Save money on gas

Discussion in 'Motorhome on a Budget' started by Wildman, Feb 23, 2009.

  1. Wildman

    Wildman Read Only Funster

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    Why pay £16 for a 6kg gas bottle when you can do it yourself for around £6. Gas refill adapters have been around for a few years, now you can get one with overfill protection thereby answering all the major objections voiced in the past

    <Link to Gas refill adapter on eBay>

    needless to say I have no connection with the firm at all.
    Check it out and start saving money right away.
    :thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb::thumb:
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2009
  2. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

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    Thanks for that..

    good to see it now has over fill protection .. :thumb:

    Jim
     
  3. Douglas

    Douglas Read Only Funster

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    Sound good, however looking at the photograph I cannot see how an overfill is prevented,

    What I can see is a propane fitting , a stop tap and a refillable connector, I hope I am wrong as I would like one.

    Doug...
     
  4. Wildman

    Wildman Read Only Funster

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    I have made enquiries as to how it works am awaiting reply. I have used one without overfill protection wih no problems for years but only refill an empty bottle. This incarnation claims to allow refilling of part used bottles.
     
  5. Geo

    Geo Trader - Funster

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    You may find that the so called stop tap is indeed a blow off valve :Eeek:
     
  6. Douglas

    Douglas Read Only Funster

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    If thats the case then I cant see the garage owners allow it to be used, if you remember when the gaslow bottles first came out the some of the gas stations would not allow them to be filled.

    Doug.
     
  7. Terry

    Terry Funster

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    :Rofl1: Hi ALL :BigGrin: already emailed the seller(a couple of weeks back) who claims it is fitted with a pressure sensing valve. Not sure how it would work but somebody with more intelligence than me may know :BigGrin::Wink:
    terry
    Been using similar one for the last 3 yrs
    HERE'S what I do
    GAS ADAPTER
    There are no joints, pipes, knuckles valves or floats to go wrong or leak, just a simple well engineered adapter that screws onto your bottle
    Use a two bottle system ie 1 full to replace empty 1, just as you did years ago.
    Remember to refill only total empty bottles to avoid overfilling.
    Refill LPG bottles are only filled to 80% of total volume.
    One litre of LPG weights ca. 500 grams.
    13 kg bottle at 80% = 26 litres
    6 kg bottle @ 80 % = 12 ltrs
    3.9 kg bottle @ 80 % = 7.8 ltrs
    Calor gas on there web site even say that bottles can be filled up to 87 % so this will allow for any difference in temperatures!!!!
    Fasten the bottle in the van
    Fit adapter
    Open valve
    Fit filling gun turning 90 degrees C,Wise and lock on/cock
    Dispense required amount of gas (see above)
    Close valve
    Uncock turn 90 degrees anti CW,Disengage filling gun
    Replace gun into holder and pay for fuel
    Remove adapter and store for next use
    If you cannot follow these simple instructions then do not buy a filling adapter and carry on paying through the nose for refill bottles!!!
    If you can understand and follow the above then buy an adapter and start saving money ----
    It has been discussed at depth on the other side and they are not recommended for use by the people who supply gas to forecourts,:Rofl1: but as yet it is MY understanding that the jury is still out as to weather they are illegal to use in UK but are OK to use abroad:Rofl1:
    terry

    edit, Roger have you seen my post --- Who was looking for a M/H? --could be a new BEAST on the moor --heehee
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2009
  8. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

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    Hi Terry

    That looks like the instructions given with the original valve sold on ebay, ... this one says ...

    I've also emailed for an explanation ..



    I suspect as Geo suggested that it 'blows off' when it reaches a certain pressure..
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2009
  9. Terry

    Terry Funster

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    Hi Jim this was his reply when asked if he could supply euro adapters and how it worked ???
    and yes mine is the older one :Rofl1::thumb:
    Hi Terry
    Sorry the euro adapters are cheaper on EBAY than i can get them for.The LPG filling adapter as got a pressure sensor valve to tell you its at 80% full and to stop. Hope This helps Kind Regards

    terry
     
  10. olley

    olley Funster

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    Hi IMHO its a load of cobblers, the gas pressure remains fairly constant while you refill and depends on temperature and rate of fill.

    The Morrisons in Ipswich has a pressure gauge on their Autogas and until the float valve in my tank shuts off the pressure hardly alters.

    Olley
     
  11. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

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    Hi Ian

    tend to agree with you.. but your not filling a totally empty tank at zero pressure .. are you ?

    an empty bottle will be at zero pressure, when filling, the pressure will rise until it equalises with the supply pressure, at which point the filling will stop .. this valve may be set at a slightly lower pressure to 'blow off' when it's around 80% full. but as you say the pressure is also dependant on temperature..

    but if this seller cannot give a satisfactory explanation of how it works he should be reported to ebay for giving a misrepresentation of the item.. lets see his reply first.. :Wink:

    Jim
     
  12. Braunston

    Braunston Read Only Funster

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    Hi,

    Do any of you know how any of the equipment used to refill a gas bottle actually detects that its only 80% of its total capacatiy, or what ever % they use to goven it from over filling, as i would be interested in how the manufacturers equipment or gaslows etc actually work.

    Just interested,
     
  13. olley

    olley Funster

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    Hi Jim it doesn't work like that, as the liquid gas comes in it will, if their is zero pressure in the bottle vapourise until it reaches the condensate pressure of the gas, from then on the pressure will remain fairly constant as the gas vapour condensates to make room for the liquid gas coming in. (Around 180psi)

    If you fill very quickly then the temperature in the bottle will slowly increase as the gas that's condensing loses heat (latent heat) turning into a liquid, and this will raise the condensation pressure of the gas. But I think its unlikely the gauge would be sensitive enough to measure this, also the condensation pressure will vary, depending on the temperature of the liquid gas being pumped in, so it would never be the same at two separate fuel stations. Certainly as the gas reached the top of the bottle the pressure would increase markedly, but at 80-85-90-95%?? how to judge??

    That's my understanding of how it all works and why they all use a float to measure liquid level.

    Olley
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2009
  14. sinbad1

    sinbad1 Deleted User

    looks like a good idea ;but like others i can't see how this fitting can sense 80% full like olley says the gas pressure inside the tank unless empty remains fairly constant . if its dependant on the supply pressure i can't understand how it can detect any changes in pressure untill its full.

    I may be wrong ;but we are not pressurising the gas bottles, just transfering a liquid from one tank to another so the only pressure is that of the gas and pressure change between supply and tank would only change when completely full.

    Regards

    Sorry posted before seeing your thread Olley;but you have explained it much better than i can
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 23, 2009
  15. Douglas

    Douglas Read Only Funster

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    I go along this this, I can see the pressure rising if you were filling a tank with a float system, but as soon as the refilling stops the pressure will drop back to the natural pressure for the gas to remain liquid. Or if the bottle is heated up but then the pressure will rise until the relief valve blows.

    Doug...
     
  16. Terry

    Terry Funster

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    Hi all, interesting stuff :BigGrin: As said in my first post I don't see how it can tell 80 % full :Eeek: but if you stick to filling empty bottles as in first post they are indeed a very cost effective option :thumb::Rofl1:
    Just to throw a little more mud on the murky situation :Rofl1: while filling one of my empty bottles I could not get more than 4 ltrs in (should hold 7.8 ltrs) no matter how I tried-- it did not cause a problem just used it from half full :Rofl1: then filled it full the next time :Rofl1:
    terry
    edit Have you posted this to cause controversy Roger?are you bored? heehee
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2009
  17. Braunston

    Braunston Read Only Funster

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    Hi,

    If its worked on a float type system then surely all bottles self refillable or not, would be fitted with this float type system, or do the manufacturers refill it by a different method does anyone know how the manufacturers do it


    Hi Terry,

    I have a Gaslow system fitted and have been getting similar results from what has shown to be an empty bottle i can't normally get any more than 14/15 litres in it and it should hold around 22L. I did speak to them about it quiet some time ago and they made some suggestions which didn't make much difference, has anyone else had similar problems, I didn't notice it at first because I never let the bottle empty, i always refilled before it actually ran out.
     
  18. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

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    Hi
    Calor and others fill by weight...


    Reply form ebay seller

    I've replied asking how this works exactly ..
     
  19. sinbad1

    sinbad1 Deleted User

     
  20. Terry

    Terry Funster

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    Hi Sinbad, yes it would work but would you trust bathroom scales ? :Eeek: better to just fill empty ones using your brain and what is a very accurate dispenser, the pump at the garage :thumb: you could always use the scales to double check :thumb: The weight is on the neck of the bottle if memory serves me right.Also remember just because you can put say 12 ltrs in a 6 kg bottle there is nothing to stop you only putting 10 / 11 ltrs in :thumb:
    terry
     

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