Speed limits (1 Viewer)

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2657

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I dont believe that's right John. . That would apply if the vehicle was a goods vehicle ..and certain mh''s may fall within that definition depending on what they carry and their use ,but if they are registeed as a motor caravan the oly criteria that governs their max allowed speed is seating capacity which doesn't usually come into the equation and their unladen weight..
Andy..

I thought motorhomes over 3500k were registered as Private HGV not motor caravan!
 

andy63

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I thought motorhomes over 3500k were registered as Private HGV not motor caravan!
I don't know but can't see why that would be the case..
There are loads of vehicles in that bracket ie over 3.5T used as motorhomes so someone will tell us what their V5 shows..
I'm sure I was reading info on a vosa site referring to the subject and the phrase was regardless of weight so I assumed a motorcara van could be over 3.5 T and registered as such..
Andy.

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2657

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I don't know but can't see why that would be the case..
There are loads of vehicles in that bracket ie over 3.5T used as motorhomes so someone will tell us what their V5 shows..
I'm sure I was reading info on a vosa site referring to the subject and the phrase was regardless of weight so I assumed a motorcara van could be over 3.5 T and registered as such..
Andy.

I'm not sure but from reading posts on this and other forums, the VED is less for a motorhome over 3500 as it is then a Private HGV so my reasoning would be that speeding and other regulations would follow suit.
 

pappajohn

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well i say 30mph . on duall drive at 40mph . on motorways still drive slowly 50mph .
enjoy the drive .
So your the bast@rd I keep getting stuck behind. :whistle:

Seriously....too slow is just as dangerous as too fast.....and 30mph in a national speed limit area is too slow.
It causes other drivers frustration and to take unnecessary risks to overtake
 

vwalan

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So your the bast@rd I keep getting stuck behind. :whistle:

Seriously....too slow is just as dangerous as too fast.....and 30mph in a national speed limit area is too slow.
It causes other drivers frustration and to take unnecessary risks to overtake
oh well better keep doing it till they change the law.we get extra points if we can build up a big line of vehicles . then pull over and wave at them . its all in the name of fun.
 
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2657

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They are, but its for revenue purposes only.
They are, or should be, registered as a motor caravan on the V5 under the heading Body type.

So which speed limits apply if for one set of rules it is a motor caravan and for another it is a Private HGV?
 

vwalan

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just go slow wind the go faster boys and girls up.
after all its legal. if i get someone pushing me i pull out go slower i dont break the law . its the faster drivers that are dangerous .

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andy63

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I'm not sure but from reading posts on this and other forums, the VED is less for a motorhome over 3500 as it is then a Private HGV so my reasoning would be that speeding and other regulations would follow suit.
if the body type is motor caravan and the unladen weight is not over 3050kg then regardless of taxation class i.e. PLG or PHG then i assumed the speed limits as stated would apply.. thats just the way I've read it but have no experience of such a case...
if i decided to up rate my payload by up plating the gross weight would increase to over 3.5t.. but my original unladen weight wouldn't change and i thought my max speed limits as they apply now would remain the same even though the taxation class would change .
if i get the time ill read some more.. but hope someone else who is in this situation can clarify the point..
andy.
 

pappajohn

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So which speed limits apply if for one set of rules it is a motor caravan and for another it is a Private HGV?
Could be an on going debate.
You could ring DVLA and get a definitive answer.....then ring again, talk to a different phone jockey and get a different definitive answer.
DVLA/DVSA will only quote what you can read on the website so you are no wiser.
The only way to get a proper answer would be to challenge a ticket in the crown or high court saying it IS less than 3005kg unloaded.
But it would never get out of the magistrates court so that won't work.
 

pappajohn

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just go slow wind the go faster boys and girls up.
That really is the shittest attitude its possible to have Alan.
A total lack of consideration for other road users.
Really not impressed.
I hope I don't have the misfortune of getting stuck behind you.

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vwalan

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i dont care either way. hee hee.
but then i avoid tolls . motor ways and dual carriageways .
on smaller roads its normal to drive slower. come to Cornwall and try to drive fast on local roads .
 

pappajohn

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This seems pretty straight forward,

https://www.gov.uk/speed-limits

Martin
So I guess that brings us back to unloaded weigh, and higher speed limits, not gross weight.

Motorhomes
Motorhomes or motor caravans are classed as goods vehicles if they:

  • carry goods for exhibition and sale
  • are used as a workshop
  • are used for storage

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funflair

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So I guess that brings us back to unloaded weigh, and higher speed limits, not gross weight.
Well our Unladen weight is more than 3050 which ever way you look at it and we don't carry good so pretty straight forward.

And it won't do 70 mph, or if it will I wouldn't want to be in it at the time.

Martin
 

vwalan

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Well our Unladen weight is more than 3050 which ever way you look at it and we don't carry good so pretty straight forward.

And it won't do 70 mph, or if it will I wouldn't want to be in it at the time.

Martin
but you do carry goods or burden . the goods are your goods . they may not be for sale or hire but they are goods . food , clothes . etc . are goods or burden.
this was defined way back in 91 when i first got involved in transport law.
 

Spud

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Hey pappajohn, so a Motorhome is... "A goods vehicle if used for storage."

Dont we all store stuff in our MH's!

This could soon become a truckers forum.

10-4 big buddies.

Spud

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funflair

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but you do carry goods or burden . the goods are your goods . they may not be for sale or hire but they are goods . food , clothes . etc . are goods or burden.
this was defined way back in 91 when i first got involved in transport law.

Not sure about "used for storage" but the first two are OK.


Quoted from .gov.uk

Motorhomes or motor caravans are classed as goods vehicles if they:

  • carry goods for exhibition and sale
  • are used as a workshop
  • are used for storage
 

vwalan

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if you except it the rules follow a patern . if youdont you will be forever angry.
i,m an ex trucker .
i tried for ages to define it in my head and questioned authority .
i decided what we carry in a motor home is a burden . call it storage if you want.
but if you dont are you prepared to stand in a court and argue ?
i am one of those people but sometimes losing . wins nothing .
if authority follows the rules , so must we. if they dont , then we can win.
i watch the watchers , its a game .
 

vwalan

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That really is the shittest attitude its possible to have Alan.
A total lack of consideration for other road users.
Really not impressed.
I hope I don't have the misfortune of getting stuck behind you.
its not my fault you didnt allow time for your journey.
but then possibly you didnt allow for accidents etc . but i could say are you annoyed really because you arent a professional driver. and cant have any knowledge of transport management.
possibly just a joy rider or boy racer. hee hee .
have fun , smile your on candid camera.

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its not my fault you didnt allow time for your journey.
but then possibly you didnt allow for accidents etc . but i could say are you annoyed really because you arent a professional driver. and cant have any knowledge of transport management.
possibly just a joy rider or boy racer. hee hee .
have fun , smile your on candid camera.
You :reel: you............... :)
 
2

2657

Deleted User
if the body type is motor caravan and the unladen weight is not over 3050kg then regardless of taxation class i.e. PLG or PHG then i assumed the speed limits as stated would apply.. thats just the way I've read it but have no experience of such a case...
if i decided to up rate my payload by up plating the gross weight would increase to over 3.5t.. but my original unladen weight wouldn't change and i thought my max speed limits as they apply now would remain the same even though the taxation class would change .
if i get the time ill read some more.. but hope someone else who is in this situation can clarify the point..
andy.

I would agree that would be the logical answer but in a piece of legislation that uses 'unladen weight' as a defining parameter, which has been dropped from practically all other legislation and is largely undefinable, I am not sure that logic applies:)
 

andy63

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I would agree that would be the logical answer but in a piece of legislation that uses 'unladen weight' as a defining parameter, which has been dropped from practically all other legislation and is largely undefinable, I am not sure that logic applies:)

And I agree with your sentiments .. but the fact remains that is still the term used to define max permissible speed limits for motorhomes as far as I know.
An eg.. on my v5 the mass in service is listed as 3069 kg..
If you look at the definitions of that term it includes an allowance for fuel and a driver..
Unladen weight as defined does not incldue those so for the
19kg the mass in service has me over the 3050kg I would argue that my unladen weight must be under 3050kg..
Andy
 

funflair

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Reading that if the taxation class is privete hgv (over 3500kg) you might also have to have a speed limiter fitted.

not what it says here once we have established that "private hgv" is not a good vehicle.

pasted from gov.uk

Speed limiters
A speed limiter must be fitted on:

  • vehicles with more than 8 passenger seats, eg buses, minibuses, coaches, stretch limousines
  • goods vehicles with a maximum laden weight of more than 3.5 tonnes
Speed limiters are designed to reduce accidents. They limit the maximum speed of a vehicle by restricting the fuel supply to the engine. Having a speed limiter may mean that your vehicle can’t reach the speed limit.

End of quote

Martin
 

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