Insurance cancelled because not on Electoral Roll

Discussion in 'Motorhome Insurance General Discussion' started by Keith-R, Jun 7, 2012.

  1. Keith-R

    Keith-R Read Only Funster

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    Hi all need help
    my insurance comp has just cancelled my insurance,because im not on the electrol roll were the moterhome is parked up,now having problems trying to get new insurance ,

    cross county moterhome 40ft left hand drive 2005 year
    so if anybody can help would be greatfull, thanks keith
     
  2. Jim

    Jim Ringleader

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    The problem is you will always now fall foul of that horrible question "have you ever been declined or had insurance cancelled?" saying yes or no will generally lead to a decline, because they already know if you lie and decline if you admit.

    They all share the same data these days. Lots of people are not on the electoral role. Is there any chance you could get on it and get the insurance re-instated. Failing that see a good broker they may be able to present your case. You could try Comfort who "understand full timing" better than most so the electoral role should not be a problem with them. Best of luck:thumb:
     
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  3. Carol

    Carol Funster Life Member

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    Have you given Comfort Motorhome Insurance a ring they may give you a quote, if you are full timing have a look at 365 full time forum you may get some idea's there.


     
  4. GJH

    GJH Funster Life Member

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    You don't mention why you are not on the electoral roll where you have it parked. Can't the problem be solved simply by explaining to the company(s) what the reason is?
     
  5. Keith-R

    Keith-R Read Only Funster

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    Hi Funster
    yes im not on electorroll because im full timein m h, so i have all my post etc go to my daughters house but when in uk i stay at friends farm as its easy to park up, as not poss in brighton, but up untill now no probs , but the ins comp say that they have changed there policy
     
  6. Munchie

    Munchie Funster Life Member

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    Which company please as I am in the same situation at the moment? :cry:
     
  7. ShiftZZ

    ShiftZZ Funster Life Member

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    Were you asked at the time when you took out the insurance if you had a permanent address in the UK?
    I suspect they do not or did not offer insurance if you were full timing and, therefore, if you were then you potentially obtained cover for your van which was not within the terms of their policy or potentially illegally.
    As they have declined and withdrawn your cover did they tell you that they may share your data? If you are having problems with other companies as you suggest. Jim points out,rightly so they do share data within the Insurance Industry,

    CUE (http://www.insurancedatabases.co.uk/default.aspx)

    I am aware that they also share data through the following:

    INSURANCE DATABASE SERVICES LIMITED. Linford Wood House, 6-12 Capital Drive, Milton Keynes MK14 6XT

    and potentially through

    CIFAS.
    SIRA.
    National Hunter.
    Insurance Fraud Bureau - http://www.insurancefraudbureau.org/

    I suggest that you really need to find out who they have or if they have shared your data.


    My suspicion is (not based on any current inside info) that the insurance industry has run their data against the VR en block via the Credit reference agency, they did a similar thing with people claiming a single person occupancy of a house for council tax purposes. All they did was compare the addresses with the credit file registered at that address.
    So telling your insurance company that you live at a particular address (when you don't) may backfire due to the above.
    The insurance industry are creating a new database costing over £16M and they have been targeted in getting a ROI of at least £10M pa.


    I suggest that you go to an insurance company who deals in full timing and tell them that you have been declined.


    Ken in your case, you do have a full time address in France, I suggest that you get a French Company to insure you, you may need to get your No Claims Discount translated and they may accept that.
    This link may help.
    http://www.frenchpropertylinks.com/essential/car-insurance-france.html

    Not wishing to state the obvious, but, if you have obtained insurance by not telling the full story, you may not be covered and you would be liable personally for any claims placed against you. That could destroy you financially.
     
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  8. buttons

    buttons Funster

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    Excellent advice as always, your last paragraph reiterates the potential disasters that can happen if you hold anything back from insurers.

    Not being totally honest with travel insurance has the same potential to destroy you financially. If you are not sure of your pre-existing disorders then see your GP and get a print out of all your previous records and send it recorded delivery to your insurers. This is the only guarantee of piece of mind.
     
  9. olley

    olley Funster

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    I have fulltiming insurance with Comfort, they state in their terms that unless you declare that you are fulltiming then you must be on the electrol register at the address you give and they can ask for proof like household bills.

    Ian
     
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  10. ShiftZZ

    ShiftZZ Funster Life Member

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    As some of you may know I suffer from Asthma (amongst other things, grumpyness, old git, not medical conditions) anyhow, I wanted to fly and the insurance company asked about any respiratory complaints, I rang the doctors surgery and was advised to tell them that my asthma "was fully under control". I advised them and they were happy.

    If anyone has worked withing the industry they will know, that holding a policy document does not guarantee that you are covered, if you have not been truthful on the proposal form. Why should the insurance industry pay out when you may have obtained the policy by telling untruths, its the rest of us that have to pay in increased premiums. If any other full timer is in a similar position, i.e. driving without telling the insurance company the truth then, you are in effect driving WITHOUT insurance, no better than your average chav in his sooped up 1.2 Nova.

    As some background, virtually every financial institution in the UK data matches through whatever system they have. An extract of their data is sent to a central point and then extracted and loaded into a larger database. That system then has a set of rules that are fired, these can be varied by individual companies, but in essence they are something similar to these.

    Multiple applications, same address, same person

    Multiple applications, same address, different person

    Multiple applications, same address, same surname, same date of birth, different 1st names.

    Multiple applications, same address, same person, same date of birth, different time at current address.

    Multiple applications, same address, same person, same date of birth, salary different by more that £100.

    Application data mismatch, Post Code and telephone prefix wrong.

    Home Telephone number and Work telephone number geo data invalid (i.e. the distance between the home address and work address is greater than you would expect)

    Applicant Salary inconsistent with (area/age/occupation) get my drift.

    Application matches with Company X, inconsistent data.

    Multiple applications in time window (6 or more in 3 months)

    Title and Gender mismatch.


    There are hundreds of rules that can kick in, along with matching with what is called 'Black data" or a Fraud Reference file...

    Lastly, these matches can be done in batch mode or real time and the numbers processed can be in the 100's of thousands and include not only banks but all credit cards, insurance, utilities.
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2012
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  11. olley

    olley Funster

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    Just found this from Comforts insurance:

    Long Term Touring & Full Timing

    13. This policy is subject to the following conditions:
    Policyholders must maintain a full UK residence, either through ownership or long term rental agreement (of at least 9 months) unless a full-timing rate has been agreed and paid.

    The address shown on the Schedule must be the one at which the policyholder is on the electoral roll, (unless a full-timing rate has been agreed and paid) and also the one that appears on the driving licence and vehicle documentation.

    The motor caravan must at all times have a valid MOT certificate (unless not required due to age of the vehicle) and current UK road fund licence & tax disc.

    Should a copy of a utility bill (as evidence of residence at the address) be requested at any time (inception, mid-term, renewal, in the event of a claim) then one must be provided.


    Ian
     
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  12. slobadoberbob

    slobadoberbob Read Only Funster

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    both my kids had issues

    My daughter had an issue when they switched to a multi car deal with Admiral .. they insured the two cars they .. all of a sudden they cancelled the insurance .. no notice .. saying they had not declared a speeding offence .. previously (this was declared and she had proof but dod not stop them cancelling the insurance).. had to get cover elsewhere at short notice.... turn out cheaper.. Our son had not managed to send the proof in of NCB with in the time.. it was posted and arrived late.. again just cancelled the insurance. Both took the premiums paid and one demanded more.

    Seems to be a thing going on at the moment of insurance companies and the way it conducts business.

    I have been with Safeguard on m RV for a number of years now and both my cars have been with ensure for over 10 years.. I do get tempted to hunt about for a deal .. but it is this kind of story that puts me off.

    I can understand insurance companies that get up set when someone is a full timer and tells them they are not, or try and work a fast one with insuring it at a family members home.. they put that person at risk if they knew (call conspiracy - and is a criminal matter) and of course the person who does it is also committing a criminal act knowing they have 'obtained a pecuniary advantage' Theft Act. But people do not think of the issues when they do this.

    I suspect there are a fair few on this site with there head in the sand.

    If you move to France then you need to insure in France.. you no longer live in the UK. You sold up and left.. I am not surprised the insurance company are not keen on the matter of you having UK insurance on vehicles that are used now on the French roads every day..

    Bob
     
  13. vwalan

    vwalan Funster

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    hi .the electoral role is easy got round .but providing a utility bill is very hard if you only rent a room or lodge with someone .you wouldnt ever have a utility bill in your name . only rent book or something similar.
    you may not be on the electoral role the first time you take insurance out with that company as you may have just moved there. but the second year or so you would be .
    unfortunately a few of us have been saying this for years . you pays your money you take a chance . i did full time years ago but got hassle i know others have had the same . thats why i am willing to say dont full time buy .rent just a small something .you can use it as an address . you are telling the truth . if you lie you get caught out . most learn it at an early age .
     
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  14. ShiftZZ

    ShiftZZ Funster Life Member

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    Bob
    I agree with you regarding the conspiracy bit, the message getting through is one of "lets get it on the cheap, no one will know" and they have been found out.

    I for one an happy with Admiral, they have given me no issues at all, and my parents are happy because they are able to speak to them in Welsh..

    The conviction thing is one that will come to the forefront quicker than you think, there is one company that I know who is actively collecting criminal convictions to sell on to finance houses/banks/ insurance etc. if it works it may even reduce the premiums for the rest of us.

    Funsters should also be aware that companies regularly look at their employees Facebook and other Social network. I was involved in searching out individuals who were posting either inappropriately or during their hours of employment,

    One such case and individual was discussing issues he had with a security firewall which he posted on an open forum with screen humps of the current settings.
    Another was setting up meets for friends when he was going to be off sick..

    The sheer amount of data that is being captured and used is huge and if anyone thinks that industry is not going to use it to their advantage is a fool.

    One short story, a man was working for a company and on a regular basis, he would go off sick. I was asked to have a look and low and behold he was playing bowls for his local club, they had posted all the historic results going back years, a large number of them matched with his sick days.
    When he was questioned, it because apparent that he did not know that the results were published online...

    There is a danger as to far they can go? Medical records?
     
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  15. slobadoberbob

    slobadoberbob Read Only Funster

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    big brother at work

    Shifty it is big brother at work in the real time... it is worrying that so much is being gathered.

    As you know I am in France at the moment.. to get a wifi connection (purchased in 7 day blocks) I have to produce my passport for the number to be recorded.

    I already provided on arrival my camping carnet and my ACSI card... they hang on to them while you are on site.. paying for my dues on departure. But I do not know why they need to record my passport details.. and as I do not speak French and I am not going to start another ..ask Frankie / egg / true post.. I will have to stay here in ignorance as to why... if I renew my use for further periods (1 week is the most at a time) I have to take my passport up to the office again and do it all over.:Sad:


    Bob
     
  16. ShiftZZ

    ShiftZZ Funster Life Member

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    I agree too much data is being asked for, an example is buying a new TV, they ask for name address etc for the Government, I told the girl that I could give you any old address, she agreed but they have to fill in the form..

    Quite often when on the phone companies will ask for e-mail address and mobile phone numbers etc, I always refuse and then they get umpty. Ok, tru me@home.com, they are then happy..
    The world has gone crazy, they ask for or demand more and more and as far as I can see we are no better off, you still get junk mail, still get Ranji from India on the phone, and crap Customer service for Tesco. nothing changes.
     
  17. GJH

    GJH Funster Life Member

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    It is absolutely correct that companies often ask for personal data that they cannot provide a justifiable reason for (often contrary to the Data Protection Act). What is even worse is that, when challenged, their employees (especially in call centres working from strict scripts) have simply not been trained in data protection and are not aware they may be breaking the law - indeed may (wrongly) even give "data protection" as the reason why they want the information in the first place.

    Having said that, where companies have legitimately collected information then they are allowed to use it for the stated purposes. That some do so to prevent fraud is in the interests of all of us except fraudsters.

    As an aside. If I telephone a company to discuss my account I am happy to provide proof (address or date of birth for example) of who I am. I am not, however, prepared to supply such information to somebody who rings up from a company because they want to discuss my account (normally to sell me something) - they could be anybody from anywhere.
     
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  18. Landy lover

    Landy lover Funster

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    Totally agree - I had a call a couple of weeks ago from someone perporting to be from a credit card company that I had an account with - they tried to get details off me and when I refused to speak with them they told me they would block my card until I was prepared to talk with them. Told them to carry on. Rang off and phoned the card company security section to complain and advise and was told no one had phoned and confirmed that the questions asked by the caller would be be asked by them :Eeek:

    Just how many people get caught out by this sort of scam
     
  19. ShiftZZ

    ShiftZZ Funster Life Member

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    Social Engineering at its best
     
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