I have a cunning plan. (1 Viewer)

[The Wallace]

The French eat Frogs snails and horses and pee

What a mucky lot!

Looking forward to my next visit

 

[barryd]

Barryd. "You can’t be serious"

One other point. The French eat Frogs snails and horses and pee at the side of the road. We barryd are not French and this is definitely not France.

Yep they do. They are also far better behaved than us and have more respect for their environment and the facilities that are provided for them. You open up an Aire over here and allow caravans on it and it will be full of P1ssed up chavs before you can say tugger! Especially if its free. Watch the council close it down in 24 hours, not that they would have opened it in the first place if your condsidering letting caravans on it.

Im not having a pop at Caravan owners as the majority of them are just like the majority of MH owners, nice law obiding people. All I am saying is that Caravans are the weapon of choice for gypsies and are affordable for low lifes. Just mention free caravan parking to mr Council and he will run for the hills gathering up his children on the way. In Teesdale where I live we are plagued each year by gypsies travelling too and from Appleby Horse Fair. They cost our local councils thousands and they are a real problem.

Now if you try and portray a nice picture of a well healed retired couple in a £60K Kontiki then you may, just may have a chance.

 

[buttons]

not keen on snails, [or whelks for that matter] but what's the problem with the rest of the list
they haven't seen their currency devalue at breakneck rate in the last year either
they can get fresh bread at civilised hours
they appear to have more civic pride - certainly their towns and villages invariably appear cleaner and tidier
their diesel is a better price
they weren't stupid enough to support GWB and his plonkers
they welcome motorhomes
they're a republicthere are undoubtedly many things that are not so good in France - but give credit where and when it is duevive la difference, and cherry pick the best bits :thumb:

So you agree then twooks. They are different.:thumb:

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[6pm Cowboy]

Didn't I do well ? nearly 30 posts before this thread went off track.

 

[JayDee]

Didn't I do well ? nearly 30 posts before this thread went off track.

Could be a record?


John

 

[twooks]

Could be a record?


John

but who's counting

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Euromobil]

Problem with approaching councils is you have to pursuade them one at a time. Following the French example where firms like Super U now have 'service points' for about 2euro would it be worth approaching the supermarket chains about installing them, they at least can see a commerial opportunity from having us in their car park. Once you can convince Head Office the whole chain follows

 

[GregM]

Excuse my cynicism but why would local councils risk upsetting the majority of the voting population just to satisfy a few rich motor home owners.

Rich? speak for yourself, not all MH owners are rich, I know we are far from it.

Now if you try and portray a nice picture of a well healed retired couple in a £60K Kontiki then you may, just may have a chance.

Until I turn up in my £25k Autoquest, in my 40's and wearing my turquoise shell suit, with the wife and 3 kids and dog.

Seriously though, if Motorhomers themselves believe only rich people who can afford £60k have motorhomes then how are we going to convince others that we should be allowed to stop for cheap/free. If you are 'rich' then pay your £10 at a camp site.

 

[john-A]

For what its worth

I say good on you Graham, The 6pm Cowboy if you dont try you will never succeed.:thumb:

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[twooks]

Rich? speak for yourself, not all MH owners are rich, I know we are far from it.



Until I turn up in my £25k Autoquest, in my 40's and wearing my turquoise shell suit, with the wife and 3 kids and dog.

Seriously though, if Motorhomers themselves believe only rich people who can afford £60k have motorhomes then how are we going to convince others that we should be allowed to stop for cheap/free. If you are 'rich' then pay your £10 at a camp site.

if you've a big flash MH you're welcome - except you take up too much room n block the light - so go round the back
if you've a small /old MH you're a scrounger - won't spend any money - and will leave a mess - so keep on going


oops :Blush: sorry :Blush:

'I must be more positive'
'I must be more positive'
'I must be more positive'
'I must be more positive'
etc etc etc

 

[imprint]

More heirs needed?

Well, Graham, if you want it pushed a bit further off track, I remarked to the senior partner that I was reading that Britain needed more heirs, and she said she'd done her duty and we should leave it to the youngsters....

 

[scotjimland]

Re: French Aires. Does anyone know how long they've been in existance? Did they start off on a local basis and then spread nationwide, or was it a Government incentive at some stage? Just wondered about the history of Aires, and how they came into being.

Hi

French aires have been in existence since Noah was a boy..

Seriously, don't know exactly, but it's a been long time, probably back to the 60s or 50s..

I do know the Mayor of the town ( like many things in France ) is responsible, he has the last say as to whether they stay open or not and sets the fee ( if applicable ) so it's not a Government incentive.

Motorhomes (Camping cars ) are a French national institution, there are over 1,000,000 registered in France ..not sure about the UK, I'm guessing around 150,000 . ?

Stating the obvious here, but Britain isn't France and never will be, they have a totally different attitude toward motorhomes, and until that changes in the UK I seriously doubt we will ever have anything like the French aires network..
That's not to say we shouldn't try and there will be successes stories, as in Canterbury, but a national network won't happen in my lifetime.:Sad:

jim

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[pappajohn]

GYPSIES !!
TRAVELLERS !!

i have to agree with twooks on this.

my opinion....

the primary reason for carpark height barriers is to stop 'travellers' from entering and staying for many days/weeks, or until the courts issue 'git orf moy larnd' papers.
strange how they always know when this is imminent and move the day before !!!! (do they have moles on the councils ) resulting in more wasted cost to the local council :Angry:

the secondary reason is to stop larger vehicles ie: transits, coach's, motorhomes etc, entering.

the name is a giveaway......CAR park.

 

[buttons]

Rich? speak for yourself, not all MH owners are rich, I know we are far from it. Until I turn up in my £25k Autoquest, in my 40's and wearing my turquoise shell suit, with the wife and 3 kids and dog.
Seriously though, if Motorhomers themselves believe only rich people who can afford £60k have motorhomes then how are we going to convince others that we should be allowed to stop for cheap/free. If you are 'rich' then pay your £10 at a camp site.

Umm...25k Sorry GregM not suitable.

Im not having a pop at Caravan owners All I am saying is that Caravans are the weapon of choice for gypsies and are affordable for low lifes. Now if you try and portray a nice picture of a well healed couple in a £60K Kontiki then you may, just may have a chance.

And if the council are not convinced with that barryd then give them a copy of this, they are exactly what you are describing. Nice family, kids 60k new motor home. It portrays the perfect candidates for your free parking spots bril.:welcome:
Link Removed

 

[twooks]

actually I meant that that was the reasons I'd been given in the past - as a knee jerk reaction a cop out that saves the person saying no having to engage brain - not that I thought it likely that they'd want to move in enbloc to a tarmaced area;
no grass for the horses

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[pappajohn]

See Here for the full list of places I know of. Note, not all are council facilities so follow the links to check before quoting. Otherwise, please make free use of the information.

Graham

i notice north yorks aint on the list graham.......you need to shout louder....our local leaders have selective deafness.

 

[twooks]

you could always claim successes in Guisborough
it's the North Riding after all

 

[GJH]

Problem with approaching councils is you have to pursuade them one at a time. Following the French example where firms like Super U now have 'service points' for about 2euro would it be worth approaching the supermarket chains about installing them, they at least can see a commerial opportunity from having us in their car park. Once you can convince Head Office the whole chain follows

Even less enthusiastic than councils in my experience - see Here (lack of) responses to enquiries I sent three years ago

Graham

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[GJH]

i notice north yorks aint on the list graham.......you need to shout louder....our local leaders have selective deafness.

you could always claim successes in Guisborough
it's the North Riding after all

You two can fight it out between yourselves Being from the correct (as opposed to right - look on a map) side of the Pennines, Tykeland has nowt to do wi' me

Graham

 

[buttons]

Stating the obvious here, but Britain isn't France and never will be, they have a totally different attitude toward motorhomes,
jim

That’s repetition Jim but very true

 

[twooks]

You two can fight it out between yourselves Being from the correct (as opposed to right - look on a map) side of the Pennines, Tykeland has nowt to do wi' me

Graham

wouldn't've thought left or right more slap bang in the middle,




[post count on this thread getting wilder innit ]

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[ArenqueRojo]

I wish you all success with your campaign, 6pm Cowboy.
My suggestion would be:
1. Approach the council officers via their tourism section. They have a vested interest that is with you.
2. Talk to the local Chamber of Commerce. Their voice is never ignored and they represent the traders who stand to gain.
3. The issue relating to "travellers" is a red herring as the sort of facilities you are suggesting are not likely to attract them and the council officers will know that. As in most Western European countries, the rules for overnight stops are about no furniture or awnings outside the van. This is the ruling that allows the police to avoid many of the abuses that would otherwise occur.
4. Money is what drives all the decisions. If you can give the highways department estimated revenues to themselves or the local traders which exceeds the running and enforcement costs, they are bound to consider it.
5. When contacting the authorities, try and get the conversation as far up the hierarchy as possible to start with. I would do the homework to suss out the lay of the land with the tourism and highways, followed by the Chamber, then put the proposal direct to the Chief Executive. He/she will immediately delegate it but the officer who gets it to deal with will feel that the CEO is watching...

Lastly, use the local press at the right time. Don't go public until you have something positive from the powers that be. Once you have that, get the local press to run a positive story by giving them a pre-written story yourself - with pictures. They are a lazy bunch, usually and will take any gift-horses they can get. Once they have come out positively, they will find it very difficult to do an about face.

I think you can get some good done if you are willing to stick with it and not let the nay-sayers get you down. It will take (a lot) of your retirement time off your hands...

Patrick

 

[Reallyretired]

Maybe not original but obviously not being done.

Question – What is Britain sadly missing ?
Answer – Aires.

Question – Is it worth trying to get them ?
Answer – Probably not. The cost of laying on sewage disposal etc would put any council off.

But that doesn’t mean we should do nothing. There are alternatives.

Just down the road from my house in a small Oxfordshire village is a small car park ( maybe 30 cars ). It sits on the banks of the river Thames with good fishing and pleasant walks along the towpath in both directions. 200 yards away is a nice pub that does good meals A market town is only 1 hours stroll along the river. It would make an ideal stopover for touring motorhomes ( and caravans – ducking ) but there is a hieght barrier and anti sleeping notice on the car park.

Scenes like this must be repeated all over the country. Useful / scenic / conveinient / economy boosting places that frequently sit empty overnight just because of some ‘pointless’ rule.

Equally there must be thousands of inner/outer city car parks, park and rides, detached lay byes, etc, etc, all over the country that could be allowed / converted to suitable tourist stopovers at ZERO cost to councils or whoever.

They would have none of the facilities of a proper campsite. They would not be considered wild camping by most people…. But they would, I suspect, be welcommed by many.

I have retirement creeping up on me and I need something to think about, something to do, and maybe a small cost covering income otherwise, motorhome or no, I am going to vegitate into a grumpy and even more insular old man.

So I am going to start a campaign to get some of these underutilised spaces turned into ‘authourised stopovers’ and produce a book / cd / poi for general use. It will take a while, and build up slowly but I thinnk it is a good long term project.

Fire away folks.

I wish you well. While I think the odds are stacked against you, there is no surer way to fail than not to try in the first place:thanks2:

 

[6pm Cowboy]

I wish you all success with your campaign, 6pm Cowboy.
My suggestion would be:
1. Approach the council officers via their tourism section. They have a vested interest that is with you.
2. Talk to the local Chamber of Commerce. Their voice is never ignored and they represent the traders who stand to gain.
3. The issue relating to "travellers" is a red herring as the sort of facilities you are suggesting are not likely to attract them and the council officers will know that. As in most Western European countries, the rules for overnight stops are about no furniture or awnings outside the van. This is the ruling that allows the police to avoid many of the abuses that would otherwise occur.
4. Money is what drives all the decisions. If you can give the highways department estimated revenues to themselves or the local traders which exceeds the running and enforcement costs, they are bound to consider it.
5. When contacting the authorities, try and get the conversation as far up the hierarchy as possible to start with. I would do the homework to suss out the lay of the land with the tourism and highways, followed by the Chamber, then put the proposal direct to the Chief Executive. He/she will immediately delegate it but the officer who gets it to deal with will feel that the CEO is watching...

Lastly, use the local press at the right time. Don't go public until you have something positive from the powers that be. Once you have that, get the local press to run a positive story by giving them a pre-written story yourself - with pictures. They are a lazy bunch, usually and will take any gift-horses they can get. Once they have come out positively, they will find it very difficult to do an about face.

I think you can get some good done if you are willing to stick with it and not let the nay-sayers get you down. It will take (a lot) of your retirement time off your hands...

Patrick

Thank you Patrick. That was a very helpful and thought provoking post.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[6pm Cowboy]

Errrr, Ummmm, quick, think of something else to say before the thread disappears off the bottom of the page.

Anymore suggestions anyone ?

yeah, bit lame but that will get um posting again.

 

[nozzmoking]

Hi

French aires have been in existence since Noah was a boy..

Seriously, don't know exactly, but it's a been long time, probably back to the 60s or 50s..

I do know the Mayor of the town ( like many things in France ) is responsible, he has the last say as to whether they stay open or not and sets the fee ( if applicable ) so it's not a Government incentive.

Motorhomes (Camping cars ) are a French national institution, there are over 1,000,000 registered in France ..not sure about the UK, I'm guessing around 150,000 . ?

Stating the obvious here, but Britain isn't France and never will be, they have a totally different attitude toward motorhomes, and until that changes in the UK I seriously doubt we will ever have anything like the French aires network..
That's not to say we shouldn't try and there will be successes stories, as in Canterbury, but a national network won't happen in my lifetime.:Sad:

jim

Thanks for the explanation Jim! :thumb:

 

[twooks]

when in doubt resort to the
BBB principle
note however this is the exact opposite of the KISS principle
although it is frequently abused by politicians and others of that ilk a true master of the BBB art can amaze many people

do not recommend you adopt BBB in your approach to any councils
stick with KISS


merry wotsit one and all

page 8 !!!! and running

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[6pm Cowboy]

Being the naive and well brought up lad that I am I have no idea what BBB stands for.

 

[twooks]

just an excuse to bump up the post again really


Bull**1* Baffles Brains



innit





Keep It Simple Stupid





see

 

[6pm Cowboy]

BBB
of course.
I was tihinking along the right lines then
Best British bullXXXX

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}