Eberspacher Heater opinions sought and fitting advice (2 Viewers)

haganap

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I am currently in the process of trying to convince Nikki that we [STRIKE]need[/STRIKE] [STRIKE]want [/STRIKE] [STRIKE]must have[/STRIKE] one of these to remain married.

Any how, I think its a battle that I can win as they can save money :whistle: and will be very useful for our winter holidays.

I have had a look at the fitting advice and think I could probably handle most of it my self. Im not keen on T piecing in to the van fuel line so may just nip it up to my friendly garage to do that last bit having done all the other work myself.

A couple of questions though. I think I would like to pipe it in to the already existing ducting as that travels nicely around the van. However, I will probably offer it a new ducting in to the cab area of the van as this gets really cold in the winter and in fact almost unuseable area of the van when we are skiing.

Is it ok to pipe it in to the existing pipe work? I am sure Im not missing anything? im sure a couple of T pieces added would be fine.

Does anyone know the fuel consumption of one of these units? and the power drain from the batteries for the fan?


If any one has or knows of one for sale, I would be happy to receive a PM from you. :thumb:


I would really like to here the thoughts of those that own one as well please. Especially in terms of noise.

Many thanks

Haggers
aged 44 and a day
 

aba

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hi paul the best way to connect fuel to one of these heaters is with a separate tank as you can run them on red diesel / gasoil which is a lot cheaper than using your road fuel.

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haganap

haganap

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hi paul the best way to connect fuel to one of these heaters is with a separate tank as you can run them on red diesel / gasoil which is a lot cheaper than using your road fuel.

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Thanks aba,

Never really thought of doing it that way as that would mean carrying spare diesel around presumably in a jerry can, which I do for the Genny so not that fussed.

But what would the running time be? how long would it run for on 10L of fuel?

thinking about it, its certainly not the best way I dont think, just another way.... for £55 im sure my local garage would stick me in a t piece, and I have no idea where to get red diesel from.

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Forestboy

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Keep us informed mate as I'm thinking along the same lines, I would also add a pipe into the engine bay for the skiing trips.
I've been doing some research on these and would probably go with Webasto seems to get better reviews than Erberspacher. Biggest problem I forsee is battery life I reckon 3 deep cycle is the answer don't think my 2 standard leisure would handle it. In fact thats 1leisure now as I ruined one recently now wont hold a charge.
 

gozomike

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Hi

Have you looked at http://www.eberspacher.com/products/air-heating/
With mine I recon it uses about a litre in 3 to 4 hours. I have a battery monitor fitted and notice it using around 9amps on start up and also for a short while on shut down. It is using less than an amp when running. Mine is a small van and it does seem very effective.

Mike
 

Snowbird

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Hi Paul, As you know we have one in the RMB and its great. On the lowest setting the van is kept at 20 deg plus. They are a little noisy outside by the exhaust but inside its quiet. Its not piped into the gas piping and just has one blower duct in the lounge which is more than adequate. Its wired into the engine battery for some reason, and I must admit this was a worry at first, but having left it running overnight at home it used 6amps in a 10 hr period, so no worries there. If the battery drops below a set level it will not fire up, so you are always able to start the engine. Once the initial start up has happened it uses very little 12 volt power. The running costs are vertualy zero compared with running gas all night, more so for me as mine runs happily on bio diesel from the main fuel tank. If I was fitting one as an after market job I would consider fitting a small dedicated fuel tank and running it on red diesel, then it would cost next to nothing to run. You will wonder how you managed without one once fitted. There are several on ebay and there is a guy at Middlewich boats which is close by who is a trained fitter and does a service cheaply. There is not much really to go wrong with them and youtube has several good videos showing how to fit and service them. IMO if you are winter using your van as you do, they are a must have.

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aba

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just had another thought on this...

if you have a common rail diesel you wont be able to just tee in to the fuel pipe because of the lift pump in the tank for 2 reasons 1. it may not allow the passage of fuel when engine off
and 2. when the engine is running it may overpressure the eberspacher fuel pump.

so if you are going down the route of using your road fuel you will need to remove the vans fuel tank and fit one of these. Link Removed

as for the noise the exhaust is the noisiest bit but you can get a silencer for them Link Removed
 
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mate...dont you think it would be easier getting a proper van or could you not just run the hairdryer off the soon to be installed inverter?:getmecoat:

now for the serious bit. I had a problem with one of the blown air outlets, its on a long run and the air gets cold by the time it comes out.

So after doing some searching etc found that it was mainly down to the output of the heater - which is quite a good piece of kit but it seems the vents need to be balanced. our heater has 4 main outlets that all the pipe work is connected to. To make them all work equally i have to go around and mess about with the vents to get the balance right

So, by adding in another vent may cause you a problem with too many outlets off one run and they will lower the pressure to the rest...and reduce the overall effectiveness of the system so beware you might get a good kickin from the boss if it gets worse after shelling out loads a wonga::bigsmile:
 

Popeye

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Hi Paul (happy belated birthday) these units (2 and 3 outlet) are regularly for sale in the boating world as they are without doubt the most common heating units in the marine world.

They run off the engine fuel supply because of course the boat fills its tank with red diesel.

You could as already suggested run it off a separate tank if that is convenient.

They are slightly more noisy than a Trauma running at full chat, but of course they do chuck out a considerable amount of heat.

The difference between the various manufacturer doesn't vary much in electrical power usage so be sure to check out Webasto as well as Eberspacher.

My Pal purchased his first unit (2 outlet) at Beaulieu Boat Jumble for £200 and it is still working today 16 years later.

You can also get them to heat water these days, very good units. :thumb:

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aba

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best place to fit it would be centre of the van or as close as possible to the middle then pipe equal lengths of ducting to the front and rear.
simple and balanced.
 

Popeye

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Have read all three of Aba's posts and they all make a lot of sense, especially the common rail diesel one. The working pressure is far too great to Tee in to.
 

jonandshell

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Hi Paul

In VT last year over the 6 days, our Webasto burned about 15 litres. That was for heating AND water.

The temperature in the van was a constant 20 degrees C.

With reference to the red diesel suggestion, if you want to become an expert at burner insert changes, then go ahead!

It is well known that Webasto and Eberspacher will reject warranty claims on units run on red due to the increased fouling.:whatthe:

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Wildman

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A seperate tank is definately the way to go, forget red diesel they will run on central heating fuel even cheaper and no chance of running your main tank dry. . Smudger has a couple fitted in his conglomeration giganticus. An outboard motor fuel tank in a locker did the job for him and they kept us as warm as toast in the snow when we went to Portugal a couple of years back. I can't remember the fuel consumption except to say we were surprised how little it used. no problem using the existing ducting and adding a few extra outlets. Smudger had his fitted under his driving seat. I don't think he bothered with blown air ducting the output is so great there was no need. I found it quiet though others who are not deaf like me might find otherwise. The system is far superior in output to a gas fired jobbie. given the amount of time you spend in the snow I think that should be upgraded to a Must have. They are not cheap though. fitting yourself is a possibility but I would advise against it as insurance companies would run rings around you if it ever caused a fire. Heat and fibreglass don't mix well.
 
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haganap

haganap

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thanks so far.

I have sort of located one, and Nikki is getting keen on the idea, told her she could dry her hair with one :winky:

Thinking about it, I think the best method may be using the external tank and fitting that somewhere especially if problems are caused to the normal van running.

so much to think about on that.

The place to fit is almost in the middle of the van, under the front seats, that way I can pipe to the cab and then to the bathroom. It doesn't really need to go any further than that.

If I never had to T piece in to the fuel line of the van then I could probably fit it all my self. :thumb:
 

Snowbird

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Am also told the early model D1 is more forgiving to alternative fuels and less problematic.

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aba

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good point on the hair drying use all you need is a T in the outlet pipe and a bit of vacuum cleaner hose and bingo 1 hairdrier.
 

jonandshell

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Just remember to make sure your new heater doesn't draw fuel from the bottom of you fuel tank!
When your heater stops it will be nice to have some diesel left to get to the fuel station!!:thumb:
 

Snowbird

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As Roger suggested a 20/25 litre outboard engine plastic tank would be ideal. It has the fittings already there and is cheap to buy. Should last you on a ski trip and is lightweight.

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jonandshell

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As Roger suggested a 20/25 litre outboard engine plastic tank would be ideal. It has the fittings already there and is cheap to buy. Should last you on a ski trip and is lightweight.

But it will get you banned from travelling on the tunnel!
 

Snowbird

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But it will get you banned from travelling on the tunnel!
Why ???. If its bolted down and secure why would they ban you from the tunnel. I have a 110 litre tank as an extra and am not banned from anywhere.
 

CURLYCORNFLAKE

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I helped to fit an Eberspacher D2 to a friends boat in January this year. It was to replace an old one but fitted in a different place.It took 2 of us 1/2 day to fit.He paid about £700 for the kit which comes with a digital controller.It was fitted at the rear of the boat so the middle cabin is nice and warm but the forward cabin less so. So the duct lengths are critical as it is only a 12volt 100mm diameter fan driving the warm air through convoluted ducting which has higher resistance.We teed into his fuel line as his tank gravity feeds his engine so no issues with that. The difference between his boat and our motorhome is his cabins are smaller but he has less insulation so probably equals same rating.The new one fired up after bleeding itself and purghing and ran fine.He achieves a temperature difference of about 17/18 degrees after about 3 hours running.It has a highish startup current approx 20 amps but runs at less than 1 amp normally (10 watts).He has run his on red diesel all year which he buys from a farmer in 45 litre drum.I can't remember his fuel running costs but a figure of 4/5 litres a day comes to mind.He replace it because his old one was unreliable ,he sent it away for overall and strip down twice.The new one shows exactly what is happening to it current used etc and shuts down if below a certain voltage from the battery.He has 3 leisure batteries.He sold his old one on flebay for £200.Hope this helps.

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Mar 26, 2009
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Paul do you have a copy of the D2/D4 manuals (in PDF form) which include a section on installation? PM me with an email address if you require a copy.

I may also have a plastic outboard tank available. I will have to check the size.

Just checked - its 11 ltr.
 
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Popeye

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Red diesel fuel is only slightly different chemically from regular automotive diesel fuel, but there can be a significant difference in cost. The cheaper red diesel fuel could conceivably work in place of the more expensive automotive diesel fuel, but that would defeat the purpose of a fuel tax. In order to ensure that home heating oil, which is minimally taxed, is not used as diesel fuel, which can be heavily taxed, revenue agents require home heating oil to receive a special red dye. This liquid red dye can be detected in even the smallest samples taken for examination.

They are to all intents and purposes the same and as such the heater manufacturers are quite used to seeing red diesel in their products. All marinas on the south coast that supply diesel ONLY supply red diesel, so there is No-Way of avoiding red and there is no difference in the burn to white diesel.

As they fit more heaters to boats than motor homes they will be quite used to it.
 
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haganap

haganap

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Im Reading it now Phil :roflmto:

Here's me plan any way,

Im going to do a 50/50 split. I am going to fit the unit in to my van, do all the cutting and drilling etc my self and wire it all up. Im then going to do all the ducting work myself as well.

Then,

I am taking it to my local garage to have my fuel tank removed and a Fuel Stand Pick up pipe fitted.
I know it will be dearer done this way but this to me seems to be the safest way. I don't have the engineering facility available to me to get right underneath the van and fit a plastic fuel tank.
Im waiting for the garage to come back with a price.

forgot to say thank's to Aba, would of probably just Teed it otherwise

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haganap

haganap

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Scrap my last post :Eeek:

garage just said that tank's today are not easy to get at and some are moulded around chassis etc. Said the easiest thing for him to do would be to fit me a seperate tank with a neck filler. He will fit it under the van and I will fill it up with diesel via a seperate filler. :thumb:
 

Forestboy

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Hi Paul
Are you thinking of replacing the gas system or are you just adding to it for those seriously cold situations like VT last year and are you thinking of just a heater or heater and hot water.
I'm thinking just heating as the gas works fine most of the time and I just want to be able to use diesel when its really cold like VT. This would also mean the gas lasts longer and none of those long journeys back down the mountain to find gas, not that I had to but plenty did. Its quite costly but if like you & I you use the van all year especially in the mountains in winter probably worthwhile.
 
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haganap

haganap

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Hi Paul
Are you thinking of replacing the gas system or are you just adding to it for those seriously cold situations like VT last year and are you thinking of just a heater or heater and hot water.
I'm thinking just heating as the gas works fine most of the time and I just want to be able to use diesel when its really cold like VT. This would also mean the gas lasts longer and none of those long journeys back down the mountain to find gas, not that I had to but plenty did. Its quite costly but if like you & I you use the van all year especially in the mountains in winter probably worthwhile.

No Rory, I aim to use it as a add on to the gas system. I basically want it to do two things.

1) heat the cab area and the front of the van that can not be reached by the current system.
2) use less gas, so the option is simple, fill it up before I go up the mountain, take a jerry can with 10 litres in and then its ready to go.

Ive decided again having spoken to my mechanic to fit it myself. In the bessie I have two additonal spaces where I could fit the tank which are underneath the floor where the batteries used to live before I moved them or another compartment under the bed which is where we store wet gear. Its about the size of two big batteries so Im going to put my fuel tank in there.
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then run the fuel pipe under the van to the unit itself. :thumb:

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jonandshell

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Hi Paul

Just for you, I have had a crawl under our Transit to see where the Webasto is plumbed into!

After getting oily, dirty, wet and miserable, I can now report that.......

I COULDN'T SEE ANYTHING!!!!!!!!!!

It appears, the tank was dropped down off its mounts to connect the Webasto diesel supply!

So I had a look on the net and look what I found!

Broken Link Removed

QED!:thumb:

You might have to drop your tank though!

This extra tank idea sounds very silly.............................
The whole Chausson range has diesel heaters, have you got a dealer nearby with a Fiat chassis which you can, errr, check the 'winterisation' on?:roflmto:
 
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haganap

haganap

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Hi Paul

Just for you, I have had a crawl under our Transit to see where the Webasto is plumbed into!

After getting oily, dirty, wet and miserable, I can now report that.......

I COULDN'T SEE ANYTHING!!!!!!!!!!

It appears, the tank was dropped down off its mounts to connect the Webasto diesel supply!

So I had a look on the net and look what I found!

Broken Link Removed

QED!:thumb:

You might have to drop your tank though!

This extra tank idea sounds very silly.............................
The whole Chausson range has diesel heaters, have you got a dealer nearby with a Fiat chassis which you can, errr, check the 'winterisation' on?:roflmto:


yeah, agreed that the extra tank idea does seem a bit silly. I can actually get my mechanic to drop the tank and fit this idea. However, even he said it aint a simple job, What I might do is run it down for him to have a look at. I think it will be quite an easy job doing the instalation other than the fuel idea that's giving me a headache.

Think Im going to offer up only 3 additional heater outlets, one in to the cab, one in to the van and 1 in to the bathroom. So should be toastie warm.

just need to find one now...:thumb:
 

keith

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Paul, our van came with a diesel heater from new, although I hadn't a clue what it was.
Since then I have become their No 1 fan and would not be without it.
It is teed of the main tank and like you I found the cab cold, so cut another vent into the forward facing bulkhead so it blows into the cab. A simple job that has made a huge difference not only when stopped but while we travel.
It used virtually no fuel and as said it is very good on electric once it's over the startup.
I like it because it warms the whole of the van from it's position in the centre so when it's freezing outside even when at home I have it running.
I like the idea of using as a hair dryer (or Jean does) just have to find a length of hose now.

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