Another 'Tyre' rant.... (2 Viewers)

Chris

LIFE MEMBER
May 5, 2010
21,006
274,554
Funster No
11,412
MH
None
Exp
10 years
Well I have learnt something this morning.(y)

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

scotjimland

LIFE MEMBER
Jul 25, 2007
2,086
9,022
Suffolk Coastal District, UK
Funster No
15
MH
Timberland
Just had two new front tyres fitted to my Honda CRV by the Honda main dealer.. they never mentioned anything about putting them on the rear..
I never questioned either.. . in almost 50 years of motoring that is the 'way it has always done'.. and it's never led me to having an accident..

right or wrong ?.. I'm not going to debate..

what you don't hear much of these days is tyre rotation to even out the wear..
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
C

Chockswahay

Deleted User
That's a bit of a mis-quote.

The correct version is:

You can lead a gift horse to the water but you can't look in it's mouth.

(That one gets the brain cells confused!):)

Err...I think you are a little confused with that one :confused::confused:

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
OP
OP
C

Chockswahay

Deleted User
Just had two new front tyres fitted to my Honda CRV by the Honda main dealer.. they never mentioned anything about putting them on the rear..
I never questioned either.. . in almost 50 years of motoring that is the 'way it has always done'.. and it's never led to an accident..

right or wrong ?.. I'm not going to debate..

what you don't hear much of these days is tyre rotation to even out the wear..

I too have had new tyres fitted on the front of all my cars over many years (including on a Peugeot 107 2 years ago) ...... this 'new' information does indeed go against previous thinking but the facts are evident and beyond dispute.

As for accidents, I disagree, I think many accidents have been caused by this...... it's probably just that no one has ever really thought about it :eek:
 
OP
OP
C

Chockswahay

Deleted User
I should have said .. 'me having an accident'.. now edited..

not disputing the latest thinking..
Ah....LOL I haven't had an accident resulting from the 'tyre positions' either (or maybe I have ???) :confused::eek:

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

JeanLuc

Free Member
Nov 17, 2008
3,304
2,199
Warwickshire
Funster No
4,952
MH
Hymer B630 Star-Line
Exp
Since 2007
Just to add to the fun - here is an extract from the Continental Tyre Data Book 2014 (Operating Instructions).

Mounting new tyres on the rear axle
It is recommended that all tyres used on the vehicle be replaced at the same time. If this is not the case, at least all the tyres on the same axle should be replaced at the same time.
If only one axle set of tyres is replaced, it is recommended to fit the newest tyres on the rear axle. This may complicate tyre rotation and caution is advised if the tyres differ in terms of state of wear, size, design and Speed Index, for example. In this case it is strongly recommended that a trained tyre specialist be consulted.
The point of the above mounting recommendation is to increase traction on the rear axle. This is important in avoiding oversteer and loss of vehicle stability on slippery surfaces.
 
OP
OP
C

Chockswahay

Deleted User
strongly recommended that a trained tyre specialist be consulted

That's the bit that made me rant in the first place! I asked a 'specialist' and discovered I know more than he does :eek:
 
Dec 12, 2010
5,368
21,192
Cumbria
Funster No
14,651
MH
C Class
Exp
since 2011
When I sold my Mk 2 Escort and moved onto a fwd Astra back in the 70's, the only way to get the back end out, was to put the most worn tyres on the back, and employ a bit of "lift off" oversteer, used to play havoc with my mother's shopping :LOL:
On a more serious note, I think some of the confusion arises from folks thinking fwd's need the grip at the front for traction purposes and how "improved" the steering feels when you've got new rubber on the front.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

mariner

LIFE MEMBER
Nov 21, 2013
1,283
3,778
Isle of Dogs, but mostly Artola Spain.
Funster No
29,109
MH
Caravan
Exp
Since 2007. But no more.
You will always get people saying that they have done this that and the other, against best advice for years and nothing bad has ever happened.
This is probably true but one day it just might and IMO it's best to have the right equipment in the right places giving you and yours the best chance of surviving it.
I managed for the Michelin Group, whose training in tyre technology is probably the best in the world.
If the man from Michelin says fit the best tyres on the rear axle, you would be daft not to take his advice.
You are not the only one on the road, you might survive serious oversteer but the people you hit in that car coming the other way, may not.


:cooler:
 
Jan 3, 2008
3,329
5,340
Pakefield, Lowestoft, Suffolk, UK
Funster No
1,118
MH
Looking
Exp
35
An interesting and surprising thread. Interesting advice from Michelin, Continental and Tyresafe, I didn't previously know about this but if I ever have to replace just two tyres they will certainly go on the back. Surprising that some may choose to ignore the best advice from the industry and insist they know better. Well that's their choice, good luck to them. I just hope they never have an accident that might have been avoided.
 

scotjimland

LIFE MEMBER
Jul 25, 2007
2,086
9,022
Suffolk Coastal District, UK
Funster No
15
MH
Timberland
I fully understand that fitting new tyres on the front and old on the rear with just the legal tread depth would be foolish..
Ideally they should be fitted as a full set, but in the real world the front generally wear faster than the rear so they need replaced sooner.. but what if the rear have say 6mm?

Just checked mine, new on front 8mm .. rear about 5.5 mm .. is that going to be an issue? I calculate that by the time the rears are worn out, I will need a full set..

A new tyre starts out life with about 8mm of thread depth.. at what depth does it start to affect road holding ?

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

Photo4x4

Free Member
Jul 26, 2014
371
873
Scottish Highlands
Funster No
32,556
MH
Coachbuilt with over cab
Exp
Newbie
Don't take my word for it, just Google it and you will see.....
I wouldn't take too much notice of that, after all you can google 'moon landings' and you will find people who will tell you it was all a hoax! :)

Google is responsible for spreading all sorts of nonsense.

Go with what the tyre and vehicle manufacturers tell you. They will have spent millions of £/$ on research and it is NOT in their interests to give you duff gen.

Also if you had an accident and the insurance company could prove that you deliberately fitted tyres against the manufacturers instructions, they would have a good case for not paying out.

KH
 

mariner

LIFE MEMBER
Nov 21, 2013
1,283
3,778
Isle of Dogs, but mostly Artola Spain.
Funster No
29,109
MH
Caravan
Exp
Since 2007. But no more.
Once the tread wear indicators are almost level with the tread face the tyres need replacing.

That should be around 2 mm of tread across the whole tread face.

If any part of the tread face is less than this you should replace the tyre and this should be done in pairs.


:cooler:
 

DBK

LIFE MEMBER
Jan 9, 2013
17,969
47,804
Plympton, Devon
Funster No
24,219
MH
PVC, Murvi Morocco
Exp
2013
I fully understand that fitting new tyres on the front and old on the rear with just the legal tread depth would be foolish..
Ideally they should be fitted as a full set, but in the real world the front generally wear faster than the rear so they need replaced sooner.. but what if the rear have say 6mm?

Just checked mine, new on front 8mm .. rear about 5.5 mm .. is that going to be an issue? I calculate that by the time the rears are worn out, I will need a full set..

A new tyre starts out life with about 8mm of thread depth.. at what depth does it start to affect road holding ?
The document linked to on post #17 on the first page gives a good reason why you shouldn't leave the oldest tyres on the rear axle, because of the risk of an age related failure.

Of course if you drive gently everywhere you may never notice the benefit of having the best tyres on the rear. The "been doing it all my life and never had a problem" argument. But you never know when something unexpected might happen.

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

sdc77

Free Member
Jan 28, 2013
3,244
4,550
Weardale, Co Durham
Funster No
24,456
MH
Coachbuilt
Exp
since 2011
I fully understand that fitting new tyres on the front and old on the rear with just the legal tread depth would be foolish..
Ideally they should be fitted as a full set, but in the real world the front generally wear faster than the rear so they need replaced sooner.. but what if the rear have say 6mm?

Just checked mine, new on front 8mm .. rear about 5.5 mm .. is that going to be an issue? I calculate that by the time the rears are worn out, I will need a full set..

A new tyre starts out life with about 8mm of thread depth.. at what depth does it start to affect road holding ?


I can't imagine that the depths you mention are going to make much difference.. But why not go with the best to the rear rule anyway.. It means that all wheels and tyres will be off.. They will be inspected in the open and can be re-balanced if required. It should only cost a few quid extra at the most..

Anyone advocating the front wheels having best tread .. or that they can hold it on a bend with the back end stepping out etc.. Is surely having a laugh and not being serious.
This post has to underline why fun is such a good forum.. A life saving post that everyone learns from.
 

scotjimland

LIFE MEMBER
Jul 25, 2007
2,086
9,022
Suffolk Coastal District, UK
Funster No
15
MH
Timberland
I can't imagine that the depths you mention are going to make much difference.. But why not go with the best to the rear rule anyway.. It means that all wheels and tyres will be off.. They will be inspected in the open and can be re-balanced if required. It should only cost a few quid extra at the most..

as I said earlier.. they were fitted by the Honda dealer at the annual service and MOT ..
.. .. I trusted their judgment... perhaps ill placed ..

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
OP
OP
C

Chockswahay

Deleted User
as I said earlier.. they were fitted by the Honda dealer at the annual service and MOT ..
.. .. I trusted their judgment... perhaps ill placed ..
This is back to where my 'rant' started............ no real faith in the dealers.....:mad:
 

JeanLuc

Free Member
Nov 17, 2008
3,304
2,199
Warwickshire
Funster No
4,952
MH
Hymer B630 Star-Line
Exp
Since 2007
In practice, I find that the rear tyres on the motorhome wear fastest so I rotate them diagonally once the difference is significant (say 2mm less on the rear than the front). On my Subaru, they wear more or less evenly all round but I still rotate them diagonally after about 12,000 miles.
 
OP
OP
C

Chockswahay

Deleted User
I wouldn't take too much notice of that, after all you can google 'moon landings' and you will find people who will tell you it was all a hoax! :)

Google is responsible for spreading all sorts of nonsense.

Go with what the tyre and vehicle manufacturers tell you. They will have spent millions of £/$ on research and it is NOT in their interests to give you duff gen.

Also if you had an accident and the insurance company could prove that you deliberately fitted tyres against the manufacturers instructions, they would have a good case for not paying out.

KH
I'm confused by your post ..... the facts are plain and simple. Are you suggesting we ignore them?

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Oct 20, 2014
1,339
5,953
Hampshire
Funster No
33,905
MH
Adria Coral 680 SL
Exp
Since 2014
It may be my brother, Tyretles, he has a place in Scotland. (y)

He plays a different instrument to you though, doesn't he @Tootles ....... :D

image.jpg
 

Tootles

Funster
Deceased RIP
Sep 14, 2013
9,511
34,799
Lancaster
Funster No
28,093
MH
Coachbuilt
Exp
Was a newbie, now a Middie.
He plays a different instrument to you though, doesn't he @Tootles ....... :D

View attachment 57365
Yes, but you can see the family resemblance.......:) He wasn't always like that. Some years ago, he bought a car from Chiperfields Circus. Within 100yds of driving off, the bonnet, boot, doors and wings fell off. Then, there was an almighty BANG, and the rest fell apart. He tried to get his money back, but they refused, and so he took them to the Small Clowns Court, and won. The judge awarded him a red nose, tube of lippy, bowler hat and a squirty flower. :):)
 

Photo4x4

Free Member
Jul 26, 2014
371
873
Scottish Highlands
Funster No
32,556
MH
Coachbuilt with over cab
Exp
Newbie
I'm confused by your post ..... the facts are plain and simple. Are you suggesting we ignore them?
I spend most of my life confused! :)

I'm just suggesting being careful of what you find on the internet. If you do enough googling you'll find whatever answer you want.

I think you should do what the manufacturers say. If they say put the new tyres on the rear then that is what you should do - even if you find someone on Google saying the opposite.

KH

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 
Oct 20, 2014
1,339
5,953
Hampshire
Funster No
33,905
MH
Adria Coral 680 SL
Exp
Since 2014
Yes, but you can see the family resemblance.......:) He wasn't always like that. Some years ago, he bought a car from Chiperfields Circus. Within 100yds of driving off, the bonnet, boot, doors and wings fell off. Then, there was an almighty BANG, and the rest fell apart. He tried to get his money back, but they refused, and so he took them to the Small Clowns Court, :rofl: :rofl: and won. The judge awarded him a red nose, tube of lippy, bowler hat and a squirty flower. :):)

:rofl: :rofl: Oh you do make me laugh!
 
Sep 23, 2013
2,579
8,604
Lincs
Funster No
28,231
MH
Globecar Campscout
Exp
Since 2008 (started in a VW T4 campervan)
On my Subaru, they wear more or less evenly all round but I still rotate them diagonally after about 12,000 miles.
A bit OT, but probably worth a mention:

On a Subaru, if it's a permanent 4 wheel drive model, it is particularly important to keep the tyre wear even on all 4 wheels. If the rolling radius gets at all out of step between the front & the rear axle, you get wind up in the centre coupling between front & rear when used on tarmac. It's not designed to slip, so that loss of traction at either end doesn't lead to one end just spinning uselessly. The effect of mismatched tyres is a lot of strain on the centre coupling leading to very early failure - as my colleague found out to her (expensive) cost.
 
OP
OP
C

Chockswahay

Deleted User
I spend most of my life confused! :)

I'm just suggesting being careful of what you find on the internet. If you do enough googling you'll find whatever answer you want.

I think you should do what the manufacturers say. If they say put the new tyres on the rear then that is what you should do - even if you find someone on Google saying the opposite.

KH

I think you missed my point, I do believe the manufacturers, that is why I started this rant in the first place. My reference to 'Googling' was to help point the 'doubters' in the right direction :rolleyes:. Nearly every reference on the 'net does actually support the 'best grip on the back' :)

Subscribers  do not see these advertisements

 

Join us or log in to post a reply.

To join in you must be a member of MotorhomeFun

Join MotorhomeFun

Join us, it quick and easy!

Log in

Already a member? Log in here.

Latest journal entries

Funsters who are viewing this thread

Back
Top