Should we buy in the UK or France? (1 Viewer)

[Goose]

Hi, again. We have peculiar circumstances and are hoping that maybe ...just maybe... someone has similar experience or a brilliant mind and can advise.

Our situation is different to most in that as Brit/Canadians we're looking to move from Canada to France. Originall y we were going to bring an American RV over but it appears it'll be a nightmare to register in France 'cos I can't see how we can supply a Certificate of Conformity.

We now intend buying a motorhome to tour France and get a feel for whereabouts we'd like to settle. But to purchase and register a motorhome in France we'd need to first have a physical address (which would put the cart before the horse, so to speak). Is there a way we could purchase and register a motorhome in France without having a physical address?

We could, instead, purchase a LHD motorhome in the UK using our UK address (property owned together with my folks who live there). And then we could come across to France and tour as planned. But that means duplicate costs of registering in the UK and then again later in France. And it also means being restricted to less choice in LHD Euramobil, Hymer, Rapido, Pilote etc vehicles available in the UK.

Another obstacle is the conversion of our Canadian driving licences. France doesn't recognise British Columbia licences for reciprocation, but we could hand in our licences in the UK and get UK licences (and later convert to French). France recognises South African drivers' licences for reciprocation but ours have now expired since living in Canada.

So what would you do?

 

[Peter JohnsCross MH]

Buying in England should be cheaper due to Euro exchange rate, used vans should be cheaper here.

Swap your Canadian licence for English, dont know how or what weight grades you will get.

Good luck

Peter

 

[vwalan]

if you have relatives in uk then get uk licence uk insurance uk reg camper . keep it simple. you have an address in uk you dont in france. if you can get it registered in uk france should let you reg in france you do have to stir the crap they dont always want to agree with the rules of europe . many just stay with english lic .etc never change or reg their vehicles. i know some that have lived there for twenty years . cheers alan.

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[Frankia]

Can't answer all your questions but I think I may put another cat amongst the pigeons.

If you get a new licence in the UK it will presumably only be a car licence for up to 3500 kgs so will not be licensed for most Yank RV s anyway.

Is it a new 'van you are considering or a second hand - Whichever it may be a good idea to buy from France and import to the UK. - If new the VAT will be cheaper if exported to the UK - If second hand it will at least be "homologated" for France.

Whichever you decide it could be a good idea to contact Nick Legg at Bundesvan who can handle all the details including sourcing the spec you require.

See Link Removed or 'phone Telephone: +44 (0)1803 606 335.

Good luck with the move.

 

[Heyupluv]

Buying in England should be cheaper due to Euro exchange rate, used vans should be cheaper here.

Swap your Canadian licence for English, dont know how or what weight grades you will get.

Good luck

Peter

Peter
I agree with Peter buy in England.....better price and choice is better...I purchased new in France as the secondhand market is really none existent as they are used till they fall apart and are very old.............and because of the problems we had changing the reg from Uk to France,.... it was just a lot of red tape

Mel

 

[Goose]

Gosh, thanks for the replies already folks.

You might recall from my earlier post that we were going to bring an American RV across which would have been easy enough to register in the UK but very difficult to do so in France.

Peter and Mel, you are quite correct, I have noticed that UK prices for many European built motorhomes are cheaper than the same thing available in Europe. I suspect we'd only get a Class B licence on conversion, restricting us to 3500kg. Exchanging our Canadian licences would restrict us even more...to driving automatic transmission only! We have South African licences but they've expired and I don't know if the Uk licencing authorities would accept them for a swop (which would be best for us since we've driven manual transmssion most of our lives). A number of Funsters have recommended upgrading to a C1 licence which is probably what I'd do in the UK as it will presumably be easier than doing the equivalent in France.

Frankia, thank for the tip regarding Nick Legg - will investigate. Would prefer a 2nd hand motorhome to benefit from the depreciated price but won't say "no" to new if the right deal presents itself.

Alan, thanks for the advice. I find it interesting that folks continue to live in France with a UK-registered motorhome - paying UK insurance, MOT etc. I thought the French laws made that impossible?

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[hilldweller]

Often the advice is buy in Germany.

 

[vwalan]

if you are coming from canada will your moneybe in canadian?
the pound as dropped against the euro but as yours . or are you workig every thing back to pounds .

 

[Goose]

Hi Brian, I should have mentioned France/Germany in the title thread because, as you know, it's vehicles on mobile.de I've been looking at. (By the way, you cracked me up with your quip aout the Euramobil Terrestra looking like a whale ).

Regardless, it looks like we will either have to buy and register in the UK or import from Germany and register in the UK - and later (perhaps) register it in France.

Alan, our funds will be are in Canadian dollar which has appreciated fantastically against the pound since we came to Canada in 2003 but has actually worsened slightly against the Euro during that time

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[weymard]

I agree with other advices, convert your canadian license driver in UK license, buy and registered your RV in UK.
In France it will be a nightmare to register an American RV imported from USA or CANADA.
With your UK license driver you can convert it easily in French license driver, but I do not know if you keep your C , in Theory you can keep all attributes of your license driver , but each "préfecture" has his "politic" !

 

[madbluemad]

I think as others have said, make your trading base England and work everything from here.

I dont know why you asssume that you will have trouble finding a left hand drive in the uk. There are plenty of LHD ARV'S for sale here.

Jim

 

[hilldweller]

Regardless, it looks like we will either have to buy and register in the UK or import from Germany and register in the UK - and later (perhaps) register it in France.

Seems odd to me. It's easier to get from France to Germany. Have you investigated keeping it German registered, then it's just one move.

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[stagman]

[

We could, instead, purchase a LHD motorhome in the UK using our UK address (property owned together with my folks who live there). And then we could come across to France and tour as planned. But that means duplicate costs of registering in the UK and then again later in France. And it also means being restricted to less choice in LHD Euramobil, Hymer, Rapido, Pilote etc vehicles available in the UK.

I think you would find a left hooker a lot cheaper in the UK than in France .I have noticed LHD Hymers falling at least £5k short of the RHD .Also on our last trip to France noticed an old Talbot base motorhome square cab type similar to the old Elddis etc at the side of the road for sale no make on it , and they were asking 20,000 euros .Don't know if that makes sense:thumb:

 

[lebesset]

get a uk licence ....if you hold a EU licence there will be no need to obtain a french licence when you move there ; how old are you ? affects things a lot ; do your canadian licences actually say automatic only?

LHD motorhomes fetch less money in the UK than RHD , and you will find the prices as low as , maybe lower , than in france /germany due to the current rate of exchange

I think it is cheap to register a vehicle in the UK [ anybody?] , but is expensive in france ; I suspect registering in the uk first is the way to go ; to give you an example registering a 3.5tonne hymer [ or any equivalent ] less than 10 years old will cost €400-€500 [ varies by departement ] ; over 10 years it halves

if you don't have a residence in france it is still possible to register a vehicle ; you decide on what you want to consider your base , apply to the mairie , there are 2 systems ...one for itinerant workers , another for self supporting retired people of any age ; but as you are not french residents I suspect it would very different , and suggest the uk route
french residents are not permitted to use foreign registered vehicles for more than 6 months ...equally true in other EU countries ; of course there are motorhomers who live in france but are elsewhere with it for 6 months each year ; but french registration is the way to go , no road tax , 2 year technical inspection , much better insurance including breakdown/ recovery / 12 month foreign cover including n.africa etc

finally do try to buy under 3,500 Kg if you possibly can ..if you go over it gets very difficult ...insurance zooms , tolls , driving licence etc ; if you must have something bigger come back for further info

oh , and do buy a vehicle which is sold in france ! then the homologation will be in the DRIRE computer [ the technical dept ] and even if not ,easily obtained from the importer
basically, therefore , don't even consider anything uk made

 

[peter marshall]

UK or Europe

Hi I did not read all the replies and somebody may have already mentioned my point, I noticed somewhere cant remember whereoh:. That a UK couple settled in France and could not register their MH because the Habitation door was on the left hand side IE normal for UK but on the offside for France so had to swop for a suitable MH over there, I just thought it was worth mentioning. Pete:thumb::thumb:

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[vwalan]

lots live in m,homes keeping uk reg ins.lic.
if you take a rhd to france they do kick up abit about the habitation door depends on the conversion i say putone in the other side .easily done. that shuts em up done it loads of times for friends who have moved to france.

 

[lebesset]

not sure what your timing is , just to say that at the moment their is a dearth of good used motorhomes in france ; people are putting off their purchase of a new one until the financial situation improves

so dealers are cutting back their stock orders of new motorhomes , perhaps the manufacturers are limiting what they will finance

so manufacturers are cutting back their production to what they feel CERTAIN of selling in the current climate ...you can read about staff cut backs at places like hymer group

so there seems , ironically enough , to be longer lead times on new vehicle orders

just to give an idea of the position have a look here

Link Removed

this is the hymer/eriba dealer near lyon , as you can see on both sides of the main road ; this picture was taken in may , the busy season ; I was there in late september ....the part in the top of the picture was fuller , but the main sales area at the bottom contained ...only the sales office ; ok , you expect a seasonal variation , but an 80% drop???

 

[stagman]

[
Link Removed

Just looked at that website .Don't you think they are expensive , especially the older ones :thumb:

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[lebesset]

yes , I think so too , but

they will haggle
all vehicles come with a one year guarantee on all habitation equipment
one year guarantee on all major mechanical components [ from a specialist insurance company ]
their trade in prices reflect their selling prices

 

[Goose]

A huge thankyou to everyone for the tremendous information and advice given. It's been tremendously useful and is much appreciated.

lebesset:

how old are you ? affects things a lot ; do your canadian licences actually say automatic only?

44. Our Canadian licences don't specify "automatic" but then automatic is the norm over here - manual transmission exists in very few cars. But I've been onto the UK authority website (the DVLA??) and it specifically says Canadians can convert to UK driver licences but the licences will be endorsed "Automatic only". Bit of a pain considering we've driven manuals in South Africa for over 20 years. :Angry:

lebesset:

oh , and do buy a vehicle which is sold in france ! then the homologation will be in the DRIRE computer [ the technical dept ] and even if not ,easily obtained from the importer

If I were to buy a French-built LHD (say a Pilote or Rapido) in the UK, register it in the UK and then eventually register it in France, would the vehicle still be in the "DRIRE" computer or would it have been removed the moment it was registered in the UK?

lebesset:

not sure what your timing is , just to say that at the moment their is a dearth of good used motorhomes in france ; people are putting off their purchase of a new one until the financial situation improves

I had a look at this French website today and was pleasantly surprised with the number of motorhomes available (mainly Rapido, Pilote, Frankia Bavaria and Burstner): Link Removed Some of the prices were higher than comparatives in the UK and in Germany on Link Removed but plenty of the Rapidos and Pilotes were cheaper

Alan, do you (or anyone) know of any Brits who now reside in France but who jointly own their motorhome or RV with someone back in the UK? I'm wondering if we could jointly own our RV with my sister in the UK, and whether that would overcome the requirement to register the RV in France once we become French residents?

 

[Heyupluv]

Gosh, thanks for the replies already folks.

You might recall from my earlier post that we were going to bring an American RV across which would have been easy enough to register in the UK but very difficult to do so in France.

Peter and Mel, you are quite correct, I have noticed that UK prices for many European built motorhomes are cheaper than the same thing available in Europe. I suspect we'd only get a Class B licence on conversion, restricting us to 3500kg. Exchanging our Canadian licences would restrict us even more...to driving automatic transmission only! We have South African licences but they've expired and I don't know if the Uk licencing authorities would accept them for a swop (which would be best for us since we've driven manual transmssion most of our lives). A number of Funsters have recommended upgrading to a C1 licence which is probably what I'd do in the UK as it will presumably be easier than doing the equivalent in France.


Frankia, thank for the tip regarding Nick Legg - will investigate. Would prefer a 2nd hand motorhome to benefit from the depreciated price but won't say "no" to new if the right deal presents itself.

Alan, thanks for the advice. I find it interesting that folks continue to live in France with a UK-registered motorhome - paying UK insurance, MOT etc. I thought the French laws made that impossible?

Hi GOOSE
I think a lot of Brits register & insure in England because it is easy and they can understand the policy better,....maybe because some can not speak French or when you try to translate technical words it becomes very hard......when we first moved to France most insurance companies cover for about 3 months after the move....mine insurer Saga did not...so we needed insurance very quickly as a resident so we had to have a English insurer as the French would only insure for third party only if the vehicle was not a French registed car.....We found it very costly ...so we re-registed our car to French plates then cancelled the English insurance (at lost about 400 euros having only had the English insurance for about a month then cancelling!!!)...we are now all on French plates for the car ..The motorhome ..and the large trailer…...all have different number plates ...and that is ok...
(My hip replacement surgeon, Vietnamese born in France lived in America for many years speaks 7 languages fluently, looking at his papers he is a top surgeon in France, Uk, America, Germany, Africa, lived in all these countries and a adviser to many other countries....) he said he has a very large series BMW motor car he purchased in America 7 or 8 series and wants use it in France ,he has tried for 4 years and the garage he uses in France has also tried and still can not get a Carte Grise / log book ...he said it seems impossible!!!!!!
So if this man with all he knows and what he knows and being able to speak to them in there own native tongue as he was born in France.
What chance has other people got.

My change over took 2 months but it was a French manufactured car a Citroen...using a French Citroen garage.

Now in the process of changing our UK licence to French !!!???

Sorry about the waffle…and what I have said might not help you……..and all the motorhomes you mentioned I think are of the best on offer…the German ones

Mel

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[vwalan]

are you actually going to live in france ?what alot do is just keep returning to uk to mot and tax ,insure .using a friends relatives address in uk.
some never come back possibly never do any of it . seem to get away with it. i dont recomend it. could be my truck they crash in to.
if you are jusr travelling i would ask your relative to act as a postman/woman.
have you any proof of your driving manual vehicles in s,africa ?can you get it put on your canadian licence before you get here.

 

[lebesset]

hi goose , a few points

licence , have you tried the effect of applying with your expired SA licences ...they can only say no ! maybe you can get them restored ...why not ask the consulate ? I have friends who got their canadian licences back ..after 25 years!
and the reason I asked about age was uk licences expire at 70 so no worries at 44

the DRIRE computer only registers types approvals , not individual vehicles , so if the vehicle is listed there registration is pretty easy ; so anything sold new in france is ok

it is cheaper to run a french registered vehicle
when you consider the

no annual taxes

superior insurance including repatriation/breakdown/ 12 months green card international insurance

technical inspection only every 2 years

you could reckon on saving at least 500 loonies pa ...so the initial registration cost is worth paying

rapido's and pilotes are not to the same quality as , for instance , hymers ...and are priced accordingly ; but as you have no trade in you might well do a good deal with a private seller ..have a look here , the biggest site in france for motorhomes

Petites annonces : camping-cars

be careful , these ad's are free and there are lots of phoney ads on the sites ..if the price looks wrong it is probably a con

what sort of price are you considering anyway ? what sort of vehicle ?what age ?
having just spent the summer in the uk I can only reiterate that , for the moment , overall prices are cheaper in the uk or france and germany ; it depends what you want of course ..availability in a particular market changes things !

btw , first thing a french insurance company is going to ask is for proof of your no claims bonus [ in french of course ! ]...50% off after 4 years is the norm here ...expensive if you can't show it !

 

[Goose]

Mel, thanks for the information regarding your surgeon. It's certainly reinforced what Alan and others have already said...if your surgeon with his French fluency can't get his American BMW registered what chance do I have with an American RV?

Alan, we haven't yet reached the age where we can (or would like to) retire, so we'd want to set up properly in France and perhaps run a little business by registering as Auto Entrepreneurs...and, in so doing, contribute into the healthcare system. I think we could register and insure our motorhome/rv in the UK but after a couple of years I think it would become more difficult and would need to regsiter and insure in France, as Mel has just done.

Good point about gathering proof of driving a manual transmission, though. Our South African licences qualify us to drive manual or automatic...manual transmission being the norm on SA roads. Last night I sent an email to the DVLA to ask if they'd accept our expired SA photocard licences together with our original driving licences printed in our Book of Life identity documents. If they do, it may solve our driving licence concerns. Alan, great advice about asking the Canadian licencing office here in BC whether they won't endorse our Candian licences with the fact that we can drive manual transmission...hadn't thought of that.

Lebesset, thanks for the advice and French motorhome website link...I'll check it out. I suspect your friends got their Canadian licences back after 25 years by applying from within Canada. Normally, the licencing authority would want an up-to-date photo and our lot over here take the photo themselves. We're not keen to go back to South Africa and do that.

In answer to your question as to what type of motorhome we're consdering: ideally we'd like a American A-Class RV, 30', 2-slides. Have had my eye on a Winnebago Sightseer or Vista. Am still toying with the idea of bringing a Winnebago Vista across. There are 2007/8 30' Winnebago Vista/Chalets available over here for around $40,000. Originally we intended buying one and touring the USA for 6 months, escape our Canadian winter and then export it across to the UK. That way we'd have avoided the UK import duty and VAT because of having owned it for 6 months. But we haven't sold our house yet and it looks like we'll be heading into European summer by the time we do. So touring the USA is not as appealing any more (we want to get on with our lives in Europe). It might still be worth our while to bring one over and pay the import duty and VAT. If we can pick one up over here for $40,000 we should be able to land it in the UK for around GBP36,000 inclusive of shipping costs, import duty and VAT. From what I've seen available in the UK, a 2008 Winnebago Vista 30' at GBP36,000 compares favourably.

My thinking, after all the help on this forum is that we could still bring one across, use it for 2 years, find a place in France we like, then sell the RV in the UK and buy a motorhome in France (as we'd still want to be able to holiday in Italy, Spain, Turkey and Morocco in the winter months).

Thanks for the advice regarding no claim bonus. We intend getting letter of confirmation from our Canadian insurers. Already have one from our South African insurers.

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