Driveway Parking Overnight Stops Or Extra Income? (1 Viewer)

[John & Joan]

Apart from all that, I thought that a caravan or Motorhome could be parked on a private drive overnight, i.e friends or family visiting but that they had to use the washing and toilet facilities of the dwelling house. If that's the case, who the hell is going to allow strangers to park on their drive allowing grey waste to run all over the patio and then knocking at the door at all hours to use your toilet for £5 a night????

CASES WHERE A SITE LICENCE IS NOT REQUIRED
Use within curtilage of a dwelling-house
1. A site licence shall not be required for the use of land as a caravan site if the use is incidental to the enjoyment as such of a dwelling-house within the curtilage of which the land is situated.

There is no other requirement in the legislation other than the use is "incidental to the enjoyment as such of a dwelling-house" . This is interpreted as use of some facility of the dwelling, not any specific items as quoted. Someone coming onto the drive and living as an independent unit is not permitted, without PP and a Caravan Site Licence. Family/Friends using the house and the van are permitted.

Parking on the road outside a property is not within the curtilage.

 

[Wombles]

Thank you all for the interesting discussions about the feasibility of this idea for staying overnight in our motorhomes! Even if there are potential issues (down to personal choice/what may be agreed between individuals) with sleeping overnight in places listed on JustPark still imho a great idea for parking day or night whether in our cars or motorhomes &/or to bring in a little extra income from our driveways whilst helping others too I have looked at the other websites similar to JustPark listed on the Martin Lewis website & decided to keep our driveway listing to just that one as largest, easiest to use & most professionally organised. It would be interesting to know if anyone else tries using the parking spaces or renting theirs via this route & their experience so don't be shy & please post

 

[GJH]

I've just sent them a question - "Could you please explain what are the implications for space owners who are householders in terms of insurance, planning permission and council tax/business rates?"

I'll post the response when (if) I get it.

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[Judge Mental]

Heavens...some part time coppers on here or what! Leave it alone? If its not broke it dont need fixing

 

[GJH]

Heavens...some part time coppers on here or what! Leave it alone? If its not broke it dont need fixing

If that is in response to my post what would you prefer? Something goes wrong and somebody finds they are not insured?

 

[scotjimland]

I've just sent them a question - "Could you please explain what are the implications for space owners who are householders in terms of insurance, planning permission and council tax/business rates?"

I'll post the response when (if) I get it.

I haven't read it all Graham, but there is a mention of this in the JustPark Owner Agreementhttps://www.justpark.com/owner-agreement/

Approvals

1. You represent and warrant that you have all necessary regulatory and planning approvals to grant a license to use the Parking Space and that the license to use the Parking Space will comply with all applicable laws, Tax requirements and rules and regulations that may apply to the Parking Space, including but not limited to zoning laws and laws governing rental of or licenses to use residential and other properties.

1. You agree that we shall not be liable to you in any way whatsoever if you suffer any loss as a result of any governmental authority or any other relevant public authority bringing proceedings against you or taking any other action against you as a result of listing the Parking Space on the Website. If you do not have the necessary approvals referred to in clause 7.2, you agree to indemnify and hold harmless JustPark for any loss we may suffer as a result of your breach of the representation and warranty.
   
   
   

1. Insurance
   1. You will be entirely responsible for any and all insurance that you may require for the purposes of granting any license to use your Parking Space.

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[GJH]

I haven't read it all Graham, but there is a mention of this in the JustPark Owner Agreementhttps://www.justpark.com/owner-agreement/

Approvals

1. You represent and warrant that you have all necessary regulatory and planning approvals to grant a license to use the Parking Space and that the license to use the Parking Space will comply with all applicable laws, Tax requirements and rules and regulations that may apply to the Parking Space, including but not limited to zoning laws and laws governing rental of or licenses to use residential and other properties.

1. You agree that we shall not be liable to you in any way whatsoever if you suffer any loss as a result of any governmental authority or any other relevant public authority bringing proceedings against you or taking any other action against you as a result of listing the Parking Space on the Website. If you do not have the necessary approvals referred to in clause 7.2, you agree to indemnify and hold harmless JustPark for any loss we may suffer as a result of your breach of the representation and warranty.
   
   

1. Insurance
   1. You will be entirely responsible for any and all insurance that you may require for the purposes of granting any license to use your Parking Space.

Thanks Jim. I didn't read it all either but it looked like the Ts&Cs were there to protect the organisation rather the space owner - and you quotes tend to confirm that
What concerns me is that many people enter into this sort of agreement without studying the contract properly and then get into trouble as a result.
The on-line response to my enquiry said I would receive an e-mail confirmation of its receipt but that hasn't arrived yet

 

[Wombles]

It's only parking!
Surely better to park on someones private driveway rather than on the road or in a car park?!

 

[Judge Mental]

We are the most policed country in europe ..so many rules and regulations. Should be more like the Italians and ignore them....

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[GJH]

It's only parking!
Surely better to park on someones private driveway rather than on the road or in a car park?!

We are the most policed country in europe ..so many rules and regulations. Should be more like the Italians and ignore them....

Probably - until something goes wrong.
Let's say somebody pushes a lawnmower into a car causing bodywork damage. Who is liable?
Let's say neighbour disputes mean a complaint is made to the local council. What are the implications?

Common enough incidents and they need to be covered up front. It's nothing to do with policing.

 

[Millie 'n us]

Crickey! We just let people who need to park in our drive for nothing. I'm sure if we searched hard enough though, we'd be breaking some bye-law or other!
Forget charging. Let's just do it!

 

[GJH]

Crickey! We just let people who need to park in our drive for nothing. I'm sure if we searched hard enough though, we'd be breaking some bye-law or other!
Forget charging. Let's just do it!

Fair enough, but when money changes hands the situation changes as well. That's why the company which controls the scheme has a contract in place.

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[yellabellyex]

"2 Subject to the provisions of paragraph 13 of this Schedule, a site licence shall not be required for the use of land as a caravan site by a person travelling with a caravan who brings the caravan on to the land for a period which includes not more than two nights—

(a)if during that period no other caravan is stationed for the purposes of human habitation on that land or any adjoining land in the same occupation, and

(b)if, in the period of twelve months ending with the day on which the caravan is brought on to the land, the number of days on which a caravan was stationed anywhere on that land or the said adjoining land for the purposes of human habitation did not exceed twenty-eight."
Looks like the issue with motorhomes/caravans is only if more than 2 nights or 28 total days in one year or am I missing something? We don't want a campsite on our driveway but like the idea of having & finding other one night stopovers as well as daytime parking in either car or motorhome in area we want to visit. Know that MCC have Nightstops so only real difference is payment & their list is very limited.

I've thought about this since we stayed on a "France Passion" "site" on our first trip back in 2011. Basically it was a couple who were "caravanistes" , caravan enthusiasts who were happy to offer space on their drive, with ehu for free, just because they could. We had a chat with them, but they left us to it. There was a couple from Australia there as well, and we had a few beers with them.
If we were on the outskirts of the village we live in I might be tempted to make a similar offer; but wouldn't be keen to have address etc on a freely available website, let alone a freely circulated POI database. It's difficult to do this sort of thing in a way that you can keep control I think. Once the offer is out there I think it could get a bit tricky to end.
So we'll "take", because we know we'll be well behaved, rather than "give" and rely on others to behave similarly; a pity.
regards
alan b

 

[Wombles]

That's why JustPark works as there is an organised, easy to use structure so everyone knows where they stand & paying albeit normally a small amount means no obligation on either side It's up to you how much you charge for parking on your driveway & your address is not given until you agree for each parking request & you can decline or ignore if not convenient. We had very swift responses via their secure messaging but only instant parking agreed if you set that option otherwise between the two parties.

 

[GJH]

everyone knows where they stand

They still haven't acknowledged, let alone answered, my question yet

EDIT. I've asked again. Browser response "Your request was successfully submitted. You should receive a confirmation email shortly." but no confirmation e-mail

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[GJH]

It appears that my first enquiry went astray somehow as I've now received a couple of replies to my question "Could you please explain what are the implications for space owners who are householders in terms of insurance, planning permission and council tax/business rates".

You would not need to purchase any additional insurance with regards to the driver's vehicles. However, before renting out your parking space or garage, we would advise you to contact your current insurer to see if this will have any impact on your buildings or contents insurance.

As the parking space is being used for a commercial transaction (a payment is being received), it is possible that you may not be covered for any accident incurred by the driver while on your property (public liability insurance). This varies by insurer so please do check check if this concerns you.

You may purchase optional business or public liability insurance to protect yourself in the very unlikely situation that, for example, a driver falls and hurts themselves on your driveway or home insurance in case you are worried about someone driving into your house. This is, however, a very unlikely scenario.

Government guidance was recently issued instructing councils to relax regulations surrounding private residential parking space rental, so most councils will not require you to get additional planning permission. The Government’s view is that households should be able to rent parking spaces without planning permission, provided there are no substantive planning concerns such as public nuisance to neighbours.

So it’s extremely unlikely that you need planning permission to rent out your parking space. However, some councils might demand specific business planning permission, so you would have to get in touch with your local council to double check.

You can read more about government guidelines here: https://www.gov.uk/government/news/pickles-takes-on-town-halls-new-driveway-tax

 

[Wombles]

We used JustPark again yesterday for parking near to Bristol Uni for their Open Day & another very positive experience
Instead of having to join the Saturday shopping queues at Cribbs Causeway then queue again for the buses provided then a 30 minute bus ride to the Uni then the same going back we just drove straight to the JustPark space, parked, then a few minutes walk & we were thereWe preferred to be parked off road on a private driveway rather than in a car park or on the side of the road with buses whizzing past. Cost us £6.30 but shortened our trip by a couple of hours, so easy & much less stressful.
Wish we could use this again for our final Open Day trek to Warwick Uni but the car parking spaces just around the corner are already booked If any Funsters live within easy walking distance & add their parking space to JustPark then please let us know...

 

[Dorwyn]

A friend occasionally overnights on our drive, which we are very happy about. It has often occurred to me to offer the facility to others, particularly since we are in popular tourist spot. But as has been pointed out, there are adverse implications, not least of which is, it would tie you down if you want to go elsewhere yourself. I guess an informal network might work, though.

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[GJH]

A friend occasionally overnights on our drive, which we are very happy about.

We stayed on a friend's drive for a night and we have had a friend stay here. No problems at all but it would be a different matter if there were a commercial arrangement.

 

[Wombles]

There are two things that I aimed to highlight with this thread :
Firstly, our so far very positive experience of JustPark for car parking as a useful additional parking option particularly in cities plus the option of earning a small amount of money from allowing others to park on our drives. Both of these may hopefully be of use to or help others
Secondly whether there could be the possibility of extending this idea to motorhomes to stay on private driveways. JustPark already have people whose driveways have the space & offer the option of parking for up to coach size plus many that allow overnight parking. So the option is already there for parking motorhomes day & night subject to the space being listed as big enough & allowing this. What was just an idea was whether such an existing organised system could be extended to allow sleeping in our motorhomes overnight subject to the driveway owners permission. This has obviously raised some concerns! Thank you for all the interesting comments & points of view Having considered all of this none of the risks raised concern us any more than parking in a car park or on the road edge.
From our point of view we will continue to use JustPark (or any other such driveway parking booking website) for car parking & if suitable spaces large enough to accommodate our motorhome for day parking in areas that we want to visit (beach areas?) then that would be preferable to parking on the road or in a public car park. If we wanted to stop off overnight then we would message the driveway owner through the website to see if they would be agreeable to us sleeping in our motorhome overnight & take it from there...

 

[Wombles]

But as has been pointed out, there are adverse implications, not least of which is, it would tie you down if you want to go elsewhere yourself. I guess an informal network might work, though.

When listing your driveway on JustPark driveway owners can choose instant booking option for parking spaces that are always available (you don't have to be in) or to be agreed by messaging through the website. We chose the second option so up to us if/when anyone parks. Those that park only get sent your full address once booked & paid. It is not normal to have contact with the driveway owner (unless necessary) on arrival you just pop your printed receipt in the car window & get on with day. If instant booking en route at the last minute you just need to leave a written note with the booking number in your window. All very easy & user friendly

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[DP+JAY]

Did wonder about Britstops but presume as they are normally on part of commercial premises & don't take any direct payment that eliminates any potential issues?

Just wondered how you got on with this, have you had any takers? how was it?

 

[Millie 'n us]

We've had a couple of takers and no problems. A bit surprised by all the negative discussions over what needs only be a friendly non~commercial arrangement!

 

[Dorwyn]

Is overnight 2 days? Or is it 24hrs?

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[Emmit]

That's your interpretation
Mine is different
If the stupid people who make the stupid laws made them properly then there would be no room for interpretation and everyone would be sure what was what

Ahhh!
But therein lies the reasoning.

The 'Stupid' people who make the Laws , That would be Parliament, are occupied by people who in their other lives, work within the Justice system, Therefore, making it prudent that in the course of their business they MAKE MONEY out of Interpreting the Law.

You didn't think they did it out of some misplaced Public Duty did you!

 

[Emmit]

Is overnight 2 days? Or is it 24hrs?

Two nights means from the Sunrise on day one to the Sunset on day three

 

[DP+JAY]

Is overnight 2 days? Or is it 24hrs?

Overnight can be less than 12 hours.

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