American 5ver + Euro Pick up?

Discussion in 'Fifth Wheelers' started by zaskar, Oct 21, 2008.

  1. zaskar

    zaskar Funster

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    I would like to hear from anyone who tows an American 5ver with a European pick up.
    I'm looking at the Kountry Lite 26RL Low profile from Calder Leisure who recomend the Nissan Navara as a suitable tug.

    NOTE

    To those 5ver owners who have gone down the Yank pick up route, with the greatest of respect, please do not respond.
    I'm specifically looking to talk to European pick up owners/users.

    Thanks.:BigGrin:
     
  2. robrobc

    robrobc Read Only Funster

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    Hmmmm interesting As someone who has switched from a Navara to an American Pick Up I would suggest that you reconsider your last paragraph as you may find our experiences very valid. :Angry:
     
  3. vwalan

    vwalan Funster

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    just make sure you have about 140 bhp. i have tried with 100 bhp n its slow . you could use iveco daily ,merc sprinter, vwlt . i recomend mitsubishi or izusu.you can have a really good 7 seater truck.
     
  4. tink

    tink Read Only Funster

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    Hi Zascar this question has been asked a few times, I have a 27' extreme light that I pull with a 98 L200 dbl cab 2.5 diesel, it manages it OK but if you expect it to level the hills out like the big Yanks it ain't going to happen but if your prepared to sit on the motorway & run with the trucks you will not be disappointed. Being a trucker myself I am quite at home with it, but you will need some good towing mirrors the euro pickups are a bit narrow to see around a 7'6 5ver. I have a set of ring mirrors that clip onto the truck ones but even right on the edge with a cable tie to stop me losing them I can only just see down the side ( I think the mirrors on my Scania have spoilt me) Regards Tink.
     
  5. zaskar

    zaskar Funster

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    Thanks Tink, much appreciated.:Smile:

    Comments like this.............."but if your prepared to sit on the motorway & run with the trucks you will not be disappointed." are exactly what I'm looking for.
    We all know we can get more power and speed from an American V8, it's not rocket science, but is it really necessary? IMHO, no.
    If that floats anyone elses boat, fine, I'm not gonn argue, thats your choice, but it's not what I'm looking for.
    My priorities are comfort on site and economy on the road. Speed is waaaaaay down on my list, as is spending thouands on a fuel conversion which with my milage will NEVER pay me back and which IMHO is gonna be the next area of motoring to get a battering from the tax man, just like they did with diesel once enough people boarded the band wagon:cry:
     
  6. robrobc

    robrobc Read Only Funster

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    Comments like this.............."but if your prepared to sit on the motorway & run with the trucks you will not be disappointed." are exactly what I'm looking for.
    We all know we can get more power and speed from an American V8, it's not rocket science, but is it really necessary? IMHO, no.

    I would not disagree with your subjective opinions, we are all entitled to them, as I am to mine, however let's look at some facts.

    Looking at the Specification sheets for the KountryLite 26RL there is a stated Dry Weight of 2795 Kg, and a Cargo Capacity of 855 Kg.

    Now turning to the specifications for the Navarra, I found the following link
    Nissan UK, Navara Pickup - Performance

    This states that the Towing Capacity is 2700Kg.

    So the weight of the Kountrylite (Dry) exceeds the stated maximum of the Navarra. Please correct me if I am wrong here.

    Maybe Construction and Use Regs may be being breached here?
    Wonder how the Insurance companies would view this in the case of a claim?

    I think I would wish to square in my own mind and on paper, irrespective of my or your views, opinions or such like, just what sort of liability I may be entering in to.
     
  7. vwalan

    vwalan Funster

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    remember if the trailer imposes20%of its wgt on to the pick up everything changes.
     
  8. zaskar

    zaskar Funster

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    [ Please correct me if I am wrong here.

    QUOTE]

    I'm afraid you are, or at least I think you are based on more expert knowledge than mine that I picked up on another Forum.
    The figure you are correctly quoting is the "direct" pull max towing capactity and if it were the correct figure to use, then yes, the Navara would be overloaded.
    However, towing a 5th wheel is diferent to towing a caravan. Apparently, a certain percentage of the "trailers" mass is converted to downforce on the towing pin and because of this, the max capacity for the Navara is not exceeded by the rig I want to tow.

    I would also add that apparently the Navara/KountryLite RL26 combination has been granted type approval by VOSPA.
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2008
  9. vwalan

    vwalan Funster

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    use something a bit bigger than a nissan , i think you really need a tow truck based on at least 5/6 ton . make it a proper artic . they are a bit wider and have a little in reserve. you still cant go fast but you can only sit with the trucks , you are one. iveco and izusu use 3.5 ton down rated bigger units .but there are benifits to being over 3.5ton .
     
  10. robrobc

    robrobc Read Only Funster

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    excellent....................go for it then:BigGrin:
     
  11. Chrisdy

    Chrisdy Read Only Funster

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    Not wanting to get flamed, but a s/h US Pickup which has already been converted to LPG could well work out cheaper to purchase and run than a new Japanese Pickup, yet you get the improved towing capacity and power. Your choice of course, but it seems silly to write off a potentially viable alternative option before you even start.
     
  12. robrobc

    robrobc Read Only Funster

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    I agree..........I found that my *******(European/Japanese pick up) under this sort of load was not as economical as my Yank Diesel (Automatic Gearbox) Pick Up. That is before it decided to munch its own innards........several times :Smile::Smile::Smile:
     
  13. dazzer

    dazzer Read Only Funster

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    The gross vehicle weight of a Navara is 2805kg. (see here Nissan navara 2.5 dci 4x4 d/cab (2006) - Nissan navara specs - IC Auto Nissan)

    Gross weight been vehicle plus ANYTHING else.

    Weight of vehicle is 1962kgs
    Weight of trailer is 2795 kgs empty or 3650kgs loaded with full payload.
    Total weight is 5612kgs fully loaded or 4757kgs empty

    Type approval or not not only is it overloaded but i would say dangerously so if these numbers are correct.:Eeek:

    I find these numbers a bit hard to believe as they do seem high but the sums dont lie. Can someone tell me where ive gone wrong??:thumb:

    You also might want to look here Nissan Navara Reviews. Compare Reliability and Performance of New and Used 4x4 at Review Centre . It isnt pleasant reading :cry:

    I have owned a Navara for 2 weeks before i sent it back :Eeek: and bought a real pick up :thumb:. Why would you want to buy a vehicle that you know is right on the edge of its usable limit....its madness:Blush:
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2008
  14. vwalan

    vwalan Funster

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    goodmorning happy 5ers . dazzar have you read the other thread about licencing? it is possible for an artic unit to pull 3 times its own unladen wght . it may be very slow but it is legal. another multiple we can use is 2.5 times the truck n trailer unladen wgt. all in construction and use of motor vehicles. i do agree a yank has power but i am not sure about there trainwgts or even there unladen wgts. i think we all need at least 3litres 140 bhp.low reving engines. my lt50 was only just enough at 100bhp it has been up mountains n across the sahara but very slowly . my newer mitzy canter 6.3ton is really nice to drive n has 7 seats . always nice to have abit of spare power saves wear n tear on truck. not that i wouldnt have a yank ,i prefer the lorry look to a pickup.:thumb:
     
  15. robrobc

    robrobc Read Only Funster

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    I agree Dazzer..................on the limit towing just does not work for me.............. I would rather spend more of fuel & general motoring costs and get to my destination relatively unstressed.
    Towing with a Japanese pick up on the limit as I have done is like banging your head against a brick wall.............nice when it stops. :BigGrin: Which in the case of my Japanese Pick Up was very frequently as it was always breaking. That said it does provide me with a :Rofl1: when I see them fully loaded on the roads........we call it recovery roulette as you never know when it will let you down.
     
  16. dazzer

    dazzer Read Only Funster

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    :Rofl1::Rofl1:
    We only had ours for 2 weeks and used it for towing a trailer with a minidigger on it. It was a gutless wonder and so agricultural it may have been a tractor in a previous life :Rofl1:. The dealer wasnt happy about getting it back but we gave em the "not fit for purpose" line and they gave us our money back :thumb:.

    I now use the Lightning :Cool: for towing the trailer and its like chalk and cheese. Dont get me wrong i think the Navara is a great looking truck with all the bling bits of chrome and rollover bars but it doesnt get anywhere near the Lightning on looks, performance, towing capability, payload, interior space, equipment and it wont outdo a Porche Boxter :Eeek: away from lights like my baby will!!!

    Yes it uses more fuel than the Nissan but it is a very small price to pay :thumb::Smile:
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2008
  17. vwalan

    vwalan Funster

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    hiya dazzer . would be interesting to know the wgts of your truck n trailer .what 5er do you pull?i dont know what the specs are for yank trucks .i understand the power wgt thing but it would be nice to have figures.i am a trucker at heart so will always go for the lorry look .just as well we are all different.:thumb:
     
  18. robrobc

    robrobc Read Only Funster

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    I generally go to the Manufacturers web sites in the US for all the statistics. They seem to publish a lot more data than we do. I have noticed that the weights have hardly changed over the last few years, also if you go to any US secondhand pick up sales web site they have to include a copy of the plated weights in the advert. Hope this helps. btw The dually (twin wheel) weights are simply staggering IMHO.
     
  19. dazzer

    dazzer Read Only Funster

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    Hi

    I dont have a 5er (wifee wont let me get 1 :cry::Angry:). But i do tow a bloody big heavy trailer around a lot!!

    Specs for the Lightning as quoted by Ford USA are

    Ford SVT F-150
    Lightning Regular Cab (4x2) Flareside with a 5.4L 2V Triton Supercharged Intercooled SOHC
    SFI V-8 Engine, a 4-Speed Automatic Overdrive Transmission (4R100 HD), a 3.73:1 Limited
    Slip Rear Axle Ratio, 120” Wheelbase, 18” Tires, is equipped with a Class III Trailer Towing
    Package, and has a maximum Gross Combined Weight Rating (GCWR) of 13,500 pounds. The
    GCWR is the combined maximum weight of your fully loaded truck and trailer. The maximum
    Loaded Trailer Weight is 8,800 pounds. The maximum Frontal Area of the Trailer is 60 Feet.
    By subtracting the GVW from the GCWR, you can determine a comfortable towing maximum.
    It is important to remain within this limit and to not exceed the GCWR.

    :thumb:

    The towing capacity of it are unreal considering its a single wheel rear axle but it will pull the side off a house and carry the skip to chuck the mess into!!!! :Eeek: :Rofl1::thumb:
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2008
  20. vwalan

    vwalan Funster

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    thanks dazzer use full figures only you forgot the gvw, i can only work out the unladen wgt. it seems you can pull a 4ton trailer with an empty truck. it has lots of grunt thats for sure . my canter is 4litre ,140bhp turbo intercooled , 6300kg gvw , train wgt 10600kg, down rated to 8250kg. pulls a 5000kg trailer but down rated to 3500as a living van . 7 seater double cab . 20ft trailer, 30ft overall.its only 2ft longer than my mazda bongo n 10ft folding caravan . but people say its big. thanks again keep on trucking :thumb:.
     

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