Interesting CC Wardens (1 Viewer)

[Photo4x4]

Crikey what is all this 6m rule fuss about, nothing to do with the thread title really?

I try to go through life being pleasant to people and generally find most people are pleasant back to me. Sometimes I come across a person who is rude or can't be arsed. Well that's their problem not mine. I smile, move on and stay happy.

SWMBO and I have not yet come across a club site official who was less than polite and helpful. We have not yet encountered a club site that was not clean and tidy and well run. The CLs and CSs vary as do their owners, but in life, people and places are all different. That is all a part of life's rich pattern.

I'm sure that like any normal person club wardens have their off days, so do police officers, nurses, doctors, posties, shop staff or anyone, even me!

Some people are very nice, some are a bit nice and some are not nice and all shades in between.

So I would suggest that if anyone does not like what the CC or C&CC do or how they operate then they do not have to join either club do they? And of course both clubs offer more services to members than just the camp sites.

So how about a truce between the club haters and the club likers and lets all get on with being positive and enjoying life whilst we can instead of wasting our time arguing about something that we are not going to change?

Peace & love to you all...


KH

 

[jdk62]

We have never had any problems with CC wardens - quite the opposite in fact.

I am amused that there are many posters to this thread moaning about miserable, unhelpful, stubborn, etc wardens.

Kettle, pot black?

 

[Teuchter]

And how many aires are there compared to club campsites? Many many more.

How often fires? it happened on a campsite where Norman would have strictly enforced his 6 metre rule which I believe is solely intended to prevent damage to other vans if a fire happens. It singularly failed to do that.

That's really my point. The 6 metre rule, at the first time of asking, failed to do what it was intended to do so to my mind that makes it pointless. If anyone is going to insist on reacting to a one off incident, which I don't believe is necessary, then there are two ways to go:

1. Accept that the 6m rule is a waste of time and scrap it completely accepting that any risk is negligible.

2. Accept that the 6m rule is a waste of time but decide that there is an identifiable risk and increase the minimum spacing to a level that is proven to prevent damage to neighbouring vehicles. How far should that be? 9m? 12m? 15m? 18m? More? You tell me.

The one thing that nobody can do now and still maintain an ounce of credibility is insist on a 6m spacing to prevent the spread of fire.

None of that even considers the cause of this fire which I don't believe anyone has suggested a theory for yet.

What if it was caused by the owner having had one too many sherbets and doing something stupid and entirely preventable? No matter what you do you can't legislate for idiots.

According to Eye witnesses & the local fire brigade the 6m rule worked well and the fire was limited to only one motorhome - the adjacent units suffered some heat damage but did not catch fire so the fire was contained and did not spread which is the reason for the rule in the 1st place

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[Deleted member 29692]

@NickNic

The Caravan Club did not make the 6mt spacing rule.. they are following the law..

you don't like Club sites that's fine, you don't need to use.. I don't like being packed in like sardines on aires so I don't use ones like that.


Caravan Sites and Control of Development Act 1960 Section 5 Model Standards for Touring Caravan Sites 1983

1. Site density should not exceed 75 units (caravans or motor caravans) per hectare (30 units per acre) calculated on the basis of the useable area rather than the total site area (i.e. excluding crags, lakes, roads, communal services etc), provided that, where tent camping is also permitted, the maximum number of units stationed on the site at any one time should be reduced by the number of pitches occupied by main tents stationed for human habitation.
   
   
2. Where the number of units on the site is to be limited by condition, it may be appropriate to prescribe maxima by reference to specified periods so as to permit up to 10% more units during such peak holiday periods as may be agreed between the site licensing authority and the licence holder without the provision of additional facilities, provided that:-

(I) the provisions of paragraph 1 above are complied with; and
(ii) the standards relating to spacing, as set out in paragraphs 3 - 5 below are

complied with.

Spacing

1. Every unit should be not less than 6 metres from any other unit in separate family occupation and not less than 3 metres should be permitted between units in any circumstances.
   
   
2. Vehicles and other ancillary equipment should be permitted within the 6 metres space between units in separate family occupation but, in order to restrict the spread of fire, there should always be 3 metres clear space within the 6 metres separation.
   
   
3. Emergency vehicles should be able to secure access at all times to within 90 metres of any unit on the site.
   
   
   
   
   
   As For Site Rules in general.. they are in place because we have morons who think they can do as they please..
   
   Rules on sites are no different to rules that govern our everyday life.. even French aires have rules..
   
   
   
   for example, Le Bouquet Equestrian aire has a 3mt spacing rule..
   
   
   
   

You said this in another thread and I agree .. Aires are not sites.. they are just places to park.

So not comparable to a proper camping site.. .. Apples and Pears ..






http://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum/threads/cl-s-versus-aires.131651/

Same question then Jim.

On what evidence is the 6m rule based? Who carried out the research to come up with that figure and where are their findings published?

Or is it just an arbitrary figure someone came up with that people have just blindly accepted?

 

[Tea Bag]

Hi.
One GOOD reason for the 6m Rule....... Giving people time to get out of adjacent vehicles,or move them if possible. Another reason for"Backing in". Along comes the warden,and can haul out those each side of the one on fire,with his.."John Deere 9630R"...Well it is the CC,musn't lower standards,i am a member LOL. Deere by name....."Dear" by Nature "
Having read threads from members in the Fire brigade,it would appear the first thing you should do is get out,this then ties in with advice about having your/a fire extinguisher sited by the door,so if you do decide to tackle it,you do so from the outside.Am i right,or ammeringue ?
Spoke to a mate who was at Wells next the Sea July/August this year,a unit on Pinewoods went up,and the units each side were damaged by the heat.............. Had they been nearer than 6m ?.
Tea Bag

 

[busby]

Same question then Jim.

On what evidence is the 6m rule based? Who carried out the research to come up with that figure and where are their findings published?

Or is it just an arbitrary figure someone came up with that people have just blindly accepted?

OK i confess,,it was me,,,,,now you know,,so for ......sake shut up and find something else to moan about,,,BUSBY

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[olley]

Same person who said mobile phones couldn't be used in petrol stations. Bet you ignore that as well nicknic

 

[chaser]

One thing that strikes me is how terraced houses and flats survive

 

[jockaneezer]

Can't understand why folk are getting so agitated over one of these ?

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[scotjimland]

Same question then Jim.

On what evidence is the 6m rule based? Who carried out the research to come up with that figure and where are their findings published?

Or is it just an arbitrary figure someone came up with that people have just blindly accepted?

Can't honestly say..

Caravan Sites and Control of Development Act 1960 stipulate the distance.. I would imagine that the Fire Authorities were consulted and would advise on safe spacing of units..

I'm happy that 6mts is a safe distance, it also gives me space for an awning and a place to relax.. how can you find fault with that ?

 

[scotjimland]

One thing that strikes me is how terraced houses and flats survive

they don't always.. there was a high rise fire in Dubai not so long ago https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/mar/28/major-fire-breaks-ajman-tower-dubai-uae

but modern fire regulations have gone a long way to reducing the risk of fire spreading.. but risk there will always be..

 

[busby]

One thing that strikes me is how terraced houses and flats survive

Could be something to do with bricks and morter,,,,,BUSBY

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[Deleted member 29692]

I'm happy that 6mts is a safe distance, it also gives me space for an awning and a place to relax.. how can you find fault with that ?

I don't find fault with it if it's voluntary. Similarly if I was travelling with someone else and we specifically wanted to park closer together than 6m that should be OK as well.

The best way I've ever found this dealt with is at Camping Cappucini in Peschiera del Garda. There the pitches are 8m x 8m and it's up to you to use it however you please. Park as far away as possible from the next unit, park right next to it, park at 90° to everyone else, park diagonally across the pitch if you want, it's entirely your choice.

It's the people who hysterically claim that everything is certain go up in some kind of fiery armageddon if the spacing is less, say 5.8m, that I find strange.

They make a mockery of their rule anyway by not counting awnings in the 6m gap. Once they're up the spacing could be down to 3m or less and I'm sure everyone would agree that a fire is more likely to spread to a glorified tent 3m away than a vehicle 6m away.

Mainly it's just because the CC cheerleaders always bite so well on this topic or any other one that challenges the sacred rule book. It's so easy it's not really even

 

[busby]

I don't find fault with it if it's voluntary. Similarly if I was travelling with someone else and we specifically wanted to park closer together than 6m that should be OK as well.

The best way I've ever found this dealt with is at Camping Cappucini in Peschiera del Garda. There the pitches are 8m x 8m and it's up to you to use it however you please. Park as far away as possible from the next unit, park right next to it, park at 90° to everyone else, park diagonally across the pitch if you want, it's entirely your choice.

It's the people who hysterically claim that everything is certain go up in some kind of fiery armageddon if the spacing is less, say 5.8m, that I find strange.

They make a mockery of their rule anyway by not counting awnings in the 6m gap. Once they're up the spacing could be down to 3m or less and I'm sure everyone would agree that a fire is more likely to spread to a glorified tent 3m away than a vehicle 6m away.

Mainly it's just because the CC cheerleaders always bite so well on this topic or any other one that challenges the sacred rule book. It's so easy it's not really even

I get the impression that you don't like this rule,,now don't ask how i came to this conclusion,,i am a bit psychic thats all. My psychic powers tell me that i will never meet you on a CC or C&CC site,,,,for this i am very very pleased,,,,BUSBY

 

[chaser]

As I posted earlier, we are on a CCC ths in chapel St Leonards, and there is no mention of 6 meters here with caravans parked up together with an awning joining them together.
I think the thing is on the sites is that they are CARAVAN clubs, not motorhome clubs ,where it takes half an hour to move a caravan you can jump in the seat of a mh and be moved in twenty seconds.

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[Lot lover]

Clarification pls, is the 6m just beside or fore and aft as well?

 

[WillH]

The six metre rule by it's very nature is a Health and Safety rule, It's not there to prevent other vans catching fire, it's to save lives. That's what Health and Safety is for, nothing else

 

[Lenny HB]

Enjoying this I knew when I started this thread it would be controversial.

Sitting back enjoying the fireworks.

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[Deleted member 29692]

The six metre rule by it's very nature is a Health and Safety rule, It's not there to prevent other vans catching fire, it's to save lives. That's what Health and Safety is for, nothing else

I wasn't going to post any more but that's got me intrigued.

If not by fire how the hell are vans parked closer than 6m a risk to anyones life? How does the spacing save lives?

Serious question.

 

[Lot lover]

It's not there to prevent other vans catching fire, it's to save lives.

The world is grossly over-populated so I do not understand this obsession with saving lives. Preventing serious injury, yes because that saves money.

 

[WillH]

The six meter rule is about fire, it gives others a better chance of escaping the fire. With fire it's all about time. We also have gas bottles on board so six metres isn't going to help you there, you'd need 30 or 40 metres to be sure.

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[busby]

Enjoying this I knew when I started this thread it would be controversial.

Sitting back enjoying the fireworks.

So its your fault,,,,BUSBY,

 

[busby]

I wasn't going to post any more but that's got me intrigued.

If not by fire how the hell are vans parked closer than 6m a risk to anyones life? How does the spacing save lives?

Serious question.

If you need to ask there is no hope,,,BUSBY.

 

[Deleted member 29692]

If you need to ask there is no hope,,,BUSBY.

Obviously not. I was under the impression you were all brainwashed into thinking it was about fire.

Mr WillH seem to think otherwise. I was just interested in what his theory is.

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[nelly]

Enjoying this I knew when I started this thread it would be controversial.

Sitting back enjoying the fireworks.

I am sure your niece will or her employers are enjoying it as well

 

[scotjimland]

Extract From the Rally Marshals Handbook.. published by Jim.. as far as I know he is not in cahoots with the CC

http://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum/resources/rally-marshals-handbook.84/update?update=134


Safety Spacing

Our insurance company dictates that a minimum spacing of 6 metres is required between motorhomes. There should also be 3 metres clear around the entire outfit; where an outfit is taken to mean and include the motorhome (or caravan) an awning room, pup tent, trailer and car.

When siting vans remember that emer- gency vehicles should also be able to secure access at all times to within 50 metres of any Motorhome on the site.

This safety spacing is achieved by pegging out the area with a minimum of 9m between pegs, though if you have the room, 10m or more is better. If you park the motorhome centered to this peg (front or rear) this will ensure the 6m separation. See the diagram on the previous page.

Ideally all doors should face the same way, but this is not as important as maintaining the 6m gap between motorhomes. Some ralliers will want to park up awning to awning, however their must be 3m between awnings.

Pup tents and full room awnings require the 6m gap too. While a car owner can park a car close to their own motorhome, that car must be a minimum of 3m from another motorhome or tent.

for the hard of reading.. a diagram..

 

[scotjimland]

I don't find fault with it if it's voluntary.

It's not voluntary.. see previous post and also the Caravan Act 1960

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[2657]

I personally am not a 'chearleader' for anyone, I have been a member of the CC for 20 years and used their sites, for convenience not for holidays, maybe half a dozen times in that period, they are not my preference but they have rules so when I do use them I abide by them, keeps life simple that way.

I much prefer continental sites with hedges, my space is my space, and find myself in the strange position of agreeing with @NickNic on this point............if only because it would keep the aforementioned member at a distance

 

[Deleted member 29692]

It's not voluntary.. see previous post and also the Caravan Act 1960

Sorry, badly worded.

I wouldn't find fault with it if it was voluntary.

As it stands it's a rule imposed without anyone apparently being able or willing to explain why that particular number was chosen. Nobody is even prepared to hazard a guess and some of the cheerleaders appear angry that I'm daring to question it.

I find that very odd.

 

[Lot lover]

MHs must be 6m apart but I can park my car immediately next to my MH as long as I maintain a 3m gap to the next MH. Yet that car probably contains a partially full petrol tank, a bomb waiting to happen - does not compute for me.

BUT the easiest thing in the world is to ridicule a single statement and use that nullify the whole document.

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