Burrs Country Park CC site , warden from hell ............ (1 Viewer)

[Abacist]

I'm with the club rules and warden - this was not an emergency and the OP should not have interfered! Been a member of both clubs for years and never had anything serious to complain about other than rising camping fees and the no deposit booking system!

Wardens are usually people like you or I who like camping and do this for little financial reward in their own units. They work a long day - give them a break!

 

[Whitebirdyman]

I still can't figure the bit about being delayed at the border in relation to a site like Burrs CP. I live in East Kent and know how long it would take me to drive up there so for me the original story seems inconsistent.

 

[Deleted member 29692]

That's why I will never pay any money to this company that calls itself a "club"

If the ridiculous rule book wasn't enough the attitude of many of the people employed in what is really a customer service role certainly is.

If there was a good reason for not letting them in it should have been explained properly. Otherwise I can see no good reason for the warder failing to let them in.

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[Zepp]

Me and Lynne work on campsites not the CC but another one wont say the name lol

We used to get late foreign motorhomes come in alot when we worked in Scotland this is how it goes bell goes 9pm you go out switch computers on open the office work out the price.Tell them the price and then they would say we will try another campsite .....30 mins of my time wasted.

We also used to get a few drive off the next morning with out paying who we had let on without checking in as it was to late to open the office.

Also used to find afew in the car park early in the morning they were gone by 9am .

 

[Gorse Hill]

So the OP had a very enjoyable day out, which is of course what they should be doing if they are on holiday. The 'Warden from Hell' however had probably been working for the usual 11-12 hours day for a consecutive number of days and is surely entitled to 'time off', or should they be expected to be 'on duty' for 24 hours !! I believe that all CC Sites accept arrivals up until 8pm every day, seven days a week, but if a 'customer' phones in advance to explain that they have been delayed, due to traffic problems, accident or breakdown, the site will usually be more than accommodating. Did this family have a booking ? did they phone ahead to see if there were any vacancies ? Did they phone to say they were on their way but had been delayed ? I believe Burrs Country Park is North of Manchester, so which border crossing were they delayed at ? If Dover, the only delays that I am aware of, then why didn't they stop at another of the numerous sites across the Country much earlier ? Surely this would be the 'responsible' thing to do if they had a 'family in tow' ?

The person who has posted this already states that they knew the 'Out of Hours' bell was for Emergencies but still rang the bell anyway !! How irresponsible was this !! How could this have been an emergency, the Original Poster has stated that the family were in a 'A' Class Carthago, which from my knowledge of Motorhomes is fully kitted out for travel with a 'BIG' onboard water tank, toilet facilities, shower/washroom, cooker (Gas), large fridge, leisure batteries to provide more than enough on-board power etc, so what exactly constitutes this as an 'Emergency' ?

Finally, it seems to me from their own admission, that it was the Poster who approached the family and not them pleading for assistance.

You make some valid points, however how often do you think this happens I would suggest it's very rare as most of us who own M/H & Caravans are aware of site rules
The people who are likely to turn up late are more likely to be beginners and people from other countries who might not be able to read/speak English, I personal can't speak Slovakian so a little bit of courtesy and understanding on this rare occasions might have been nice. BTW lots of us work and in harder jobs than being a warden which doesn't excuse bad manners

 

[GJH]

I always thought late night arrival areas were for the use of people who had booked a pitch, been delayed for some reason and phoned ahead to say so/arrange a LNA pitch. I didn't realise that LNA pitches were available for just anybody to use (whether on CC or any other sites).

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[GJH]

The people who are likely to turn up late are more likely to be beginners and people from other countries who might not be able to read/speak English

Isn't that all the more reason for advance planning to cater for something going wrong? I.e. taking responsibility for oneself rather than relying on somebody else doing so?

 

[PhilandMena]

LOL Must be one or two posters on here who feel a bit silly now.

 

[Gorse Hill]

Isn't that all the more reason for advance planning to cater for something going wrong? I.e. taking responsibility for oneself rather than relying on somebody else doing so?

Maybe Graham, but sometimes things do not go to plan and possibly some people don't have a back up in case of this, however if it was me I would have let them in guarneeted, but then we are all different and I was pointing out a little understanding would have been helpful in this situation

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[2657]

I have just got my 20 year sticker from the Caravan Club though I rarely use their sites these days but for quality and price in this country they cannot be bettered.OK we have occasionally fallen foul of a grumpy warden or some rule or other but those rules are for the benefit of all, just like the rules that we adhere to in civilised society, that's what keeps things civilised.

I for one would would not do a site wardens job, dealing with the public.......no, no,no!!.........that's why I have been a lorry driver most of my working life, on my own most of the time

As for the CC not being a club,as a 'member' I get invited to vote for officers of the club each year, any profits made are reinvested, dividends are not paid.

I was a member of a Cricket Club for many years in which the members decided that the club should be incorporated as a Limited Company, for tax purposes I think, this is quite normal and a lot of sports clubs are limited companies.

Caravan Club structure is as follows:

http://www.caravanclub.co.uk/media/17686546/the_club__how_it_works_2015_-_feb_15.pdf

Two interesting sections:
"16. An important, but often forgotten, aspect of Club governance is that The Club Officers
and Committee members do not work at East Grinstead House. Their work is voluntary and
they pursue their own careers, or retirement, elsewhere"

"
32. The Caravan Club is a registered limited company that runs a Members’ Club. The members elect, from among themselves, an Executive Committee to run The Club. Additional members are appointed to other Committees, which serve the Executive Committee. A consultative structure of members forming The Club Council, comprising Nominated Members and Divisional and Regional Representatives, provides the means whereby the Executive can, formally, take advice from the membership. The Executive Committee employs and directs staff to operate and manage approved policies and services to meet the needs of the membership."

 

[peterc10]

Isn't that all the more reason for advance planning to cater for something going wrong? I.e. taking responsibility for oneself rather than relying on somebody else doing so?

I wonder how many people crossing to France at the weekend had emergency planned for a 24 hour delay? And yet it happened, so is it their fault all their bookings in France are disrupted?

 

[GJH]

Maybe Graham, but sometimes things do not go to plan and possibly some people don't have a back up in case of this, however if it was me I would have let them in guarneeted, but then we are all different and I was pointing out a little understanding would have been helpful in this situation

I appreciate that some people don't have a back up but that is their responsibility isn't it, not some form of "duty" to be placed onto somebody else?

Consider this for instance, a true story of a family member was working at Debenhams a few years ago. The shop displayed prominent notices for several weeks that it was closing at 4:30pm on Christmas Eve. The staff were leaving (some time after 4:30 after closing the shop up) when a customer came along expecting normal closing time. When they explained the situation she complained bitterly because they had ruined her Christmas as she hadn't bought any presents and they were stopping her doing so.

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[chaser]

Isn't that all the more reason for advance planning to cater for something going wrong? I.e. taking responsibility for oneself rather than relying on somebody else doing so?

Being that they were from abroad , how were they to know you can't just park more or less anywhere on Aires just like they would at home.

 

[Jim]

Not commenting on this particular incident, but speaking generally.

I hate the "Opening Hours" attitude that you find on some sites, I remember turning at at a CC site at 1950hrs in the pouring rain, the warden had the right hump as I was so "late" yet they close at 2000

As for the "Ring Only in Emergency Bell, that is plain wrong. I am a customer, paying per 'night'. The big clubs should always have a contact available/on call over night. If my pitch trips, at 11pm, its not an emergency but I want it sorted now and I shouldn't have to wake a guy who was working all day to get it fixed.

 

[GJH]

I wonder how many people crossing to France at the weekend had emergency planned for a 24 hour delay? And yet it happened, so is it their fault all their bookings in France are disrupted?

I said "take responsibility", I didn't mention "fault".
There is (probably) no "fault" in either case but (as per my previous post) when something does go wrong surely that means that we take responsibility for ourselves rather than expecting somebody else to go out of their way for us doesn't it?

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[GJH]

Being that they were from abroad , how were they to know you can't just park more or less anywhere on Aires just like they would at home.

They look it up in advance rather than just making assumptions - personal responsibility again.

 

[chaser]

As to the op , not sticking up for either side, but they were parked up, not wandering about or anything, if they wanted the warden why didn't they ring his bell, actually nothing to do with the op , she approached them not the other way around.

 

[sdc77]

Being that they were from abroad , how were they to know you can't just park more or less anywhere on Aires just like they would at home.

Campsites abroad also have rules and aren't open all night.
A cc site is not going to be mistaken for a French aire .

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[Chris]

Let me tell you a story................

I had been on duty all day until 8pm, doing what I do in my usual friendly and helpful way, emptying bins around the site, cleaning the toilets and showers, cutting grass and hedges to keep the site looking good for the comfort of all our customers, even helping some without motor movers to pitch their vans, providing information on local walking routes, bus timetables etc. and even at the end of the day, walking around the site and delivering barrier cards to 'customers' who had 'forgotten' to return to the site office to tell us what pitch they were on, all in a day's work. At 8pm that evening everyone who had booked onto our site had arrived, the computers were closed down ready for the following busy day, the safe was all locked up and the office was secured. Now we could go off duty, prepare, cook and eat our evening meal, the main meal of our very long day. Then we washed up and got our showers before hopefully spending a couple of hours relaxing before going to bed prior to yet another long and busy day. At 9:20pm my mobile phone rang, it was my mother, very distressed, informing me that my father, who suffers with Vascular Dementia, had been rushed into hospital with a suspected stroke. They discovered he had Pneumonia along with several other infections and that he was very seriously ill. Due to his condition he was unable to eat or drink and was far too weak to undergo surgery and that they could do nothing other than to make him comfortable and let nature take its course, he was dying !! At 9:25pm, whilst trying to console my mother and get as much information as I could, the internal Emergency Bell sounded, I told my mother that I was sorry but I had to go as I had to deal with an on-site emergency. When I got to the gate of my compound I saw two people stood at the office door, I shouted across 'Can I help you' to which they responded, "I know it's not an Emergency", to which I responded "Well I hope that it is". Now you know the rest of the story, and yes perhaps I was a little brusque in my manner for which I do regret in hindsight, however, your "I know this isn't an Emergency" and my real time personal Emergency were on different levels of urgency. I know that you could not have known what was going on in my personal life and I appreciate that you were trying to be a Good Samaritan, however, rather than go onto a public website and incite the kind of hatred shown here, you could perhaps have come into the office the following morning and stated your displeasure, at which point, having been able to explain 'my dilemma' you may have had a much more understanding opinion. I have a very pleasant, helpful demeanour, I have in the last month dealt personally with two real 'Emergencies' on site, both out of hours and both requiring urgent attendance of the Ambulance Service. I have helped customers who have locked themselves out of their vehicles and I go out of my way to go that extra mile, however, in one evening you have managed to make me look like an unpleasant ogre. I hope you never have a bad day yourself !!

I understand all that - just a bad day.

Sorry about your father.

 

[Gorse Hill]

I appreciate that some people don't have a back up but that is their responsibility isn't it, not some form of "duty" to be placed onto somebody else?

Consider this for instance, a true story of a family member was working at Debenhams a few years ago. The shop displayed prominent notices for several weeks that it was closing at 4:30pm on Christmas Eve. The staff were leaving (some time after 4:30 after closing the shop up) when a customer came along expecting normal closing time. When they explained the situation she complained bitterly because they had ruined her Christmas as she hadn't bought any presents and they were stopping her doing so.

To be fair it was a women

 

[Franck]

As for the "Ring Only in Emergency Bell, that is plain wrong. I am a customer, paying per 'night'. The big clubs should always have a contact available/on call over night. .

Quite simply they can't afford it. If someone is 'on duty', 'on call' or whatever they have to be paid the living wage whether they are awake or asleep. Both major clubs now give their staff an emergency mobile phone for use once the office closes and reopens so they do not have to be on site if they choose not to. It all had to do with a case brought by some workers elsewhere who claimed they should be paid when on call as they couldn't go and do what they wanted when on call. So although there may be an emergency number posted, there could be a delay as that person comes back from the pub!

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[EuroTrotters]

I work 8-8 during the week, I don't appreciate people calling me at anytime after that with complaints.

That said, I encountered a site with 3 sets (3 couples) of wardens. None of who were contactable after 8pm. We arrived at 8:05pm after we had rang to say we were late. We had also rang to tell them we could not get access as they entrances were being closed (sherwood forest). But they never bothered to tell us this on the first phone call.

Is there a Club in Europe that operates like ours do?

 

[Deleted member 29692]

If someone is 'on duty', 'on call' or whatever they have to be paid the living wage whether they are awake or asleep

That's utter rubbish.

For a start the "living wage" isn't statutory, nobody has to be paid it.

Secondly nobody on call has to be paid for the entire on call period. It is usual to pay a small retainer type fee and then, if they are hourly paid, pay them an agreed rate if they are called out. Even this may not apply if the person is salaried and an element of call out rota is part of their contract.

 

[Franck]

That's utter rubbish.

For a start the "living wage" isn't statutory, nobody has to be paid it.

Secondly nobody on call has to be paid for the entire on call period. It is usual to pay a small retainer type fee and then, if they are hourly paid, pay them an agreed rate if they are called out. Even this may not apply if the person is salaried and an element of call out rota is part of their contract.

The C&CC no longer accept arrivals up to 11pm, it now closes its gates at 8pm specifically for this reason.

It's not specifically being 'on call' it's about being tied to a specific place and not being free to go where you want to.

Maybe it's not law but when people started posting on a forum about the paramedics who had won their case for being paid while being expected to be within a certain distance of their base and therefore not free to do what they wanted, suddenly the rules changed. Nobody at the clubs is 'on call' any more, they are either on the rota being paid or have an emergency phone and thus being free to go out if they choose.

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[Jim]

Quite simply they can't afford it.

Last time I looked at the accounts of the big clubs they could more than afford it. Book into the smallest of hotels, there will always be someone on the end of a phone to help with anything, 24/7.

 

[DavidG58]

Staying with the late arrival area bit, I am also surprised that this one was inside the barrier, but on a positive note presuming there was room to park outside it would at least have been for free, my understanding is that the CC charge a full pitch fee for use of the LNA, I think that might include electrics, but a chunk of money to pay probably with no access to loos (normally key entry these days)

 

[Khizzie]

There you have it.......both sides of the story. Let the Jury retire to decide.

Think I need to ensure my brain is engaged before operating mouth on this subject ....Roy

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[Janine]

I have only once rung the 'out of hours' bell on the warden's gate at a CC club.

The dogs had locked me out of the 'van when I went over to the bins at 10pm. A lone female with no back-up, I had no choice.

I explained the situation to the warden and, after assessing the potential weak access points, he cheerfully went off to look for a tool to do the job.

When he came back to the 'van he was accompanied by his spouse and the other wardens, all in their dressing gowns, maybe ready for some extra training

Job done in front of a cheering crowd, we all retired happy.

I love the Caravan Club

 

[SIFTA SAM]

There is an obvious answer to any of these recent 'problems'.
Just blame them all on BOB* as I do?

*Blame it On Brexit.

 

[Viennese]

Last time I looked at the accounts of the big clubs they could more than afford it. Book into the smallest of hotels, there will always be someone on the end of a phone to help with anything, 24/7.

Unless you are Jeremy Clarkson and want a hot meal after working till late!!!

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