Gas issues. Is this true or a fabrication???

Discussion in 'Motorhome Chat' started by Elvis, Jun 13, 2009.

  1. Elvis

    Elvis Read Only Funster

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    Hi All

    We have discovered that when our gas bottle is low (say 1/4 full or less but not empty) the fire will ignite but goes straight out & water heater will not ignite at all but the hob will light (all 4 rings) and cook for ever on full strength. When the bottle is full, all of the above will ignite and work as normal

    We were told by the place we bought it form,that this is normal as the hob needs less gas..... mmmmmm sounds like bull to me and no one I have spoken to has heard ofthis before. It's an Elddis 2003 model.

    Has this ever happened to anyone else out there??? And if so,what was the problem with it??? :Doh:
    Thanks guys xxx
     
  2. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

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    Hi

    haven't come across it personally, are you using propane or butane and what size bottle ?

    Jim
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2009
  3. Elvis

    Elvis Read Only Funster

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    Gas issues

    We use the small orange bottles :Smile:
     
  4. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

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    ok, shouldn't be a problem then.. I'm stumped :Laughing:

    over to the gas experts :Wink:
     
  5. Drylander

    Drylander Read Only Funster

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    Hello Elvis,

    I had a similar problem, at a New Year below Zero site and I was a bit puzzled (as I was on Propane not Butane) but, when changing the gas bottle, I found that the flexible hose between the regulator and the fixed copper piping had become kinked, thus constricting the (Plenty Of) Gas flow.

    So I replaced that kinked flexible pipe & all was OK again.

    I read recently that a faulty regulator can produce the same symptoms, they dont last forever and are fairly cheap at £6 - £12 quid: But beware, as I heard of a guy elsewhere who blithely paid £80 in ignorance!!

    Bob L
     
  6. Drylander

    Drylander Read Only Funster

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    Hello Again Elvis


    I am not a professional gas expert, just a “User”, but since my initial reply have found the following which you might find also useful:

    1. All about how to change/which types etc. Regulator Changeover Guide


    2. Gas Regulators & Fittings from Towsure


    My rule of thumb is (For Bottles AND Regulators, never mix the two up)

    Red = Propane, for Winter/Cold climates

    Butane = Blue for Summer/warmer climes


    Personally I use those regulators (i.e from Towsure) with the Guage which indicates when you are running low. When you turn the gas off at the bottle the Indicator Guage should stay Green, with all appliances OFF, for several minutes to show whether you have any leaking joints, etc.

    Hope that helps. Let us know how you get on; we can't have you paying for a full bottle and only using 3/4 of it!

    Bob L
     
  7. olley

    olley Funster

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    Hi as the gas level drops the vapourisation volume also drops as their is less gas to vaporise, so you will get much less flow volume from a 1/4 full bottle as you would from a full one.

    Imagine you have two 10litre bottles with a common outlet, if you close off one bottle you will reduce the amount of gas comming out by about half, and its the same principle inside a bottle.

    The answer if the pipework is ok, is a bigger bottle.

    Olley
     
  8. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

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    Hi Olley

    Sorry, but I have to disagree, the bottle volume has nothing to do with the rate of vaporization , that is dependant only on the surface area of the liquid gas.. that is why bottles for BBQs and patio heaters are a dumpy shape, they have a large surface area in order to supply a large flow rate .. a bigger bottle will be better, but only if it has a larger diameter .. and hence a larger surface area for the liquid to vaporize.. not because it has a larger volume ..

    hope I explained that ok ..

    Jim
     
  9. derekfaeberwick

    derekfaeberwick Read Only Funster

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    We live and learn Jim.:notworthy: I always thought the patio bottles were just "pretty" expensive.:Doh::thumb:
     
  10. Elvis

    Elvis Read Only Funster

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    Wow, all fab advice, thank you very much all :Laughing: Sorry I can't reply to each individual but don't know how to yet.

    Will keep you updated, will be talking to the business we bought it from again on Monday, they still have it there to be fixed so I can now tell them what you have told me and will see what they say.

    Thanks again

    Lisa:RollEyes:
     
  11. Douglas

    Douglas Read Only Funster

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    PURE FICTION!!!

    Doug...
     
  12. GJH

    GJH Funster Life Member

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    You don't say which Elddis van you have but on our 2004 reg (2003/4 model) Autoquest 100 we haven't had any gas problems. Our gas locker takes two 6Kg bottles and we use propane.

    Having read about regulator problems possibly caused by leaching of plastics from conventional hose to regulator flexible pipes I replaced ours with a Gaslow steel pipe but otherwise no modifications.

    Graham
     
  13. olley

    olley Funster

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    Jim gas doesn't just vapourise from the surface, it vapourises from the middle, sides, bottom in fact everywhere, if you have less gas you will get less vapourisation.

    Vapourisation is solely dependant on temperature, not surface volume.

    Olley
     
  14. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

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    Hi Olley

    as I said, I'm not a a gas expert.. just a sparky :Laughing: but I still stand by my explanation .. surface area not volume dictates max rate of vaporization .. at the same temperature.

    Consider a pan of boiling water, the larger the diameter the more stream , if you need more steam you require a bigger diameter, increasing the volume of water won't produce more steam unless the diameter is bigger ..

    let's agree to disagree until Google proves otherwise .. or 45er comes back on :Rofl1::Rofl1::Rofl1:
     
  15. Munchie

    Munchie Funster Life Member

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    Contary to some replies the size of the bottle has no bearing on the issue. In our last m/home we had two 6kg bottles which we change to 13's. We now have two 11kg gaslow's. In our static we have two 47kg bottles. In all cases all functions work till the bottle is empty including heating. Hope this helps. :BigGrin: Oh and the flow from the bottles is the same in all cases. Regulator? :BigGrin:
     
  16. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

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    Further information for those interested in the take off rate for different sized bottles.
    scroll to bottom of page for chart

    Motorhome Bottled Gas & LPG

    so bottle size does affect max take off rate ..
     
  17. Shubberdog

    Shubberdog Deleted User

    LPG actually vaporises at a given pressure and is not dependent on surface area. I would say from the description of the fault that it is ether a faulty regulator or the pipe work is restricted in some way after the regulator (squashed, nipped, or kinked) :restmycase:
     
  18. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

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    Last edited: Jun 14, 2009
  19. pappajohn

    pappajohn Funster Life Member

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    not true Olley.

    note item 2 at the bottom.

     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2009
  20. Munchie

    Munchie Funster Life Member

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