Broken wheel stud

Discussion in 'Motorhome Chat' started by Blisters, Jul 17, 2009.

  1. Blisters

    Blisters Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2008
    Messages:
    597
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    Stoke on Trent
    Today I decided to take the wheels of the M/H and check the brakes and repaint the wheels.

    But on trying to loosen the studs in one of the front wheels, crack, it sheared off

    I have spent 2 hours trying to get it out:swear:, with no joy, i managed to drill the centre out but no further, i assume these studs are hardened on the outside, which is why i cant drill them out, so how do i get it out:pray:

    the other 4 came out no prob
     
  2. savantuk

    savantuk Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2009
    Messages:
    751
    Likes Received:
    28
    Location:
    Cumbria, Lake district UK
    No problem. Most good engineers/garages/tyre depot's should be able to extract the stud with specialist tools.

    Needn't cost an arm or a leg either.
     
  3. Geo

    Geo Trader - Funster

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2007
    Messages:
    9,508
    Likes Received:
    5,562
    Location:
    Mansfield,Notts
    If its snapped coming out it has serious corrosion problems
    your drilling will have to be pin point accurate if you want the thread undamaged,
    constant soaking with penetrating fluid and then drill and use what we call an easy out, why their called that I dont know cos its anything but easy, you are going to need some serious drills too they are very very hard
    We would go down only two routes here in the garage
    1. Remove hub and take to an Engineer, IF you can find one interested,I doubt it:cry:
    2. New or second hand hub and bearing, would be our favoured method:thumb:
    Geo
     
  4. wildcamper

    wildcamper Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2007
    Messages:
    471
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    Merseyside
    you need an easy out witch you can buy from most motor factors :thumb:
     
  5. pappajohn

    pappajohn Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2007
    Messages:
    29,458
    Likes Received:
    16,888
    Location:
    YO11 2BD
    as doug says most garages will do the job but if you want to do it yourself you can buy stud extractors from motoring shops.

    basicaly a tapered, left hand thread tap.

    can remember your base vehicle but if a ducato then wheel studs should be tightened to 160nm to 180nm in a diagonal opposed sequence
    ie....1...3...5...2...4 starting at the top.

    you should be ok going to the garage on 4 studs:thumb:
     
  6. Blisters

    Blisters Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2008
    Messages:
    597
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    Stoke on Trent
    Geo, not sure why it is in so fast, the van is a 2004 ducato so not that old, no obvious sign of corrossion

    I thought about removing the hud, but couldn't get the caliper housing off, removed te caliper no probs, but the housing is held on with 2 big allen key bolts 14mm, will the budge, no way, even with a 2ft power bar

    i was hoping i might be able to get it to screw out the back of the hub (all the way through as it were)

    if i got the hub off i have a friend who is an engineer, so he would get it out i'm sure
     
  7. pappajohn

    pappajohn Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2007
    Messages:
    29,458
    Likes Received:
    16,888
    Location:
    YO11 2BD
    a sign of serious overtightening......the bolt will also be stretched.

    overtightening is just as dangerous as undertightening:Sad:

    the carrier bolts are tightened to 210nm and will need a longer bar or a real good pull to 'break' the thread.

    torque for wheel studs should be 160nm unless its a maxi chassis then its 180nm
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2009
  8. Geo

    Geo Trader - Funster

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2007
    Messages:
    9,508
    Likes Received:
    5,562
    Location:
    Mansfield,Notts
    Also given Garage labour rates these days, messing with such items is not really viable for 95% of workshops, were no longer kitted up:Doh:replacing damaged parts is very often less than repair nowadays
    We had to sell all the bench drills and lathes and most of the mechanical tools to make room for the computers,diagnostic and electrical equipment,
    We were once called Motor Engineers, alas we are now Rocket Scientists:RollEyes:
    Geo
     
  9. hilldweller

    hilldweller Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2008
    Messages:
    26,426
    Likes Received:
    25,080
    Location:
    Macclesfield
    Do you mean BOLTS - ours are bolts which makes it so difficult to get the first one in whilst juggling a heavy wheel.

    Heat is the best penetrating oil IMHO. I once had an exhaust stud in an Ali bike head that would not shift. I kept heating the stud, flood with PlusGas ( risking a fire a bit ) many times but in the end it saw things my way and the head was undamaged.

    So have you a bolt sheared off flush with the hub and now with a hole down the middle ? Hard to heat effectively. I'd try a small drill diagonally to hit the thread from the inside and try and introduce PlusGas ( the best ! ) into the middle. Or tap the hole you've drilled as big as possible and put a high tensile bold in to give you a head to turn - cap head or normal.

    Good luck.
     
  10. timv

    timv Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2008
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    WALLINGFORD, OXFORDSHIRE
    You could try a method we use in the commercial vehicle industry (HGV). What we do is weld a nut to the broken stud if you can, if it has broken flush weld a flat washer to the broken stud then weld a nut to the washer. This has to benefits, one it heats up the stud and two it gives a good grip for a spanner. Good luck
     
  11. ocsid

    ocsid Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2008
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    0
    dare I suggest it might be due to lubricating the threads and then torquing up to the "dry" value?
    It makes a big difference to the resulting tension in bolts/studs which are by design often close to yield without such over tightening.
     
  12. davetthedon

    davetthedon Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2009
    Messages:
    141
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Malvern, Worcestershire
    All good tips, but in my humble opinion, all these techniques are useless without a very large hammer and a very chunky centre punch. Give it a good bashin' right up the middle. Don't hit your fingers though, but a good beltin often eases a stiffy. If you know what I mean. :Wink: and afterwards use the spanner or left hand threaded watsit. If all fails at least you've vented your spleen. I have a lot of patience, but sometimes the direct approach is the quickest.
    ATB
    DaveT
     
  13. hilldweller

    hilldweller Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2008
    Messages:
    26,426
    Likes Received:
    25,080
    Location:
    Macclesfield
    Ah, a friend of Max Mosely. Are you in the same club ?
     
  14. davetthedon

    davetthedon Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2009
    Messages:
    141
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Malvern, Worcestershire
    I refute the allegation entirely. I have never been to Chelsea in my life, and I couldn't afford five pro's either. :Wink: And Bernie Ecclestone was just jealous!! :Rofl1:
     
  15. derekfaeberwick

    derekfaeberwick Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2007
    Messages:
    1,131
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Berwick
    Surely heating the stud- bolt has the wrong effect altogether. If it is a tight fit then heating the male part expands it thereby tightening the join further.:Eek!:Could be wrong but?
     
  16. olley

    olley Funster

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2007
    Messages:
    3,709
    Likes Received:
    2,098
    Location:
    Ipswich
    If you heat the stud, and then let it cool, the expansion and contraction effect will sometimes help to loosen it.

    Stud extractors can work but the hole size is important, to small and you can't get a big enough extractor in, to big and the extractor expands the stud tighter in the hole.

    One method is to carefully drill the stud out in stages using bigger and bigger drills, as soon as you think you are about to drill into the threads stop and using a little hammer and chisel, carefully fold the side of the stud into the middle, you will almost certainly do some slight damage to the threads, but unless you are really hamfisted it will only be cosmetic. Using this method it doesn't matter if you have drilled off centre.

    Olley
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2009
  17. hilldweller

    hilldweller Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2008
    Messages:
    26,426
    Likes Received:
    25,080
    Location:
    Macclesfield
    Guilty as charged.

    I am incapable of putting in an exposed bolt without copperslip. I just ask my bike to unclothe itself now and it does.

    I'm happy this way, is there ever anything ever "dry". Probably light oil coated in production to prevent rust, then down the line a dirty, rusty bolt is not "dry".
     
  18. chris v

    chris v Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2009
    Messages:
    29
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Burton upon Trent
    Hi,
    The bottom line is unless you are very lucky you will end up with a hub with a dodgy wheel bolt in it. The best thing to do is to get the hub off and take it to an engineering firm who can either extract the old broken stud or drill it and helicoil it, or get a replacement hub.
    If anyone is having difficulty refitting a wheel with studs the trick is to line up the easiest hole and fit a stud loosely and then turn the wheel so that this stud is at the top and all the other stud holes drop into line,
    Regards,
    Chris.
     
  19. Blisters

    Blisters Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2008
    Messages:
    597
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    Stoke on Trent
    Thanks guys for the help, think I will go to a tyre place on Monday and hope, on the subject of putting copper slip on the bolts, is this a good idea given they are wheel nuts, wouldn't want them to work loose.
     
  20. hilldweller

    hilldweller Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2008
    Messages:
    26,426
    Likes Received:
    25,080
    Location:
    Macclesfield
    Good point. I do. Never had one come lose yet. I may be wrong though. But I do put it on the thread, not the friction surface of the countersink.

    Copperslip isn't a lubricant as such, it's anti seize, it must not be used in place of grease.
     
Loading...

Share This Page