Carrying an extra bottle

Discussion in 'Motorhome Chat' started by Bailey58, May 23, 2013.

  1. Bailey58

    Bailey58 Funster Life Member

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    I’d like to carry a spare calor bottle for our first motorhome trip abroad but the 6kg is too tall to stow upright in the van, sooooooooooo….. how safe is it to carry it horizontally providing it’s well secured?

    Now after searching the gas bottle threads I’ve dismissed Haganap’s idea of lashing half a dozen bottles to his ladder or towing them behind the van as I don’t have ladder or a trailer. :Eek!:
    I’ve also seen posts about BBQ’s and the choice of extra bottles to feed them or an outside gas point, and refillable bottles are well discussed on here but too late for me with departure imminent.

    So how do other folk carry bottles for barbies and what about the times we’ve brought one home from the shop for the summer BBQ rolling about in the boot of the car?

    Your views please.







     
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  2. camocam1

    camocam1 Read Only Funster

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    when I take my gas bottle home for the BBQ its is horizontal in the boot but is tied down with straps, I can't see you would have a problem provided it is secured and NOT rolling about
     
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  3. tonka

    tonka Funster Life Member

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    My mate take his spare in a rear locker and it's always on its side. He put a "gas" sticker on the outside of the locker as well.

    I bring my Spanish bottle back like that as well.. Cant see any issues and seen lots of people carrying spare bottles for BBQ use etc..

    Depends on where you are going because it may be cheaper and easier to buy and use gas in the country you are going to...
     
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  4. vwalan

    vwalan Funster

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    many alrer the gas locker floor so they can get bigger bottles in .
    i wouldnt buy a camper with a gas locker if it cant get two 13 kg propane bottles in .
    but lower the floor .
    here suppliers carry bottles upright .in many countries the carry them laying down .
    but its not a good idea to use one laying down .
    other than camping gas . not too many small size bottles abroad . most use 11-12 kg bottles or bigger .
     
  5. bigfoot

    bigfoot Funster

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    What about refillable bottles or a tank with a BBQ take off?
     
  6. vwalan

    vwalan Funster

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    all bottles are refillable .
    just in some countries lpg gas stations arent widely available and in lots either very expensive or not available at all. in spain its far cheaper to use a spanish bottle .
     
  7. FIDGET

    FIDGET Funster

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    Hi , I take a camping gaz 907 bottle as a lot smaller just for bar-b-q as they are available over there and use my 2 x 6 kg propane for water heating and inside cooking ( making tea etc!!!).
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2013
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  8. moandick

    moandick Read Only Funster

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    Just this week I solved the problem of not having two gas bottles by going to 'Nuke's' workshop and having a twin-bottle Gaslow automatic system fitted with an external filler point (fitted by the Boss himself - it's gotta be good!) Might be a tad expensive for some but the convenience for me is almost inestimable - I pulled into a garage at home and filled for the first time (cut off at 23½ litres - £17.73 for two 6kg tanks fills) - magic! Cannot wait for our first wild-camping trip next week to try it out.

    Dick
     
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  9. knokinonabit

    knokinonabit Funster

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    I believe the reason gas bottles are transported upright is to help prevent the tap getting broken off and the bottle shooting off sideways like a rocket.
    The thinking is that the pressure would go up over and the bottle would remain in situ on the transporting vehicle.
    How this would work in a motorhome gas locker I am not sure, but even one that is secured on it's side can go off with some force, especially if the contents manage to ignite from a spark etc.
     
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  10. HymerB544

    HymerB544 Funster

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    Extra gas bottle

    We have fixed Gaslow x 2 11kg bottles, and a Cadac BBQ, so for the Barrie I carry a Campingaz bottle (can't recall the number but it's about 1ft high) it fits easily into any of our underbded or external lockers and although we got a refill last August and then went on a 9 week tour of Spain and Morocco, it is still going strong. Part of my reasoning for taking a Campingaz bottle was in case we ran out of LPG - but we never did.

    Gary:BigGrin:
     
  11. Bailey58

    Bailey58 Funster Life Member

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    Thanks for all the replies, my last paragraph was a bit misleading in that I didn't want the extra bottle for a BBQ (I have an external point for that) but just for general use. We spent 5 weeks in Norway in a trailer tent in the '70's and certainly didn't have EHU and I can't remember anything about gas bottles or supplies but we survived. Just thinking an extra bottle may stop me having to buy gas abroad including adapters which may prove redundant when we get home and go for refillables.
     
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  12. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

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    The reason for transporting gas bottles upright is that if it is laying horizontal liquid LPG will be covering the isolation valve and PRV .
    In the event of a leak, the escaping LPG will be a liquid, which is far more dangerous due to the rapid expansion which will result in a huge volume of white gas rather than just a small vapour leak if it were vertical.

    The leak may be the result of a faulty valve, leaking thread or PRV (pressure relief valve), overfilling or over pressure.

    The Carriage of Dangerous Goods and Use of Transportable Pressure Equipment Regulations 2009 has all the rules. .. but not necessarily the explanation.

    Don't take chances..
     
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  13. 1948

    1948 Read Only Funster

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    I always carry a spare 13kg bottle inside van under table upright during my winter trips. Very useful, no fear of running out anywhere and have to leave in a hurry.
     
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  14. Snowbird

    Snowbird Funster Life Member

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    Am not recommending it, but I must admit to transporting them on there side inside a bag and securely fastened on the bike rack. This is in Morocco where strange things happen that you would not see in Europe. Since the purchase of the latest van its not done as I have a 60ltr tank plus 2 X 13 kg bottles in the gas locker plus a 13kg bottle in the garage locker for the freezer and garage cooker.
    The red thing on the bike rack has a 13kg bottle inside.
     

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  15. Sidney

    Sidney Funster

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    There are some gas cylinders that should not be transported on their side for technical reasons i.e. acetylene.

    If I had to transport a LPG bottle in the habitation i would secure it well and of course ensure the regulator is removed.

    Any leak from a bottle (with the regulator removed) is bad regardless of whether it is on its side, upside down or right way up. The contents, liquid or vapour, are at the same pressure.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2013
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  16. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

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    Indeed they are .. but are you suggesting that a liquid LPG leak is not more serious than a vapour one ?

    The ratio between the volumes of the vaporized gas and the liquefied gas varies but is typically around 250:1
     
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  17. Sidney

    Sidney Funster

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    As soon as LPG isn't compressed it becomes a gas. Chop the valve off with an axe and you get a lot of gas and a cylinder instantly becomes a gas powered projectile. It wouldn't matter if it was standing up, laying down or upside down.

    Have you ever seen a cylinder of any gas leaking liquid?
     
  18. SomeoneElse

    SomeoneElse Funster

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    Yes, When I've hire motorhomes in Canada, they come with a fixed LPG tanks. When getting them refilled there is a small bleed hole at 75% full, this is opened and gas leaks out you can hear the hiss. When filling reached this point (75%) liquid pee's out as a small jet onto the forecourt, where it immediately evaporates . Filling is promptly stopped and the bleed hole closed.

    The reason the bleed hole is at 75% is so that the tank never reaches 80%, its illegal in Canada to fill a tank to more than 80% of its capacity.

    I've also seen liquid nitrogen being decanted from a large tank into a vacuum flask.
     
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  19. laneside

    laneside Funster

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  20. scotjimland

    scotjimland Funster Life Member

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    yes..

    I was also employed for many years in the offshore oil and gas industry.. and on a shore based oil refinery .. and witnessed many liquid leaks.. of many compressed 'gas' products.

    when you have a gas liquid leak, you don't see the liquid except at the point very close to the ejection point, (you can observe this if you upend a butane gas canister as used to refill gas lighters.. and press the nozzle..)

    the liquid rapidly expands into a white cloud.. so if the leak is being supplied by liquid gas it will be roughly 250 times the volume of a vapour leak.

    Likewise, have observed this when filling the LPG tank on my RV

    EDIT

    just read this HSE report of a liquid LPG gas leak in Essex at the refinery I used to work at..


    Calor Gas Ltd was today fined £27,500, after a major gas leak led to a cloud of highly flammable Liquefied Petroleum Gas (LPG) forming above its terminal in Essex.

    The firm admitted breaching health and safety regulations at the major hazard site when release of up 163 tonnes of LPG leaked into the atmosphere at the Calor Gas terminal on Canvey Island.

    Calor Gas Ltd of Tachbrook Park in Warwick, was sentenced at Basildon Crown Court and was also ordered to pay £27,185 costs.

    The leak happened while a ship was unloading gas to the site early on 27 October 2008. The gas, which is stored in a liquid form, escaped from a pipe when an over-pressure safety device operated. The liquid evaporated on contact with the ground, forming a vapour cloud above the site.

    LPG quickly forms an extremely flammable and explosive vapour when released into the atmosphere. In its vapour form, LPG can have a volume of up to 250 times that of its liquid form and can cause asphyxiation. If ignited, it can result in a serious explosion and fire.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2013
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