More flexible hours for teachers ... Really?

Discussion in 'Motorhome Chat' started by Allan & Loren, Mar 4, 2016.

  1. Allan & Loren

    Allan & Loren Funster

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    just heard on the news that the teaching profession are looking to make their hours more flexible so teachers with children can return to their profession after maternity leave.

    I know I am probably going to upset many teachers and can already hear the shouts of heavy workloads, long hours, etc and how hard it is with a family but I'd like a teacher to step into my Shoes and do my job for a few years and see if they still moan.

    My children are grown up now but when I had them I worked full time in sales. My official hours were 9am to 6pm but as a Manager I was expected to do as many hours as it took to get the job done which was often 70/100hrs. The overtime was unpaid, just expected if I wanted to hit my targets/keep my job! I had 4 weeks holiday per year plus bank holidays which were compulsory to work as these are peak times and so is christmas and new year. If I wanted to go to Christmas pantos, school sports day, even parents evening I needed to take the day as holidays or I couldn't guarantee getting there and I only got the time off if cover was available! I employed an au pair who lived with us so she could take the kids to school or pick them up, etc. I chose the Au Pair route as a more cost effective option. A nanny was £500 per week and a childminder was £300, I tried both of these and this was back in the early 90's. Now don't get me wrong I enjoyed my work and was very successful but I had to give up quite a lot. Our holidays were very special as this was my time to be with the children and Allan (who worked just as hard as me in the same industry). It has allowed us to have a nice house, nothing out of the ordinary, just a 3 bed bungalow but in a nice place and allowed us to help the children by buying their first car, paying for university, etc. At the end of the day it was my choice to work after maternity leave and I didn't expect my employers to change their policies to fit in with me and make my life easier. At the end of the day it's not forever and you choose to have children, they are not compulsory.
     
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  2. mickyc

    mickyc Read Only Funster

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    Haven't seen the article, but if more flexibility means more qualified teachers can return to work, then that's a win win isn't it?

    Schools attract qualified teachers benefiting the students.

    The teachers return to work benefiting them and their families.
     
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  3. Allan & Loren

    Allan & Loren Funster

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    Why can't they return to work like I and so many other women do by paying for childcare and compromising. Plenty of teachers work part time, my friend is one, and she does this so she can work and look after her children. On her working days she pays for childcare?
     
  4. mickyc

    mickyc Read Only Funster

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    If it doesn't cost the tax payer anymore money, what's wrong with making life easier?

    As I said it's a win win isn't it?
     
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  5. BobtheBass

    BobtheBass Funster

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    I don't get why the rigours of your position might be a reason why teachers should lower their chances of improving their lot? I'm sure you would have accepted the chance to work flexible hours if it were possible in your profession. Teachers work incredibly hard with long hours both in school and in their "free" time so I have no idea why people feel the need to have a pop at them in any way. Their pay is not fantastic and I have never met any who could afford an au pair. You are not being fair.
     
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  6. CWH

    CWH Funster Life Member

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    @Allan & Loren could you please post a link to they full story so that people can understand your point better? - Thanks (y)
     
  7. fastpat

    fastpat Read Only Funster

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    I think the problem they are trying to address is the massive shortage of trained teachers - an issue that is only going to get worse, this proposal is an attempt to get those already trained back into the profession. Sadly it fails to really address why teachers are either leaving teaching entirely or going to work abroad - currently more teachers are leaving to teach abroad than are completing post graduate training each year.

    And why are they leaving, well it seems if you demonise a workforce and give below inflation wage increases for six years, change the performance standards on a annual basis and blame them for society's woes, strangely people don't want to sign up for it / stay in it, and if they have the means to either earn more elsewhere or do something totally different then they'll take it.
     
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  8. fastpat

    fastpat Read Only Funster

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    Isn't your friend working part time just working flexibly?
     
  9. Khizzie

    Khizzie Funster

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    Aahh ! But you must remember teachers are not like the rest of the working population ,they are much more highly strung and delicate .. So need different treatment.. ... We do need good teachers with not just the qualifications as seems to be the case,but teachers who have the quality and skill to teach. ,so much different to a qualification. ..and these are the ones we need to retain not the flag waving pathetic bunch frequently seen demonstrating against anything almost as if they have never left uni.or teachers college....feel better now got that off my chest ..
     
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  10. Allan & Loren

    Allan & Loren Funster

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    My sisters Au Pair costs £50 per week today, I paid £35 in the 90's and they get a room and full board. They help with lots of things for the children and get time off during the day to study English. It is not a huge expense and yes you have to cut your cloth accordingly for the extra out going and may have to compromise on other things like my 2 children shared a bedroom so the Au Pair could have a room.
     
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  11. Rapido925M

    Rapido925M Funster

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    So there were lots(?) of other people looking to do your job?

    Unfortunately, there are not lots of teachers looking to return to their positions, for whatever reason. Market economics suggests that you have to do something to increase this number: being flexible is clearly one of them.

    What that implies may actually mean writing a timetable so that a the teacher sees one class for all their lessons rather than 3 different classes for a third of their lessons.

    Gordon
     
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  12. Allan & Loren

    Allan & Loren Funster

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    It's on BBC2 news on the radio this morning. I'll see if I can find a link
     
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  13. reckless

    reckless Funster

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    Employers in many professions/industries offer flexible working arrangements to retain qualified staff in this day and age.

    Why hit on teachers ' the usual suspects',

    I can confirm that most teachers work longer hours than many people care to believe.

    Karen
     
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  14. Allan & Loren

    Allan & Loren Funster

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    I have no idea of how many people were looking to do my job. My point is that I chose to work in my field before I had children, I enjoyed it, I dealt with the pressure and when I chose to have children I had a decision to make like every other parent. I could return to work and find a solution or I could change my job, go part time or stop work entirely. Surely that should be Mychoice, my decision, my responsibility, not my employers. It's not like there are no part time teaching positions.
     
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  15. Lenny HB

    Lenny HB Funster

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    My daughter is a teacher she does long hours, brings work home with her and goes into the school to do more work when she is on holiday. Rather than make it more flexible they need to reduce the workload.
    My other daughter teaches in Bangkok which is much easier, when she comes back to the UK in a year or two it won't be a teaching job she will be looking for.
     
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  16. Allan & Loren

    Allan & Loren Funster

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    I'm not disputing they work hard or longer hours and some go in on some of the holidays but I did too and it didn't stop when I got home either.
     
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  17. BobtheBass

    BobtheBass Funster

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    Quote:

    Why hit on teachers ' the usual suspects',

    I can confirm that most teachers work longer hours than many people care to believe.

    Karen

    I don't think many people have a pot of glue how hard the average teacher works. 70 hours a week would probably be a minimum for most. I have lost count of the number of medical problems caused by stress and overwork I have seen in the profession. I can't see why anyone would think that because they chose to do things one way then that's the way the rest of the working population should do it?
     
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  18. mickyc

    mickyc Read Only Funster

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    Your argument seems to be based around your point of view that "I didn't get it, why should they".

    When in reality it's a perfectly sensible way of attracting professionals back to the classroom, benefitting the schools, the teachers and most importantly the kids.

    As others have said loads of organisations (in both the public and private sector) offer flexible working arrangements, why not schools?
     
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  19. Milliemobile

    Milliemobile Funster

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    I'm all for flexible working as long as both sides are flexible.
    Most of my career I worked flexible working.
    For me that meant working the long days when my workload demanded and reaping the benefits of being able to take up to 24 flexi leave days a year on top of my annual leave allowance.
    Wasn't in teaching but was government employment, I don't have kids.
    But what it did create without a doubt was a divide between those of us without kids and those with.
    It's frustrating when you are told don't call breakfast meetings, just in case someone has to drop the kids at school, don't have late afternoon meetings in case anyone has to collect the kids.
    It also generally didn't take long for customers to realise who the ones with the kids were, so they stop telephoning them and call who they know will be at their desk early and late, the ones who can stay and deal with a crisis, the one who will go out in the field.
    Rightly or wrongly giving preferential treatment to those within a team can often cause problems.
    There are some jobs that just cannot be covered this way without the burden falling onto other colleagues.
    I don't know if this includes teachers or not but it something that should be addressed across the board before those who don't have to fit in with child care arranging stop caring and stop covering.
    As a female I believe if you are going to be the primarily child care then look at your job, if it's the type where you know hand on heart you will become less productive and impact on others, ask to stand aside for a few years into a post that only requires you to be available 10-3.

    Lin :)

    Edit for balance I have worked with a least a couple of brilliant ladies, their kids went into school early, breakfast club, most evenings they attended after school clubs and for them it worked, dare I say it, they preferred being at work, and two great friends in particular have very high positions now. Their children seemed to cope and enjoy it, probably getting to do fun stuff after school helped.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2016
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  20. Khizzie

    Khizzie Funster

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    The one thing that is coming out if this thread seems to be that all teachers that are struggling to cope are women ,I find that strange as all the women I know are sensible and stable ..even the two women teachers that I know say they are many more women in teaching than ever. So wonder why there are so few men .when I was at school ,a long time ago now.,the junior school was predominantly female teachers ,but secondary and my grammar schools were predominantly male teachers .so what's going on.
     
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