Van won't start, suggestions? (1 Viewer)

[Gromett]

It turns over at full speed (new battery fully charged).
Fuel pump is going ok.

It does take a long time to start in the winter and monday it took a lot longer than usual. Today no amount of turning got it to start.

Any suggestions as to what can cause this?

 

[Trikeman]

Has you MoHo got heater plugs Gromett? Are they working?

One of the most common issues with diesels not starting first click on a crisp winters morn.

Regards,

Trikeman.

 

[Gromett]

Just wondering that myself. Is there any way to test if they are working or not?

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[Trikeman]

Firstly, you should have a warning light on your dash (usually orange curly type) when you turn on the ignition it should come on for a few seconds and then go out - when it goes out it is then ready to crank, the light going out is the signal that all's well and the heater plugs have heated up correctly and ready for go.
That's the way ours is.

I'd check that first - if this doesn't work then the testing should start.

Regards,

Trikeman.

 

[Gromett]

The light comes on and goes out pretty quick. a second or less.

 

[simsy56]

Heater plugs would be my guess.

Craig

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[Gromett]

All the garages are closed until the new year. I have no idea where to get any and how to fit them myself and I was supposed to be going away for new years eve.

Damnit :shout::Angry:

 

[hilldweller]

The light comes on and goes out pretty quick. a second or less.

Geo once pointed out that the light on some van lies to you, ours does.

Switch on and listen, light goes out but 10/15 secs later you hear a relay drop.

You should be able to clip a meter onto the heater plugs.

A while ago someone posted a picture "what is this" and it was the heater controller on top of the battery and looking a bit sad.

 

[Trikeman]

Well that's sort of indicating they are working, a second is short but it seems to be going through the motions. Another (if the plugs are working correctly) is potential water in the filter housing freezing and transferring to the 'near' fuel making it waxy. Can you face the van into the sun with the bonnet up? Sometime this will get things up and running but wont cure the latter if that's the problem.
Depending on the vehicle type, the fuel cut off switch/solenoid (what switches the engine off by stopping the fuel supply when you turn off the ignition) can suffer during cold if there's the slightest water in the fuel line. Sometimes a light,,,,,, and I mean light, tap on the fuel stop solenoid can allow fuel to be supplied for starting.

Sorry Grommet, there can be several reasons and it will be a step by step process but the above I have seen being the most common, before you get into pumps, belts etc.

Trikeman.

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[pappajohn]

The light comes on and goes out pretty quick. a second or less.

that sounds like faulty plug/s or relay to me.

to check voltage at plugs simply put a volt meter to earth and onto the plug terminal and turn on ignition...there should be 12v straight away.

it takes a while to get the tip of the plug to glow white hot

most reliable method of testing is removal and bench test.

remove plugs
hold plug body in one jump lead and place the other jump lead on the end terminal the connect to a charged battery.
jump leads save messing about with bits of wire.

maybe take 10 to 15 seconds to glow white and will remain too hot to touch for quite some time.

 

[Gromett]

Thanks trikeman.

I don't think it is fuel pump or anything like that as it did start monday after a lot of turning. It almost started today before going back to being dead...

I will see if i can find the air filter and see what condition that is in. I have no idea where the fuel solonoid is..

I am currently waiting for the batteries to recharge. I really hammered them trying to start it so I have put them on charge again.

Once it gets back up to 14v for an hour I will try again but will leave the ignition on for 10 seconds or so before trying to turn it over just in case the coil light is lying.

A friend of mine mentioned a spray which you can fire into the air filter.. Does anyone know anything about this? Is it worth trying?

 

[laneside]

Grommet if you are desperate to get away try and get hold of a can of Easystart from a local garage and put a tiny squirt up the air cleaner and turn engine straight away.

Use only in an emergency until you get the problem solved .

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[buyer]

What make ,model and year is the base vehicle and milage:thumb:

 

[pappajohn]

as a last resort to get you on your trip.....ether.

spray some easi-start into the air filter while cranking.

easi-start is far more volitile than diesel and will ignite without the help of glow plugs.
may take a couple of seconds to get running properly.

 

[Gromett]

I now just need to find a place that sells easy start oh:

I am about a mile from town and the garages are all on the edges so lots and lots of walking :Sad:

Thanks guys.

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[Gromett]

I am on my own so can't spray and turn the engine over at the same time. Does that rule out the use of Easy Start?

 

[buyer]

You should be able to do it on your own ,but not as easy ,what is the base vehicle ?

 

[pappajohn]

I am on my own so can't spray and turn the engine over at the same time. Does that rule out the use of Easy Start?

no, but it may take a few attempts to keep it running.
if you were at the front you could keep giving it a spray every couple of seconds til it picked up.
spray into the filter box then quickly get to the key.

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[Trikeman]

no, but it may take a few attempts to keep it running.
if you were at the front you could keep giving it a spray every couple of seconds til it picked up.
spray into the filter box then quickly get to the key.

Ditto!

On the older vehicles I used to work on the ether can was on the chassis and you had a pull cord in the cab, crank, pull and yeehaa...... they stopped them though - remember them Pappajohn?

I do hope you get it going.

Trikeman.

 

[phil1946]

According to the internet, and I have seen mentioned on another site, you can use WD40 sprayed into the intake (or air cleaner). Not quite so efficient but supposed to do less damage to the engine and you MIGHT have a can handy rather than having to walk to get Easistart.

 

[Gromett]

I have looked under the bonnet.

Am I correct in thinking that the air filter is the talk round box at the right hand side. With a big pipe that appears to come from the radiator?

Fiat Ducato 53 reg

PS: Never mind found it on google

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[tofo]

I have looked under the bonnet.

Am I correct in thinking that the air filter is the talk round box at the right hand side. With a big pipe that appears to come from the radiator?

Fiat Ducato 53 reg

PS: Never mind found it on google

have you tried turning ignition on
let the heater light go out
then turn off ignition on and repeat a few times
may just warm the glow coil and cylinder up a little bit before you crank the engine

:thumb::thumb::thumb:

 

[petensal]

You could try warming the fuel filter and any accessible fuel lines before cranking, may help

 

[Wildbill]

with essay start it will fire don't use throttle or you could wreck the engine just let it start with no throttle
one second spray in to engine intake

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[tonyidle]

You can find out whether the problem is heater plugs or the heater plug control / relay and make use of the van until you can get it fixed as follows:

Find the heater plugs. The top of each one will be joined to its neighbours by a metal strip or very thick wire. Clip one end of your jump lead to the top of any convenient heater plug. Make sure it doesn't touch anything other than what it is clipped to. Connect the other end of the jump lead to battery +ve for around 10 to 15 seconds, then disconnect it and start the engine.

If it starts OK using this method then the heater plugs are OK, you can continue to use the van, and my next suspect would be the starter plug control module / relay.

Heater plugs don't fail in fours. If one fails the van starts but is smoky & rough for a few seconds after starting. If two fail it's more of the same with slight reluctance to start in cold weather. If three fail it will not start in cold weather and will be reluctant in warm weather. There is normally plenty of warning that they need to be changed before total failure.

 

[icantremember]

I am no expert on the subject of Easystart but I understood that it should never be used if engine has heater plugs.

 

[Larby]

No easy start? Lynx deodorant or similar:thumb:

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[TheBig1]

have carried and used easy start for years on numerous vehicles and never had an issue. its a quick fix but certainly shouldnt be considered a long term one

from your description, the glow plugs have been failing for a while so harder to start in winter. the complete refusal to fire indicates that the diesel is not getting hot and thin enough to compress. as its not subzero temperatures i would doubt its waxing, but could be water in the fuel filter contributing to your problem

if you do try to bypass the relay for 10 seconds with a jump lead from the battery, be very very carefull as touching anything else other than the glowplug connector will cause major arcing and burns. from your description though this method wont help much if the plugs are burnt out/caked up.

 

[Gromett]

Thanks so much everyone.... I have got it started.

I had the battery on charge to top it up.
I then tried as had been suggested here and on fb.
I turned the ignition on and left it for 6 seconds. I repeated this 3 times before attempting to start it.

It started in about 3 seconds but quickly stalled out.

I tried again but absolutely nothing.

I then repeated it but did 8 seconds and it started this time.

I think it is possibly one glow plug has failed???

For the amount they cost I will replace all 4 in the new year as well as getting new fuel and air filters as they must be due by nowoh:

Thanks again everyone for the very helpful suggestions and no wisecracks...

looks like I can have my new year away as planned :thumb:

 

[Gromett]

Damnit just got back into the habitation area after going to McDonalds.

I forgot to take the coffee cup off my table. I now have a soaking wet bed and a potentially soaked battery charger. My mind was totally elsewhere. I must be getting old:Angry:

I am currently in the process of stripping the battery charger down to clean and dry oh:

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