  18. jonandshell

    jonandshell Funster

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    Although external water tanks aren't the best start, Ash has a nifty set of snow skirts which help with insulating his underslung tank on his Bessy.
    I believe he uses a tank heater with a genny for battery charging and he gets on quite well when the going gets chilly!:thumb:

    He might be along at some point to offer some advice.
     
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  19. Jaws

    Jaws Funster Life Member

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    Sorry.. this is wrong.. ( I was half asleep when I posted it ! )

    The peak to peak is 16.9 v IF the stated use voltage is quoted in RMS ( which it normally is )

    Therefore, in theory, the results from using DC instead of AC should be the same.. Not as if there is a Q factor involved at 50 hertz :Wink:
     

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