Expert help required

Discussion in 'The Beginner' started by First motorhome, May 1, 2016.

  1. First motorhome

    First motorhome Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2013
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    North East England
    Hello there, can anyone answer this query?

    I have held a normal driving licence since 1970, this gives me class C1, I believe I can drive a vehicle up to 7.5t. The Chausson motorhome is classed as a 3500 KG but the V5 document only shows a revenue weight of 3650 KG. The Fiat chassis data plate has the following 4 weights, 3650 KG, 6150 KG, 1850 KG and 2000 KG. The Trigano data plate lists 4 weights, 3500 KG, 4600 KG, 1850 KG and 2000 KG.

    The question is what is the maximum total legal weight I can drive on the road and what do the various weights refer to?
    Any help with explanation of all or some of the data would be gratefully appreciated.

    Regards, Kelvin.
     
  2. icantremember

    icantremember Funster

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2010
    Messages:
    5,053
    Likes Received:
    7,093
    Location:
    Nr Watton in Norfolk
     
    • Useful Useful x 1
  3. NickNic

    NickNic Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2014
    Messages:
    5,435
    Likes Received:
    11,115
    Location:
    Kettering
    The weight on the V5 is the correct one. The maximum weight is 3650kg.

    The weights in order are:

    1. MTPLM of the vehicle - the maximum it can weigh and still be legal
    2. The maximum train weight - this is the maximum combined weight of the vehicle and any trailer
    3. The maximum load on the front axle
    4. The maximum load on the rear axle.


    The motorhome isn't "classed" as any particular weight. A lot of converters will plate them at 3500kg so that they can be driven on a normal car licence. The problem with that is that a lot of them aren't fit for purpose at that weight which is why lots of people uprate them.
     
    • Useful Useful x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  4. Boringfrog

    Boringfrog Funster

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2008
    Messages:
    974
    Likes Received:
    446
    I agree but it seems strange the Triango plate saying 3500kg?
     
  5. emmitdb

    emmitdb Funster

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2009
    Messages:
    1,604
    Likes Received:
    1,512
    Location:
    Cornwall
    Here goes (prepared to accept the cabbages hurled in my direction.)
    You have two weight plates. The first one was stuck on by Fiat when your prized possession was a van (ie before it was a motorcaravan)
    The second was the one stuck on by Trigano who are the manufacturers of your conversion to the motorhome.

    For your purposes you can ignore the Fiat plate (of more later) and you take on board the Trigano plate.

    Of the figures, the first no. is the maximum allowed weight of the vehicle as it sits on the road with you, the wife, dog, kids, fuel, water etc. The second no. is the maximum 'Train Weight' allowed. That is the total weight you are allowed to be with a trailer attached and on the road. ie ball park figure, if you had 3500kgs of motorhome and attached a trailer, the trailer could weigh 1100kgs and you would still be legal. The last two no.s refer to the maximum weights allowed for the two axles. The first no. is the front axle and the second one is the rear axle.

    Right, here comes the anomalies with regard to the figures you have.

    You will notice that the Fiat numbers vary from those of Trigano.
    That is because 3500kgs is a magic number where virtually anyone can drive the 'van. Trigano have lowered those figures to encompass everyone to be able to use your 'van (not literally).

    It would appear that you could, if you should so wish, apply to DVLA to up the max. Gross weight of the van to 3650kgs but DVLA ordinarily would not take your word for it and would ask that you supply additional evidence to prove it. There are various Companies that, for a fee, would supply that eveidence.

    You will notice that if you add your axle weights together, it adds up to 3850Kgs. With the additional evidence I reckon that DVLA would allow you to uprate the Gross weight of your 'van to 3800Kgs.
    It would also seem that you could also increase your train weight as well as the two plates are wildly at varience with each other.

    No doubt some other Funster will have been typing in tandem with me but if they're not, and I've said something you don't understand please ask. It may be that you will not have to ask for an upgrade (cost, up to £312) but modern vans are notorious for not having enough carrying capacity.

    Regards
     
  6. NickNic

    NickNic Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2014
    Messages:
    5,435
    Likes Received:
    11,115
    Location:
    Kettering
    It's also strange that they've cut the train weight so much.

    It's what the V5 says that matters though. It's possible that Triango originally plated it at 3500, a previous owner uprated it back to 3650 and the OP just hasn't found the third (newest) weight plate.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Lenny HB

    Lenny HB Funster

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2007
    Messages:
    5,241
    Likes Received:
    5,034
    Location:
    West Sussex
    AS Nick says it has been downplated to 3500 kg, but it would be fairly easy to get it replated to 3650kg, if you intend to do it check your axle loading to see if you have enough capacity on the rear axle to make it worthwhile.
     
  8. NickNic

    NickNic Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2014
    Messages:
    5,435
    Likes Received:
    11,115
    Location:
    Kettering
    I think it's already been uprated back to 3650 and there will be a third plate somewhere.

    The V5 says 3650 so as far as the DVLA are concerned that's what it is.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  9. icantremember

    icantremember Funster

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2010
    Messages:
    5,053
    Likes Received:
    7,093
    Location:
    Nr Watton in Norfolk
    I agree.
     
  10. emmitdb

    emmitdb Funster

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2009
    Messages:
    1,604
    Likes Received:
    1,512
    Location:
    Cornwall
    The OP should??? be able to get his Max.Gross to 3800Kgs.

    When I applied, with a front axle/rear axle figures of 1750/2000 I was able to get it increased to 3700Kgs.
     
  11. TerryL

    TerryL Funster

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2010
    Messages:
    1,243
    Likes Received:
    1,239
    Location:
    North East
    And as for what you can drive, C1 gives you the okay for any vehicle up to 7.5 tonnes mauw NOT for hire and reward. Until you're 70 that is, then it gets interesting.
     
  12. Mikeco

    Mikeco Funster

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2013
    Messages:
    596
    Likes Received:
    400
    Location:
    Market Rasen
    The train weight will have been reduced due to a chassis extension or chassis construction so that will not increase. As it will stay the same if replated you will have less towing capacity than before it was replated
     
  13. Minxy Girl

    Minxy Girl Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2007
    Messages:
    8,513
    Likes Received:
    9,879
    Location:
    E Yorks
    I take it that's from D.6 [Y] on the V5C? Out of interest what does it say under D.5 [X] Taxation Class?

    First comes the Fiat plate which is then superceded by the Trigano plate, however it would appear that either of the following could be what's happened:
    • the dealer, when first registering the vehicle, in correctly did so based on Fiat's figures and not Trigano's revised figures
    or​
    • the previous owner had the vehicle re-plated back to the original Fiat weight but has neglected to put on a 3rd weight plate ... or it's somewhere else on the vehicle which you haven't found yet!
    It may be your only 'safe' course of action is to ring the DVLA and see if they have on record which weight it was first registered at, as that is likely to give you the answer!
     
  14. Lenny HB

    Lenny HB Funster

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2007
    Messages:
    5,241
    Likes Received:
    5,034
    Location:
    West Sussex
    I miss read it.:)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. Minxy Girl

    Minxy Girl Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2007
    Messages:
    8,513
    Likes Received:
    9,879
    Location:
    E Yorks
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  16. Boringfrog

    Boringfrog Funster

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2008
    Messages:
    974
    Likes Received:
    446
    If the VED is £165 it will be 3650KG.
     
  17. emmitdb

    emmitdb Funster

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2009
    Messages:
    1,604
    Likes Received:
    1,512
    Location:
    Cornwall
    Thanks for joining in Mel.

    I knew you had done it a lot less expensively than the usual place.
    It would seem that the 'van in question has a Max Weight of 3500Kgs at the mo. However, if the VED to be paid is £165 then that means that it's already been uprated and somewhere there should be a further plate showing this. I was told to put ours on the offside door return.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. gus-lopez

    gus-lopez Funster

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2014
    Messages:
    4,367
    Likes Received:
    7,935
    Location:
    Lorca,Murcia,Spain
    :welc:
     
  19. Daedalus

    Daedalus Funster

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2013
    Messages:
    77
    Likes Received:
    143
    Location:
    North Cumbria
    That is not correct - "the not for hire or reward" on licenses is in connection with the D1 (bus) licence (Category Restriction 101 - not for hire or reward (that is, not to make a profit) which you also used to receive as part of the "Grandfather" rights. There is nothing to stop someone who holds a C1 licence, obtained prior to 01 January 1997 on the "Grandfather" rights driving a commercial vehicle (up to 7,500kg) for a living.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2016
    • Like Like x 1
  20. cronkle

    cronkle Funster

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2008
    Messages:
    73
    Likes Received:
    27
    Location:
    shropshire
    Hello there,

    Which of the VIN plates would you have used for enforcement purposes? I thought a VOSA inspector from Carlisle :)once told me it would be the latest, i.e. the converters plate that would be relevant.
     
Loading...

Share This Page