electronics help needed please (1 Viewer)

[pappajohn]

To take my mind off my dog i did a bit of trouble shooting on my Kipor this afternoon.

Following the attached trouble shooting guide i find i have 604vac on each of the three tests.

now, to my mind bunging 900 volts (3 phase) into a circuit designed for 450 volts is just asking for trouble...hence the blown inverter module.

now, the main question is, why would/how could the alternator be outputting 300v per phase when it should be 150vac ?

there is no regulation between alternator and inverter as the inverter module itself does all the regulation and controls engine speed via smart throttle, which still works as it should in so far as the revs drop when turned on and increase when off.

 

[Wildman]

John my brain is shot today and not thinking 100% clearly but looks to me like you are reading peak to peak rather than RMS. Which would explain it. Now I'll read the trouble shooting guide, hee hee. Did you buy the one off ebay by the way I didn't push the price up for you.
Ok now read tests, hee hee and you are right tis strange, I'll save that and test mine when I get back from France at the end of May and see what I get.
I said my brain was shot.

 

[pappajohn]

John my brain is shot today and not thinking 100% clearly but looks to me like you are reading peak to peak rather than RMS. Which would explain it. Now I'll read the trouble shooting guide, hee hee. Did you buy the one off ebay by the way I didn't push the price up for you.

No, i kept an eye on it but once it went over £120 i quit looking.

finally went for £166.

the other one, a Clarke 1kw, sold (classified ad) before i got chance...that was as new for £165

main reason for a replacement is to run the microwave, blow air furnace fan and a bit of charging (45amp peak output charger) if needed without starting the onboard 5.5kw monster at great expense.

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[pappajohn]

by my reckoning the RMS voltage on 600v would still be 424v between two phases....or am i missing something ?

 

[bungle.bear]

I am no expert on Kipors, But to increase output voltage of any generator you need either to increase the engine speed or increase magnetism.

So either the generator is permanant magnet, in which case the speed needs to increase to give you a higher output voltage. or it is a copper wound generator in which case it will need field/excitation voltage to increase the output voltage while the speed is fixed.

I would guess that you have a copper wound generator and that your inverter has failed to full excitation.

Anthony

 

[aba]

seems an odd test to me.
i would have thought that it would have 3 live phases a neutral and earth.
and the test states pin 1 & 4 , 2 & 4 and 1 & 2.
so which pin is neutral????

or am i getting confused here

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[pappajohn]

seems an odd test to me.
i would have thought that it would have 3 live phases a neutral and earth.
and the test states pin 1 & 4 , 2 & 4 and 1 & 2.
so which pin is neutral????

or am i getting confused here

neutral and earth will be via the metal casing just as it is in a power station generator.

testing between two phases should verify there is an output from both

it should be pin 1 and 4 = 300v.....pin 2 and 4 = 300v...pin 1 and 2 = 300v

for some reason i have 600v between pins on all three tests

between each phase and neutral/earth (the casing) should be 150v

the odd thing is the smart throttle (12v) and electronic ignition (12v) the 12v battery charger output (12v) are all powered from the inverter module and both work so it points to the 230v 'step up' side of the inverter failing.

mine is slightly different having just one large capacitor (450v/1500mf), instead of the three shown, which has no voltage on the terminals with the engine running

 

[Gromett]

I seem to recall star or delta configurations. If star you can measure phase (x) to earth or phase (x) to phase . The second option will give you a higher voltage and if you combine this with peak rather than RMS readings......

I am just guessing wildly here as it is 20 years since I did any serious 3 phase stuff and most of the knowledge has leaked out of the grey matter.