12v Leisure Problem (1 Viewer)

[Mark33]

And if there are any ghosts in the system you will have almost the kit necessary to exorcise them.

 

[cornish boy]

meant to have asked, when you checked the battery charge, did you put the meter probes on the battery terminals or on the cable clamps?
Worth checking the reading from the clamps as that gives an indication of the connection between the clamp and the terminal.

 

[Mark33]

12v relays tend to click when they don't get enough power to maintain the latch.

Out of interest, does your control panel when illuminated show battery charge? If so, what does it show without any 12v items switched on?

Its shows battery charge of both leisure and main batteries with 4 lights each (4 means fully charged and 1 red means almost empty).
Leisure battery = 3 lights
Main battery = 2 lights (I used the radio today while trying to fix the problem)

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[Mark33]

meant to have asked, when you checked the battery charge, did you put the meter probes on the battery terminals or on the cable clamps?
Worth checking the reading from the clamps as that gives an indication of the connection between the clamp and the terminal.

I even went onto the copper of the cable...all same readings

 

[cornish boy]

it is possible that your on-board charger is a smart charger and is trying to charge the starter battery before addressing the leisure battery which is why the charge reading is lower than expected.

Just so I understand.

When the EHU is connected and the battery charger is working, the habitation 12v systems works as designed.

Remove the EHU and you can illuminate the habitation panel but as soon as you turn on either a light, water pump or fridge it goes dead. What happens if you then turn off the item and try and switch the panel back on?

 

[Mark33]

Remove the EHU and you can illuminate the habitation panel but as soon as you turn on either a light, water pump or fridge it goes dead. What happens if you then turn off the item and try and switch the panel back on?

If a energise the panel, it lights up. When I switch on a light it trips out. If I try to reset the panel its wont as the light button is still pressed. I must turn off the light then the panel will reset. Same for pump or fridge.
Sorry, I seem to be building taller walls for you to climb here!!!

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[cornish boy]

To be honest I am back at the fact the battery isn't charged enough.

The one you have installed may have voltage at rest but could die under any load, if it was the one that was flattened by leaving the light on, then you should just weigh it in for scrap!

If your new battery is taking 13.7v from the charger in your house then it is in need of a good charging. I am afraid you will need to patient and wait till it is charged and then sling in back in and see what happens.

If you took it to a dealer, the first thing they would want to do is put a fully charged battery on it before doing anything else.

Fingers crossed that tomorrow sees an end to your problems.

 

[Mark33]

Fingers crossed that tomorrow sees an end to your problems.

Thanks for all the advice folks, its appreciated. Battery charging at home now, will pop it back in tomorrow and take it from there.

 

[tonyidle]

To be honest I am back at the fact the battery isn't charged enough.

The one you have installed may have voltage at rest but could die under any load, if it was the one that was flattened by leaving the light on, then you should just weigh it in for scrap!

If your new battery is taking 13.7v from the charger in your house then it is in need of a good charging. I am afraid you will need to patient and wait till it is charged and then sling in back in and see what happens.

If you took it to a dealer, the first thing they would want to do is put a fully charged battery on it before doing anything else.

Fingers crossed that tomorrow sees an end to your problems.

The simple check to eliminate battery problems is to leave your meter attached directly to the leisure battery terminals, reset the panel, then turn on a light whilst observing the meter. The battery should continue to read the same, or near enough, whether the light is turned on or off. If it does you have a poor connection - somewhere! If it doesn't, and drops rapidly as the light is turned on, you have a battery problem.

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[Minxy]

Thanks for all the advice folks, its appreciated. Battery charging at home now, will pop it back in tomorrow and take it from there.

Leave it charging as long as you can so you get a reasonable amount of charge in. It might also be worth seeing if you can charge up your old one as a back-up just in case.

 

[Mark33]

We like a challenge.

So with your charger that says 75% what happens if you turn lights on with this charging, monitor the voltage. You should see 14V+ on charge.

Brian, I rigged up a different charger (Not normal EHU) and connected it to the in-service leisure battery.....it read 13.6v whist charging. Again I powered up habitation controller with charger still connected, but it tripped out as soon as I switched anything on. Same as before.

 

[Mark33]

The simple check to eliminate battery problems is to leave your meter attached directly to the leisure battery terminals, reset the panel, then turn on a light whilst observing the meter. The battery should continue to read the same, or near enough, whether the light is turned on or off. If it does you have a poor connection - somewhere! If it doesn't, and drops rapidly as the light is turned on, you have a battery problem.

Just tried this with old battery. It read 12.90 volts with panel lit up. Once I switched on light it stayed on for a couple of seconds then tripped out. the whole time the voltage stayed the same. Repeated a few times and voltage did not change too much.

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[cornish boy]

The simple check to eliminate battery problems is to leave your meter attached directly to the leisure battery terminals, reset the panel, then turn on a light whilst observing the meter. The battery should continue to read the same, or near enough, whether the light is turned on or off. If it does you have a poor connection - somewhere! If it doesn't, and drops rapidly as the light is turned on, you have a battery problem.

edited as the OP has replied

 

[cornish boy]

Just tried this with old battery. It read 12.90 volts with panel lit up. Once I switched on light it stayed on for a couple of seconds then tripped out. the whole time the voltage stayed the same. Repeated a few times and voltage did not change too much.

with the ehu connected and the battery on charge?

 

[cornish boy]

I own a Ci Carioca 746 and its been running great until last week. I accidentally left internal light on and drained the leisure battery. Now it will not work off leisure battery. I recharged it and still my 12v system will not work in habitation area.
If the 230v supply is plugged in, the 12v habitation system works.
If the ignition is running, the 12v habitation system works.
But if I try to run on 12v leisure battery, the control panel illuminates but when I try a light/pump/tv the control panel dies. A relay sounds in the 12v fuse box and everything 12v shuts down.
Yesterday I bought a new 110Ah battery....same problem.
I really would appreciate any help as I cannot get a dealer to even look at it for next 4 weeks!
Mark

Brian, I rigged up a different charger (Not normal EHU) and connected it to the in-service leisure battery.....it read 13.6v whist charging. Again I powered up habitation controller with charger still connected, but it tripped out as soon as I switched anything on. Same as before.

now I am confused..

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[mitzimad]

if the starter battery is working use that with jumpleads to the leisure batery if it works you have a duff or uncharged battery if it doesnt then its wiring or board fault
personally i would be looking at a bad connection near the battery as thats the area thats been tampered with since last time it worked
if you can see the input connections on your electro block or what ever you have ,you could feed power in there to cut out some of the wiring but i would incorperate a fuse if doing that

 

[peterc10]

I think there may be something wrong with your control panel. It seems that the voltage is being misread and/or the low voltage trip is not working correctly

 

[PhilandMena]

There should be a fuse very close to the battery. If it has blown your battery status will not change but no power will be delivered beyond the fuse. This may explain why the fuses you have found and checked are OK yet you have no power for your services. It will be a dedicated fuse somewhere around 20-30 Amps.

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[Mark33]

now I am confused..

There should be a fuse very close to the battery. If it has blown your battery status will not change but no power will be delivered beyond the fuse. This may explain why the fuses you have found and checked are OK yet you have no power for your services. It will be a dedicated fuse somewhere around 20-30 Amps.

the battery leads leave the battery and go under floor. There is no fuse on this section. I imagine they run to fuse box and again I see no fuses here. They connect to a pcb board via plug in connector to the pcb. Does this sound normal?

 

[Mark33]

I think there may be something wrong with your control panel. It seems that the voltage is being misread and/or the low voltage trip is not working correctly

This panel works perfect when on EHU or when engine is running. Could it still be faulty under battery?

 

[mitzimad]

This panel works perfect when on EHU or when engine is running. Could it still be faulty under battery?

this definitely points to power not getting from the battery or the battery is duff as all your changing is the source of power

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[cornish boy]

how is the charging of the new battery coming along?

 

[Mark33]

how is the charging of the new battery coming along?

Yes, I looked this morning at 8am it's still charging since last night. 13.4v now reading on charger. State is 3 of 4 bars. So a bit to go yet.

 

[PhilandMena]

the battery leads leave the battery and go under floor. There is no fuse on this section. I imagine they run to fuse box and again I see no fuses here. They connect to a pcb board via plug in connector to the pcb. Does this sound normal?

Unfortunately, I am not familiar with your model of motorhome or it's age. However, I would be surprised if there were no fuse on the positive cable and within 1 metre of the battery terminal. On my motorhome (Autotrail|) it's about 9 inches away and in my experience a very common practice as it is safety related and may even be driven by some form of regulation/Code of practice.

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[cornish boy]

Yes, I looked this morning at 8am it's still charging since last night. 13.4v now reading on charger. State is 3 of 4 bars. So a bit to go yet.

That sounds like the battery was flat, my gut feeling is when you fit the fully charged battery in the Motorhome this evening everything will work as normal (I hope!).

 

[Camping Gaza]

Bet when you have finished charging that battery it all works!

Now I am in the dark here as I dont know what your setup is, ie panel and where things are located but just on the off chance this is what I would try:

You need a multimeter set to the correct voltage range DC

My bet is you have resistance somewhere from the battery terminals to the panel causing your low voltage trip. make sure your battrey connections are tight, take a voltage reading across the battery, then find where the battery goes to the panel, take a reading. should be same

If not its your battery connectors: They can still read ok even if the connectors are causing a poor connection because you are not pulling a lot of amps through them, but if you get a slightly lower reading its possible. I would clean them up and make sure they are really tight anyhow

Check that relay, if you have access to it, and take a reading across the main connections when energised ie your panel is on (not the coil)
Should be the same right? if not its bad contacts in the relay. Clean if not sealed or replace.

That's all I can think of right now.

Good Luck

 

[hilldweller]

It might help us make better guesses if you post some decent pictures of the battery connections, the panel and that control board.

It's an interesting one for sure and must end it "why did it take us so long ?".

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[Mark33]

It might help us make better guesses if you post some decent pictures of the battery connections, the panel and that control board.

It's an interesting one for sure and must end it "why did it take us so long ?".

OK this is my battery connection with cables and vent going straight through the floor.
Controller on with no lights or pump running, just showing condition of 2 batteries (leisure & cab).
Once I press pump button all lights come on briefly then all dies.
Finally my 12v fuse box as its always been (cables enter from underneath)

 

[hilldweller]

OK this is my battery connection

The battery connection breaks the golden rule, put the main fuse as close to the B+ as possible to protect the cable from shorts.

But apart from that "never seen nuffin like it" looks like the bastard offspring when a gameboy got randy in the controller factory. Lets hope someone else spots the controller type.

To sum up, the battery keeps an acceptable voltage measured at the connection ( Yes ? ) but the system shuts down when load applied. So wherever the voltage is being measured, dips low enough for the under volts trip to fire.

Time to lift that controller box and look for rat damage, bad joint or the like. If it's in the box you need help, big time.

 

[magicsurfbus]

For what it's worth, I'm not sure that I follow all the battery-related intricacies, but our last MH was a 2005 Carioca 656 with a control panel identical to yours and a very similar looking fuse board (pic 4) behind the driver's seat. I believe others may be calling it the controller box - there are many names.

We had an ongoing issue with the fridge not working on 12v when driving, whilst everything else was fine (including battery voltage). At least 3 different engineers looked at it, and in the end our mobile fitter suggested it might be the fuse board that was at fault. Bad news if it is because they have to be replaced rather than repaired and they're made abroad, but if everything else is working as it should, it's a possibility you'll have to consider. When we replaced the fuse board the problem went away, as did a fair bit of our cash.

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