How many people have the X250 Fiat without Judder ? (1 Viewer)

[knokinonabit]

No need to register its at bottom of page, but you need a chassis number.

Cheers, but I have registered anyway.

Going to try for info now.

 

[knokinonabit]

According to Fiat there is nothing wrong with the MH and there is no recall.
Guess I'll have to wait and see what NET&V say on Monday.
I know what I will say :Angry::shout::Mad:

 

[EthnGeoff]

I have a '09 250 3 litre auto...........Still the same engine.
Never had a hint of a judder.............I would go as far as saying it is a wonderful engine and a pure joy to drive especially in auto mode.

Its brilliant.

barry

I'll second the above, same year, same engine / gearbox and an absolute pleasure to drive. Also chain driven so no cambelt to worry about.
Geoff.

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[maxsdad]

No problem with judder on our 2011 2.3 although i think the reverse gear ratio is to high for the size of vehicle and still not convinced about the front wheel drive after our last rear wheel drive transit although the cab is far superior.

dave e

 

[Welsh girl]

2010 fiat 130 multijet, Tez says it's wonderful to drive. No judder on ours,I drive it for a while and it's a very nice drive.

 

[Detnor]

I have a 2009 3ltr manual - no judder and great to drive.
First MOT yesterday, no issues.

I remember being concerned when I bought it, a new Fiat...and a Hymer... and from Brownhills - that had to be dangerous, but the best motorhome I've owned.

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[maz]

2010 3 litre 6-speed auto - no judder. :thumb:

 

[Heyupluv]

I'll second the above, same year, same engine / gearbox and an absolute pleasure to drive. Also chain driven so no cambelt to worry about.
Geoff.

Geoff are you saying that all Fiat x250 2.3 multijet are chain driven (instead of cam belt)....that's something I didn't know:thumb:

I think it is always the same plenty of people want to tell you the bad bits.....but not the good bits about anything

 

[andyman]

Only the 3.0ltr is chain driven.

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[motorhomer]

I have had 2.
The first, a 3ltr 57plate (actually the peugeot) did not judder but reverse was far too high which meant lots of clutch slipping - not good for the longevity of the clutch!

Swapped for a 11 plate fiat 2.3. This is fine. Reverse is much lower so much less clutch slipping, altogether better.

Incidentally, whilst obvously slower than the 3 ltr, performance of the 2.3 is perfectly adequate, and by getting the 2.3 I saved 50kg weight not to mention about £2000!

These are super vans to drive.

 

[ourcampersbeentrashed]

When looking at motorhomes this year we found loads of newer fiats with the rear judder varying from 2008 to 2011.

For anyone buying make sure you test drive in reverse uphill before buying. That saved us making a huge mistake.

 

[robnchris]

reverse judder

If you have a Fiat X/250 engine with a 6sp manual gearbox then you have the reverse gear judder problem simple as that.
The reason the judder is there is because the engine revs are too high because of the high gear ratios when reverse gear is selected, basically the gears are small in diameter to fit all those 7 gears into the gearbox housing.
The modification was to fit a larger reverse gear thus reducing the gear ratio and preventing the excessive clutch slip and judder.
Fiat did a fix for the smaller 2.3ltr engine but didn`t have a fix for the 3ltr so if you have a 3 ltr engine you`re stuck with the problem.
The auto gearbox didn`t suffer from this problem, the problem was finally fixed in all models whith the introduction of the euro 5 engine.

Look up Andy Stothert and his campaign to bring this farce to the medias and Fiats attention.

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[knokinonabit]

It looks as though I will have a fight on my hands on Monday at North East Truck and Van when I try to convince them that something, that is not my doing, is wrong.
If Fiat won't acknowledge that there is a problem does that mean I have to wait until the clutch fails to get anything done ?
If that is the case then the MH is going to be going backwards uphill until there is a failure and before the warranty expires.
I reversed it onto the levellers in my drive the other day and the vibration was horrendous.
It would seem that the only alternative is to go forwards everywhere

 

[knokinonabit]

Further to the clutch judder problem.

As a lot of people have stated the 2.3 engine has a fix.
After many phone calls to Fiat it seems that the 3.0ltr engine doesn't.
The official answer is to "apply more revs" to prevent the judder.
No mention of what is happening to the clutch under these circumstances, and not ideal when manouvering onto the levellers.

At least I have a reference number and the problem is logged, so any future breakdowns will be their (Fiat) problem.

 

[greygit]

If you have a Fiat X/250 engine with a 6sp manual gearbox then you have the reverse gear judder problem simple as that.
The reason the judder is there is because the engine revs are too high because of the high gear ratios when reverse gear is selected, basically the gears are small in diameter to fit all those 7 gears into the gearbox housing.
The modification was to fit a larger reverse gear thus reducing the gear ratio and preventing the excessive clutch slip and judder.
Fiat did a fix for the smaller 2.3ltr engine but didn`t have a fix for the 3ltr so if you have a 3 ltr engine you`re stuck with the problem.
The auto gearbox didn`t suffer from this problem, the problem was finally fixed in all models whith the introduction of the euro 5 engine.

Look up Andy Stothert and his campaign to bring this farce to the medias and Fiats attention.

I agree with the above, until Fiat re-design the gearbox the judder will be there, we have a January registered Chausson and it judders quite badly on inclines.
Because we have had so many problems with this vehicle we are exchanging it for a new Rapido this Friday, When I asked the sales person about the Fiat judder he stated that Fiat had cured that problem ages ago......No they haven't!!......will be interesting next Friday.

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[beachcaster]

Is it just me and my X250 but Ive tried all I can to make it judder
but it just wont !!!

barry

 

[greygit]

Is it just me and my X250 but Ive tried all I can to make it judder
but it just wont !!!

barry

If so you are very lucky

 

[bailey]

If you have a Fiat X/250 engine with a 6sp manual gearbox then you have the reverse gear judder problem simple as that.
The reason the judder is there is because the engine revs are too high because of the high gear ratios when reverse gear is selected, basically the gears are small in diameter to fit all those 7 gears into the gearbox housing.
The modification was to fit a larger reverse gear thus reducing the gear ratio and preventing the excessive clutch slip and judder.
Fiat did a fix for the smaller 2.3ltr engine but didn`t have a fix for the 3ltr so if you have a 3 ltr engine you`re stuck with the problem.
The auto gearbox didn`t suffer from this problem, the problem was finally fixed in all models whith the introduction of the euro 5 engine.



Look up Andy Stothert and his campaign to bring this farce to the medias and Fiats attention.

Nonsense i have a 3lt man 6 speed from new 08 model beel all over the uk and have had no problems in fact the fiat eng is the best i have ever driven

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[greygit]

Nonsense i have a 3lt man 6 speed from new 08 model beel all over the uk and have had no problems in fact the fiat eng is the best i have ever driven

I agree that the engine is very good but if you think you haven't got a shudder try reversing up a steep hill.

 

[knokinonabit]

Nonsense i have a 3lt man 6 speed from new 08 model beel all over the uk and have had no problems in fact the fiat eng is the best i have ever driven

There is nothing wrong with the engine at all.
It's at low revs on an incline in reverse, and at times going forward.
Increasing the revs helps to eliminate it, but overall vehicle control suffers, plus you are then risking damaging the clutch.
With a diesel engine it should be possible to manouvre on tickover, regardless of the size of the vehicle.

I have been a driving instructor and HGV driver for longer than I care to remember and low speed manouvres have never been a problem to me, until now, with this particular vehicle.

 

[wiljoy]

As above, I find its easy to search for people with the Fiat reverse judder problems and this could easily put me off buying a new motorhome.

So I would like to get a balanced view from those that have the newer chassis and have no real problems.

I love the more modern shape and would try to stretch to this model if I could satisfy myself of its reliability. I dont want something thats in and out of the garage while they cant find anything wrong !

In 2008 we were due to change vehicles and hesitated on the new Fiat/Peuget range. We had ALL the problems when they redesigned a few years earlier.
After much thought we decided to dive in and bought a 3 litre variation on the Peugeot, very bad move. Within a week a slight vibration started on reverse. After a trip to the dealer we were assured it was purely the 4.5 ton it had to push backwards, what crap.
Afew months later and 4000 miles it was much worse, and back to the dealer. Peugeot sent a so called technician, that's a laugh, to check it out. His conclusion was that the clutch was fine but he would mark my records to show a problem had been reported and if ANY clutch related problems came to light in the future I would be ok.
As i approached my 17th. yes 17th, recall the clutch was still an issue but they would not do anything to cure the problem.
After 12,000 miles the dreaded slip started. This was mainly in 6th gear at about 2200 rpm when the engine was just starting to labour. Once again I visited the dealer who had been reading the Peugeot/Fiat book of excuses. He now stated that as the vehicle had covered 12,000 miles it was a reasonable time for a motorhome clutch to last.
This base vehicle was a total load of rubbish and with yet another recall for a recall we decided to search for a non Sevel vehicle and went with a Renault. Now, after 7000 miles in 10 months and NO recalls or problems we are well delighted. It is returning over 30 mpg and at nearly 4 tonne is very good. It drives smooth and quiet so in future I will NEVER buy a Sevel based vehicle, why have the hassle.

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[beachcaster]

Look up Andy Stothert and his campaign to bring this farce to the medias and Fiats attention.

I have the "auto" box in my X250..but its not a proper auto . its a computer controlled gear change. So if the ratios and gear box are the same why no judder with this auto ?

As I have said I can reverse back up a steep hill slowly with total control and no judder at all.

I think its a lovely gearbox and a great relaxing engine to drive

barry

 

[frogijock]

I have a 2010 X250 and sofar all has been ok :thumb:

 

[bailey]

There is nothing wrong with the engine at all.
It's at low revs on an incline in reverse, and at times going forward.
Increasing the revs helps to eliminate it, but overall vehicle control suffers, plus you are then risking damaging the clutch.
With a diesel engine it should be possible to manouvre on tickover, regardless of the size of the vehicle.

I have been a driving instructor and HGV driver for longer than I care to remember and low speed manouvres have never been a problem to me, until now, with this particular vehicle.

As i said in my last post i have been all over The uk done 15000 miles up and down all sorts of inclines no problems

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[bailey]

I agree that the engine is very good but if you think you haven't got a shudder try reversing up a steep hill.

I must be lucky 15000 miles most in the north of Scotland up and down all sorts of hills no problems i can reverse even on tick over

 

[robnchris]

I have the "auto" box in my X250..but its not a proper auto . its a computer controlled gear change. So if the ratios and gear box are the same why no judder with this auto ?

As I have said I can reverse back up a steep hill slowly with total control and no judder at all.

I think its a lovely gearbox and a great relaxing engine to drive

barry

I have no idea, though I do know from my own experience of driving the x250 with the 3L engine coupled to a manual gearbox that there is a design fault in the size of the reverse gear used.
The clutch itself isn't a problem, the judder occurs when reversing uphill and or on wet grass.

This isn't a case of one vehicle has the fault and one doesn't.
They all have it, Fiat did after a lot of bad publicity come up with a redesigned bell housing and gear cluster for the 2.3L engines, for whatever reason they didn't offer the same solution for the 3L engined vehicles.

There has been lots of press about this problem and Fiat did in the end accept there was a fault with the 6sp manual gearbox, so much so the fixed the 2.3L under a warranty recall and then modified both the 2.3 and 3L in the euro 5 engined vehicles,.
Sadly some people bought newly registered vehicles beliveing them to be the latest euro 5's but they were actually the old euro 4 model.

 

[robnchris]

I have the "auto" box in my X250..but its not a proper auto . its a computer controlled gear change. So if the ratios and gear box are the same why no judder with this auto ?

As I have said I can reverse back up a steep hill slowly with total control and no judder at all.

I think its a lovely gearbox and a great relaxing engine to drive

barry

Oh just a thought how many forward gears does your auto box have?

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[robnchris]

Nonsense i have a 3lt man 6 speed from new 08 model beel all over the uk and have had no problems in fact the fiat eng is the best i have ever driven

You are I'll informed historical data does show that all x250 based vehicles with a manual gearbox upto the Euro 5 engined vehicle were fitted with too high a ratio in reverse gear.

This is a fact that both Peugeot and finally Fiat accepted.

The engine capabilities have never been in question.

 

[bailey]

You are I'll informed historical data does show that all x250 based vehicles with a manual gearbox upto the Euro 5 engined vehicle were fitted with too high a ratio in reverse gear.

This is a fact that both Peugeot and finally Fiat accepted.

The engine capabilities have never been in question.

Do you have the Fiat as i said i have had the Fiat 3 lt 6 speed from new done 15000 miles on all types of road and have never had any problems with reverse where i stay requires a steep incline to my drive in and i have to reverse again no problems Also when this judder first came up while it was still under warrenty i along with the Fiat dealer tried everthing to bring this judder on nothing happened the best outfit i have ever had and Also i have spoken to several owners and they are of the same opinion

 

[knokinonabit]

I have the "auto" box in my X250..but its not a proper auto . its a computer controlled gear change. So if the ratios and gear box are the same why no judder with this auto ?

As I have said I can reverse back up a steep hill slowly with total control and no judder at all.

I think its a lovely gearbox and a great relaxing engine to drive

barry

Not having any knowledge of your particular gearbox I have to ask if you have a clutch ?
If not then you have a fluid clutch (oil) and will probably not have any judder.
As has been stated several times, it is the six speed manual gearbox that is the cause of the problems.

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