Brenner Pass - Non-Motorway road

Discussion in 'Continental Touring' started by strathspey, Apr 13, 2010.

  1. strathspey

    strathspey Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    May 19, 2009
    Messages:
    62
    Likes Received:
    4
    Location:
    North Yorkshire
    Has anyone used the ordinary (non-motorway) road (the 182 from Innsbruck - which becomes the S12 in Italy, to cross the Brenner.
    I've used the motorway over the pass in past years, but thought we might try the other road if it's OK.
    We have a Hymer 552 TCL with bike on the back - overall length about 24 feet.
    I would appreciate any comments from anyone who has used this route.
     
  2. Robinhood

    Robinhood Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2010
    Messages:
    159
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sherwood Forest
    I've used it to transit from Italy to Germany without tolls, but it was some years ago.

    AFAIR, it was a relatively easy, if somewhat winding, route.

    The roads get a bit complicated at the Innsbruck end (easy to get sucked onto the Autobahn), but I would certainly attempt it again.
     
  3. TishF650

    TishF650 Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2008
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hi,

    We came that way beginning of Nov this year.

    It's not the length of van that's a problem it's the weight limits. Signs prohibit anything over 3.5 tonne (without permission). It's not easy to find the start of the road in Innsbruck as the authorities seem determined to force you onto the motorway so they can charge high tolls or fines if you're over 3.5T and don't have a Go Box.

    That said I believe the new toll system has now come in but we haven't looked into that yet.

    So yes it's possible and not very difficult but it does take longer than the motorway route.

    You can see our version of events at

    http://www.theworldisourlobster.com...s/2009/11/12_10_Germany_-_Bavaria_(sigh).html

    Hope that link worked, if not it's entry number 10 under "Latest" at

    www.thewordisourlobster.com

    Chris
     
  4. Robinhood

    Robinhood Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2010
    Messages:
    159
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sherwood Forest
    As might be implied from my post above, i've been caught by this issue both here and elsewhere in Austria.

    It's worthwhile noting what I picked up from another forum, and have posted elsewhere on this site.

    Backed by the Austrian authorities, it would appear that a 3.5t limit by itself applies to all vehicles (fairly logically), whilst one associated with the picture of a truck would be applied by the Austrians to HGVs only (and they would not see a motorhome over 3.5t as being an HGV, despite its UK PHGV status).

    Not sure what the signs on the Brenner are like (oh for Google Streetview in Austria), but this might help.
     
  5. strathspey

    strathspey Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    May 19, 2009
    Messages:
    62
    Likes Received:
    4
    Location:
    North Yorkshire
     
  6. Robinhood

    Robinhood Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2010
    Messages:
    159
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sherwood Forest
    Be careful: AFAIK the standard motorway tolls do not apply to the Brenner motorway, for which an additional toll is payable.

    For up to 3.5t the vignette is not valid and an additional toll of around euro 8 is payable.

    For over 3.5t, the normal per km rate for the GO Box is suspended, and it will cost in the order of euro 28-30 for the stretch from Innsbruck to the border, depending on emissions category.
     
  7. Braunston

    Braunston Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    1,415
    Likes Received:
    7
    Hi,

    Seriously looks like we will be giving Austria a wide berth for the foreseeable future, I would have thought that they derive a lot of income from holiday makers including those with motorhomes, but it seems if your motorhome weight is over 3500kg they don't want you to visit or pass through.
     
  8. Robinhood

    Robinhood Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2010
    Messages:
    159
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sherwood Forest
    I must agree.

    Prior to the change in rules, and owning a 'van over 3.5t, Austria was probably our favourite destination for our main annual break.

    Since then, in eight years we have only visited once.

    In theory, you can manage without using the Autobahns; In practice, my experience has been a plethora of 3.5t limits on other roads - but see my post above on this which might change my opinion a bit.
     
  9. Braunston

    Braunston Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    1,415
    Likes Received:
    7
    Hi,

    Taking some information from a similar thread on another forum together with discussions with people who have used the old Brenner pass a few years ago I have plotted a route on Autoroute 2007 which avoids the motorways from Fussen to Lake Garda, which I would appreciate comments on as we are seriously thinking about using it in the next few weeks.

    Taking this with the suggestion above that the motorway portion of the New Brenner Pass is charged separately to the normal over 3500kg rates, would this imply that if my route didn't pan out in certain places I could perhaps hop on and off the new Brenner Pass only paying for the part that I used ? as that would perhaps make it more acceptable for taking a chance as we are 4000kg and the normal Go Box rates appear extortionate.

    I have attached a Autoroute 2007 file (Ziped hope it works) that shows my proposed route around Innsbruck avoiding the motorways and also contains all of the ASCI Camping card 2010 sites as push pins

    Any comments would be welcome, as from what I have been told the old Brenner Pass is a very scenic route.
     
  10. Robinhood

    Robinhood Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2010
    Messages:
    159
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sherwood Forest
    Don't think this would work for you. I was trying to be careful in my wording in a previous post. For Innsbruck to the border on the Brenner Motorway, I believe you will still need a Go-Box, but it will not charge you the standard per-kilometre rate for that stretch. It is a special toll route, for which a single fixed rate is charged of something up to euro 30 inc Vat, depending on your emissions category.

    See http://www.go-maut.at/go/Article.asp?ID=328&Navi=3 and check if your intepretation is the same - the maps elsewhere on this site also imply a Go-Box is required for that stretch.

    Can't see your attachment, so can't comment.

    Recent postings on other forums imply the old Brenner road is still quite usable, though you may have to ignore any 3.5t 'truck' signs, see my previous post.
     
  11. hilldweller

    hilldweller Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2008
    Messages:
    26,460
    Likes Received:
    25,145
    Location:
    Macclesfield
    We moan about GB but these foreigners have caught on to the rip off culture. In many ways it's worse over on mainland Europe because hopping from country to country is commonplace and now you get nicely shafted by each one.

    Emission charge - what nonsense. If a vehicle is very polluting, charging does not make it less polluting. You've never seen "this building has asbestos so we'll put up the rates" have you.

    We rode the Brenner pass 6 years ago, what sticks in my mind is excellent twisty biker road. Perspective might be totally different in a MH.

    It seems to me that the Swiss deal for >4t is better than farting around trying to get some Austrian electronic wallet lightening tool. But if he needs Austria then he needs Austria.
     
  12. lorger

    lorger Funster

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    6,190
    Likes Received:
    7,560
    Location:
    Dumfries
    Hi
    Reading this post with interest as we are going to Lake Garda in July, as we are getting off ferry in rotterdam we thought going via Austria to be best route plus we've never been before.
    We are under 3.5t so what do i need iif anything im not fussy about motorways as we have loads of time to get there. I had hoped to go via the Brenner pass but not the toll road.

    Advice more than welcome
    Gerry
     
  13. Braunston

    Braunston Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    1,415
    Likes Received:
    7
    Hi,

    I have emailed the "GO" or what ever they are called regarding the need for a Go Box, and whether I could obtain one at the motorway junction if i needed to use it ? if I get an answer I will post it.

    On using their online calculator the price does reduce the further down the Brenner Autoroute you go (or the nearer Italy you get before having to perhaps use it) so the longer you can stay on the B182 the better. From Natter just south of Innsbruck to Italy for Euro III 2 axle works out at €24.38 plus VAT I believe and if you got as far as Schonberg im Stubaital before having to join it was €17.58 plus VAT.

    The other question I'm a bit confused about is the payment systems for the Go Box as if we do need to get one when we enter Austria rather than when we enter a motorway, if we were successful in getting through without using a motorway/toll road would we get our money back ? anyone know (Sounds a bit like the great escape:Rofl1::Rofl1:

    And thanks for the heads up on the 3.5ton signs that does look helpful especially if they show a lorry.

    I am still trying to reduce the size of the AXE file i have zipped it up but its still to big any suggestions




     
  14. Robinhood

    Robinhood Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2010
    Messages:
    159
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sherwood Forest
    There is the ability to research purchase points on the GO-Maut site. There is one at Innsbruck-Sud, one at Schonberg, and one at Gries as you head down (up?) the valley.

    I haven't used a Go-Box since they were introduced (a pity, since Austria used to get a lot of my Holiday money previously) so didn't know what the return procedure was. Deep in the supporting documents of the associated ASFINAG site is the pukka gen.

    "If there is still some unused toll credit when the GO-Box is returned (only applies to the pre-pay
    procedure), this sum will be refunded, whereby any unpaid tolls will be invoiced separately in
    accordance with section 7.3, retroactive billing.
    If the unused toll credit is less than the last amount with which the GO-Box was charged (toll
    credit top-up), the money will be refunded using the means of payment that was last used to
    charge the GO-Box. In other words, the money will either be refunded in cash (whereby payment
    with Quick Chip is the same as cash payment), credited to a petrol card or credit card or, in the
    event of payment using Maestro, by means of a transfer to the customer’s bank account. If the
    unused toll credit is greater than the last amount with which the GO-Box was charged, the last
    amount with which the GO-Box was charged will be refunded using the means of payment that
    was last used to charge the GO-Box. The difference between the toll credit and the last amount
    with which the GO-Box was charged, on the other hand, will be refunded using the means of
    payment that was used to charge the GO-Box on the last but one occasion. This refund
    procedure, which is necessary as a result of the current terms and conditions of use for credit
    cards and petrol card, will be repeated in this manner until such time as the entire toll credit has
    been refunded.
    If a GO-Box for the pre-pay procedure is sent by post to ASFINAG Maut Service GmbH, any
    unused toll credit is only credited to the customer’s account if name, address, and bank account
    details including name of the account holder, IBAN, and BIC (if the GO-Box toll credit was topped
    up using cash, Maestro, or Quick Chip) are provided.
    Refunds are only credited to the customer’s bank account when the unused toll credit exceeds
    € 5.00."


    So it would seem that you do get a refund of unused credit (less, I would assume, the euro 5 initial charge for the box). Easiest way would be on finally leaving Austria at a purchase point.

    Hope this helps - I'd still go for the full non-motorway route if I were you.

     
  15. Braunston

    Braunston Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    1,415
    Likes Received:
    7
    Hi, Robinhood

    Thanks for the info really helpful, and it certainly answers one of my main questions as it did look that I could stand to lose around €55 if I only used it from Innsbruck into Italy and returned via another country.

    I have been looking at the Pre-Pay against the Post-Pay as it seems that if you can sign up to the Post-pay then they just bill you for what you use, or that's what it seems to me, albeit I can't really understand if its possible to sign up to the post pay at the same time as obtaining the Go-Box. It appears on the surface to be the best way, if I happen to have to go onto a tolled road then they can bill me but if I manage to get through without, no-charge.

    The main reason I'm interested in looking at this route is that we missed some places on our journey down the Romantic Road last year and would like to go back again and see some of them, and that will drop us into Fussen. So logically the route through Austria would suit us and as we are over 3500kg we are looking at the most cost affective way through, I have said before people have told us that the old Brenner Pass is a really nice and scenic way to go, hope they are correct.
     
  16. Robinhood

    Robinhood Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2010
    Messages:
    159
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sherwood Forest
    Post-pay used to be (and probably still is) Austrian issued Credit Card only (and possibly American Express would do nicely!).

    edit : Yes, only Austrian issued mastercard and visa, any American Express or Diners Card appears to be the rule.
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2010
  17. hilldweller

    hilldweller Funster Life Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2008
    Messages:
    26,460
    Likes Received:
    25,145
    Location:
    Macclesfield
    Why don't they just put up big signs on the borders "Piss Off We Don't Want You".
     
  18. Robinhood

    Robinhood Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2010
    Messages:
    159
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Sherwood Forest
    'cos that's not German :Blush:
     
  19. Braunston

    Braunston Read Only Funster

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    1,415
    Likes Received:
    7
    Hi, Gerry

    Missed your post, if you intend to use motorways in Austria you will need to purchase a Vignette all of the information and prices can be found here http://www.asfinag.at/index.php?idtopic=504 ,

    From information I have gained from different sources it appears it may be possible to cross Austria without touching a motorway/toll road, which hopefully will make it free, and that's what this discussion is generally about, albeit motorhomes over 3500kg have different toll charges to those shown in the link I gave above.

    At the moment it looks very likely that we may try the toll free route, for a bit of fun and so I'm told some very nice scenery. I'm just contemplating the options I have just in case the non motorway route I have chosen is blocked needing a detour which involves me ending up on a motorway .

    I have plotted a route on Microsoft's Autoroute 2007 but I can't seem to make in small enough to be allowed to upload it for comments, but I will continue to try.

    hope that makes sense of the thread

     
  20. lorger

    lorger Funster

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    6,190
    Likes Received:
    7,560
    Location:
    Dumfries
    Thanks braunston i have had a look at the link seems ok price wise for under 3.5t i would be interested in seeing your route you have planned out so hopefully you will be able to load it.

    Gerry
     
Loading...

Share This Page