Honest reviews

Discussion in 'Motorhome Chat' started by ShiftZZ, Nov 19, 2012.

  1. ShiftZZ

    ShiftZZ Funster Life Member

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    After reading yesterdays postings, it got me wondering about 'reviews' and are they worth anything....
    Forget the 'individuals' concerned in yesterdays thread, consider reviews in general...

    A) If we have had a bad experience and we post within the 1st x number of postings, we will or could be regarded as a troll, so how many postings give you any credibility?

    B) I have used a number of 'outlets' and 'individuals' who have given both good and bad service, should I therefore publish my thoughts or do as many do on here 'never use their service again'.

    C) By publishing a bad report you could destroy someone's business on the other hand you could prevent someone going to a particular supplier and having a poor job done, or below expectations..
    This is a difficult decision, you may know the individual, he/she/they may attend meets/shows etc.
    So what is the right thing to do?
    I have had both good and bad experiences and the bad ones I have not posted on here, having had the 'shoddy' work sorted out by another company.
    Is that not a coward's way out?
    Name and shame is a high risk approach, but what is the best way?

    I for one will no longer use certain individuals or companies and I suspect that the 'certificates/awards' whatever mean very little in the real world, I remember Tofo and his issues with an engine being repaired and him suffering a large loss, it may appear that you are getting a good deal but is it a good deal in the long run?

    The dealer/franchise that I use now, I have faith in, they have fully trained staff, who give expert knowledge and on the number of occasions I have used them have 'come in under budget' and that pleased me. They allow me to sit in a warm waiting area, TV, free coffee and I feel respected.,

    Lastly, I have spoken to a number of Funsters over the years and asked them questions and who did what work on their vans, I was using a tried and trusted method of getting 1st hand recommendations. I did use one and the work was not as I expected and when I discussed it with the Funster who recommended him/her/them and showed him/her/them the work undertaken they were shocked and said they would never use them again.
    This is a difficult subject and I suspect that there is no easy answer, there are ‘cowboys’ out there who will do the work and earn a quick buck and no doubt there are ‘cowboys’ who have fancy workshops and nice ‘waiting areas’. So there is as I said no easy answer, but offering good and bad reviews, HONESTLY is that a real option?
     
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  2. Terry

    Terry Funster

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    The only answer for me is I don't recommend people or firms that do not do a good job for me.As to the price of what is being done I always ask the price before any work is done and if they hit a problem they have to inform me of any additional costs (very rarely happens) I find it easy to tell people that there's no one I can recommend but you could try so and so who have done a good job before BUT :BigGrin:
    Terry
    Edit if they do bad job they do not last long around here, word soon spreads
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2012
  3. Jim

    Jim Ringleader

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    Re your Point A.

    There is no set number of posts. If someone posts libellous comments then I am very vulnerable as I am considered the publisher and may have to, at considerable cost, prove what you say is true or be punished for it.

    If the comments are true, then I might save a Funster some grief by allowing them to stay, if they are libellous, then I risk losing my house defending it. But why should I take that risk?
     
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  4. Chris

    Chris Funster Life Member

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    I would only post positive reviews on here I think.

    If I got a bad service from someone it could be a one off and to sully their name in thiose circumstances is unfair.

    The Lord McAlpine situation serves as a reminder to be careful what you post I guess.
     
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  5. ShiftZZ

    ShiftZZ Funster Life Member

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    See it’s not easy.. Having said that, if we only publish 'good' reviews then that is as bad as publishing bad ones...

    I realise the consequences of bad reviews, but, if that is your view than are you not entitled to publish that, or , is it that both expectations were miles apart?

    Let me try this one....

    If someone you asked to do something, let’s say put a bracket on a wall, the said person/company does attach the bracket to the wall but uses 4 different types and sizes of screws (yes its true) would you describe that as good or bad job?

    Yes he/she/they did attach the said bracket, but not to what standard that one would have accepted. But, 4 screws were used and the said bracket was attached... You may or may not discover this until a later date, so would you ask the same person/organisation to fix the issue or would you just ignore it and allow that person/company to continue the way they work?

    In my view/opinion that may comply with the request, but, fails to demonstrate any level of professionalism and therefore you can/should begin to doubt their level of aptitude?
    On the other hand if you published a good report when the work was not good is that equally bad? Could it be that we don’t allow any reviews at all as they may be misleading at best?
    Just a thought…
     
  6. Snowbird

    Snowbird Funster Life Member

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    Thats the problem dear boy....If only good revues are allowed then surely they don't mean a thing. To make a balanced decision on anything you need a balanced revue.
    Not much point having any revues if your only allowed to post good ones.
     
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  7. aba

    aba

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    the other thing that can make it harder is the fact that we as humans are all different and as such we all have differing levels of whats acceptable.

    some have things done to their houses and pay thousands and are happy with the results where as someone else can have the exact same job done to the exact same standard and think its over priced and shoddy.

    as another example 2 people go out and but the exact same model of motorhome to the point they were sequencial build numbers.

    customer 1 has the door handle break off after 2 years and thinks well ok its good it lasted this long.
    customer 2 has the door handle break off after 3 years and thinks what a load of crap i paid x thousand pounds for it it should last longer than that.

    the supplying dealer sorts out and fits replacements free of charge

    customer 1 is giving praise for the dealer and is happy with his motorhome
    customer 2 praises the dealer but wont ever buy another motorhome off that manufacturer.

    we all have different standards.
     
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  8. Reallyretired

    Reallyretired Funster

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    I see nothing wrong in reporting good or bad service as long as it is factual and backed up by evidence e.g. photos.
    If some one has an off day and does a bad job, they should be offered the opportunity of rectifying it, and their response to this must be included in the review to give a balanced view.
     
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  9. Terry

    Terry Funster

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    You have answered your own question Dave :BigGrin:They fixed the bracket for you but do you consider the use of 4 different screws unprofessional ? depends on lots of things ,what is behind the bracket to fix to ? it could be the first screw got a good hold and the others did not hence using different screws -- they could have told you at the time why :BigGrin:All you can do is report as you find -yep the fixer bodged it :Rofl1::BigGrin: but at least you would have known why,and the bracket got fixed :BigGrin:
    terry
     
  10. hilldweller

    hilldweller Funster Life Member

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    Are not not running this under a limited company ?
     
  11. ShiftZZ

    ShiftZZ Funster Life Member

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    I half agree Terry, all 4 screws were different, Length, diameter, heads and they were not all new. You would have thought that some professional pride would have kicked in? Nope.
    I have seen some work done by others and examples of things not level, not straight, not clearing up after themselves.
    When we bought Horace, van number 2 it was from Broadlane just outside Warwick, they were advised of some issues that we had identified and they sorted them out. When the van suffered a sheered bolt in the Turbo on the way back from France, they arranged to have the work undertaken at a Ford dealer, no questions asked. From that point there was no issues and I would have bought another van from them, you could not fault them.

    The current van we bought, we did the deal and then agreed to leave it for a month to have the issues sorted out, when we picked up the van, some of the items were not done, the pre delivery check had been left to son number 2, who could not be bothered, not wanting to valet the van he just plonked down some brown paper to cover the floor, there were other issues (mostly minor) and I wrote to the owner including pictures. A prime example was a cracked flyscreen cover on the roof vent, I sent pictures with the serial and model numbers etc, they still could not identify the part, I wrote to the manufacturers and it turns out that the part was a standard part, nothing out of the ordinary. There was a missing tray in the fridge that took 3 attempts to get a replacement, you would have thought that with the serial number and model number it would have been easy, NO.

    I posted pictures of the van on MHF and another Funster recognised the dealer and contacted me, same issues, long list of delays etc and bad attitude from the ‘sons’. Same issues….
    Now all the issues were eventually sorted out, but, they should have been picked up at the time, they were not and if you have to drive 100’s of miles because they did not do their job in the 1st place would you feel happy posting a negative review?
     
  12. Terry

    Terry Funster

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    Simply post an honest review (like you have) then people can make there own opinions :Wink:i.e. buy off the old man not the son :BigGrin:
    Wherever you buy you get differences in aftercare (it should not happen but does)
    Why do you think I self build :BigGrin: if I had spent 1, 000s on a van that was not right I am afraid I would be locked up for what I had done to the dealer :BigGrin:
    Years ago I agreed to buy a new car and when I got into my own car to drive away SWMBO said she did not want it :Doh:Went straight back in to say do not want it :Smile:Sales manager said I had to have it and would deliver and post keys through letterbox :BigGrin:After I DRAGGED him over his desk and ripped up all paperwork he agreed with me :thumb: not that he could say much at the time :BigGrin:
    Terry
     
  13. sedge

    sedge Funster

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    You never know, even when a person is kind-of known to you (such as other members of this forum) whether they have any axes to grind. do you?

    Or what they've done to exacerbate or expedite, the problem? Unless you were there.

    I had to laugh this morning actually. Two poor reviews of a company that used to have two sites, and no other comments.

    The first said they'd closed down their other branch so were clearly not a comany to buy anything from at the moment. (Why did they close their other branch? Did they find the extra sales didn't cover the cost of running it? Did they sack everyone at a minute's notice or redeploy them all and pay all their relocation costs?)

    The other was re a vehicle purchased (in Bham) that the buyer had taken to Dublin. He said it had been standing on their forecourt for 18 months. It had broken down and he had to catch a bus to get his shopping. So the company couldn't be trusted. Ehhh? (We don't even know if it was new or second hand, hence how long the mechanical guarantee was for - neither do we know if the company was even contacted. How long had the guy had the thing? Did he leave the showroom and immediately depart for Ireland? Or what? And what had broken anyway?)

    Ridiculous ! :Rofl1:
     
  14. journeyman

    journeyman Read Only Funster

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    I think if a company gets enough reviews, most people can work out what is fair and balanced and what isn't. Yesterday's events were quickly negated by members telling a completely different story. So in that case the power of the web and the Dave's sound reputation in the industry from his customers won through.

    I use trip advisor religiously before booking hotels or holidays, I ignore the cranks and the zealots and look for common themes. These days I never end up staying in a place that I don't like. Some hoteliers don't like it, but often they don't seem to recognise their own failings. Remember the days before the WWW. How many of us were suckered by companies and individuals, hotels, plumbers, double glazers etc that offered expensive services, but failed miserably to deliver. The consumer now has the means to research the service providers.

    Long live the review, just read them carefully.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2012
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  15. thearchitect

    thearchitect Read Only Funster

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    Honest Reviews?

    I wonder if this is being approached from the wrong angle.

    A considered and objective review is intended to convey the customer's own interpretation or opinion of the received product or service.

    A well-written negative customer review can actually provide credibility. A product or service that has balanced reviews, even with some users complaining of faults, can often seem more credible than those with nothing but five-star reviews. Most businesses are likely to come up against negative reviews at some point and these should provide an opportunity to engage with their customers and to generate positive feedback. A negative review can also help businesses see where they are going wrong, show their customers that they are listening and in turn, help to create better consumer products or services.

    The key is to engage the suppliers and to give them the opportunity to reply, otherwise it can appear as just another subjective and unsubstantiated rant.
     
  16. Gromett

    Gromett Funster

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    I have a set of simple rules when it comes to posting negative complaints.
    1) I will only post after I have given the company the opportunity to fix the problem. Everyone has off days and mistakes are made even by the best of us. How a company deals with a complaint says more than it's usual services levels do.
    2) I will document the complaint and post evidence (with my personal details redacted)
    3) I never use pejorative expressions such as cowboy, rip off merchants etc. Keep it factual.
    4) I state clearly what my expectations were and how much I paid. This puts the complaint into context.

    I totally disregarded the recent complaint as it sounded like a rant by a new poster that may or may not be a competitor.. If he had gone back to Dave and experienced a blow off and had posted pictures and dates etc it would have lent credence to his rant.

    One persons unprofessional may also be another persons friendly. A good job in one persons eyes may be a rushed job for someone else.

    For instance I have seen a complaint by a customer of a company I use. They complained they left a mess. The reason the mess was left was the customer hadn't given enough time for the job to be completed and insisted on taking the vehicle on the dot at 5pm because he had to get home for 7.
    The customer wasn't prepared to drop the vehicle in at 9am and collect at 5pm he brought it in at 11pm and hovered all day constantly asking questions. This slowed the job down and they ended up having to rush it to get it done to the customers demanded schedule. The mess consisted of wood chips/dust and wire clippings. They literally didn't have time to hoover. This company now has a rule that they will quote a time for a job and if the customer can't fit in around that they won't do the job. This one customer has ruined the flexibility this company used to offer.


    I will disregard all complaints posted on the internet unless it has evidence.
     
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  17. darklord

    darklord Read Only Funster

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    You can get reverse publicity, purely by being recommended! Think of this, if Dave Bitss regularly gets rave reviews on a particular forum, and you never hear a bad report, but at the same time, you very seldom hear anyone else being recommended, would you take the reviews on face value?
    Loyalty, while being one of the things I hold very dear, can distort peoples perception of a service, which "CAN" lower standards or keep prices artificially high.
    My view is, that reviews are only valid, if they take into account the number of people providing a particular service, this forum has a "dealer review" section, where dealers are rated by people who have actually used them.
    This could be continued for other purchases, so that people could see geographically, where a service is provided and the review, this is much more valid and open.
    Continual reviews of a small number of service providors, may just be forum nepotism, and lead to providors having an unequal part of "the contract", (i.e. I,ll be at ***** show mate, i,ll do it then), more service providors = more choice=more competition=better service, in return, a providor gets a review that is actually worth someting.
     
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  18. Chris

    Chris Funster Life Member

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    Just from reading this forum I wouldnt hesitate to use Dave Newall or Ash. I have just bought from Johns Cross because of its good reviews on here.

    I can also positively report on Vanbitz - I had a great service from them. Mind you even if I hadnt I would have kept quiet cos I think Eddie is bigger than me and anyway he has two enormous dogs:BigGrin:
     
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  19. annadg

    annadg Read Only Funster

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    What a fascinating thread - maybe even more so as I haven't seen what sparked it all off !

    Like one of the posters, I use Trip Adviser quite a bit and post to it. Generally speaking you can judge which are the gripes you can ignore (someone didn't like the coffee ... that's a matter of personal taste surely?). But one I read for an hotel said there were mouse droppings and ratty type scufflings behind the skirting, substantiated by two other reviews. Ummm ... didn't stay there !

    But surely for reviews on workmanship etc it is easy and simple to provide hard factual evidence - but even then, if it is one bad review among slews of good ones, maybe it was a "Friday afternoon job". And hopefully the reviewer gives the company a chance to redress the faults before sounding off about it all. That's only justice after all.

    Generally I find that if I don't like the way a job has been done and go and talk to the "doer" he or she puts it right (I don't know how to shout by the way, so always talk reasonably and quietly!). I never find "sounding off" works.

    Perhaps if a bad review is posted, before it is posted would it be possible to ask the company concerned to comment on it ? And at least put their own case.

    But all in all, I am a believer in reviews, good or bad, as long (and this is the important bit) that they can be substantiated with hard evidence.
     
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  20. Barclaybasher

    Barclaybasher Funster

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    I had a retail showroom in Derby.
    Rolls Royce, a major employer, negotiated a 10% discount for its staff with businesses in the city.
    When RR employees came in asking for a discount I would reply jokingly that if I had known that they were from RR I would have added 10% - they were so demanding, expecting everything made to a thousandth of an inch.

    - Trouble was it was no joke!! - some of them you could never please.............




     
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