The new iMac.. Have Apple shot themselves in the foot ? (1 Viewer)

scotjimland

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A few weeks ago I was considering buying a new iMac, (not on sale yet, supposed to be released this month) but when I looked at the specs discovered it no longer has an optical drive..
Frankly, I think Apple have shot themselves in the foot.. this a classic example of style over function..

I wonder how many will buy one without realising that if you want to burn a movie made with Apple software you will need to buy an external drive ... :Doh:

Consequently I dropped the idea and have ordered a desk top PC from PC Specialists.. For about the same money I will have a far better spec computer with a 180GB SSD and 2TB Western digital HDD , Quad core i7 processor with 16GB Ram.. and ohh yes.. a 24 x Dual DVD writer .. complete with a 22" Monitor ..

Sorry Apple.. you must try harder .. I do like your products.. but ... that's too little for too much ..
 
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brynric

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I think Apple see this as the way forward. Physical media becomes much less important than the cloud. Films made on Macs can be transfered between devices. But you're right, much of the rest of the world is still using "traditional" technology. My dad still plays cassettes and prints out photographs.
Why won't the older generation listen?:RollEyes:
 

GJH

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(snip)
Consequently I dropped the idea and have ordered a desk top PC from PC Specialists.. For about the same money I will have a far better spec computer with a 180GB SSD and 2TB Western digital HDD , Quad core i7 processor with 16GB Ram.. and ohh yes.. a 24 x Dual DVD writer .. complete with a 22" Monitor .. (snip)

Welcome to the real world Jim ::bigsmile:

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scotjimland

scotjimland

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I think Apple see this as the way forward. Physical media becomes much less important than the cloud. Films made on Macs can be transfered between devices. But you're right, much of the rest of the world is still using "traditional" technology. My dad still plays cassettes and prints out photographs.
Why won't the older generation listen?:RollEyes:

I appreciate what you say.. but apart from burning home movies, music, pictures etc .. you also use DVD for backing up, installing new software etc .

.. yes, i know that can be done in 'the cloud'.. but personally I and many old fartes prefer hard copies for valuable data .. not in some cloud that may be gone tomorrow ..

I may be old enough to be your dad.. but don't dad's always know best .. ? :roflmto:
 
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Hi Jim,

As an Apple user I am (slightly) inclined to agree with you. However since owning my Macbook Air for just over a year I have found very little need for disc drive and if I do then I just use the 'remote' access to my old Sony via wifi.

In the case of Apple ownership it is not just about hardware. It is about ergonomic and anaesthetic design, and an OS that just runs rings around anything 'Microsoft' :winky:

I am certainly not an Apple 'fan boy' but I have to say that I have found the whole 'user' experience with Apple a very pleasurable one. The customer care is excellent, everything just works :Blush:, the operating system is a sheer delight (no more 'computer says no' moments) and the product quality is superb.

Just to offer an alternative view, I believe that DVD's will become a thing of the past in the very near future (says he with over 700 DVD's :Blush: LOL).

Your new computer does sound very tasty indeed and I am quite sure you will love it, but hey, don't knock Apple (too much:winky:) for creating desirable products and leading the market.

Don't shoot me, I just think I have to stand up for Apple here::bigsmile:

As always............debate and opposite views are a good thing for all:thumb:

Cheers :Smile:
 

brynric

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"I may be old enough to be your dad.. but don't dad's always know best .. ?"
Of course they do. I didn't think so at first but when my eldest asks me to fix his plumbing I realise they do.
You're quite right, DVDs have a variety of functions but nowadays there seems to be little software exclusively available on DVD. Even operating systems are downloaded. They are also limited in space, usb sticks, memory cards and hard state drives are the future ... but for how long before the next invention.

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Jim

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I've had an iMac for about 18 months and as yet I have not used the DVD drive and I doubt I ever will. It's a work only machine so I have not missed it, but if it was a home machine then maybe I would have wanted to play the odd DVD Movie.

The reality is the CD and DVD are dead they just don't know it yet. Music and software is all supplied via the cloud. and if you really need to stick something in the machine then a thumb drive is faster and 100 times more convenient than a cd or dvd.

Apple are always way ahead, in two years time no machines will these drives fitted. and why would they. DVD is even less durable than magnetic tape as a backup and has to be treated with kid gloves for the whole of its short life. while it needs to be formatted, written in sessions, closed and doesn't like fingerprints etc Its a crap medium, good riddance.
 
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My next computer doesn't have an internal optical drive. I just don't use them anymore except for ripping DVD's. For backups I use a USB 3 external hard drive. I just have too much data for DVD backups now.

I don't need to burn videos I make. I keep them in digital format as everyone I want to share them with has a computer or tablet or phone to watch them on.

I really don't have any need for a built in optical drive taking up valuable space.
I think most people are the same these days. There are of course people who still want/need optical drives but I think they are in a shrinking minority.

I remember apple had a similar outcry when they dumped floppy drives from their computers :ROFLMAO:
 
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scotjimland

scotjimland

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Thanks for all the opinions.. guess I'm just an old farte hanging onto the past..?

well.. no actually, I do like to keep up with the latest ideas and technological advances .. but for a desk top home computer I want one.. so I'm having it :moon: :roflmto:

but I liken it to motorhomes supplied with no spare wheel.. :Doh:

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scotjimland

scotjimland

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Hi Jim,

As an Apple user I am (slightly) inclined to agree with you. However since owning my Macbook Air for just over a year I have found very little need for disc drive and if I do then I just use the 'remote' access to my old Sony via wifi.

In the case of Apple ownership it is not just about hardware. It is about ergonomic and anaesthetic design, and an OS that just runs rings around anything 'Microsoft' :winky:

I am certainly not an Apple 'fan boy' but I have to say that I have found the whole 'user' experience with Apple a very pleasurable one. The customer care is excellent, everything just works :Blush:, the operating system is a sheer delight (no more 'computer says no' moments) and the product quality is superb.

Just to offer an alternative view, I believe that DVD's will become a thing of the past in the very near future (says he with over 700 DVD's :Blush: LOL).

Your new computer does sound very tasty indeed and I am quite sure you will love it, but hey, don't knock Apple (too much:winky:) for creating desirable products and leading the market.

Don't shoot me, I just think I have to stand up for Apple here::bigsmile:

As always............debate and opposite views are a good thing for all:thumb:

Cheers :Smile:

Hi

well acquainted with Macs .. had several over the years, first one around 2001 . iBooks and Powerbooks..

still have a 2004 iBook G4 PPC with a 100GB HDD and upgraded to 2GB RAM .. still plods along, but now unsupported by Apple and most third party software providers.. .. daughter prefers it to using Windows..

also have 17" Powerbook G4 cost about £2k in 2005 , but now defunct and languishing in cupboard .. screen full of lines and touch pad u/s .. I was going to repair it but the cost of parts makes it uneconomical ..:Sad:
 

GJH

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When I bought my first netbook I knew it had no optical drive and thought I wouldn't need one as I was only going to use it away from home. However, it wasn't all that long before I found a need for one and bought an external drive.

It may well be the case that CDs/DVDs won't be used much longer as distribution media but I still have several dozen genealogy/history data CDs which I refer to from time to time. The data they contain aren't available elsewhere in many cases or, if they are, it is at extra cost. I suppose I could copy them onto an external hard drive but that would be an extra cost as well and one I don't feel like paying just yet.

Having said that, I back up my files these days to networked and external hard drives rather than using CD/DVD, basically because (like Karl) I have too much data to mess about with optical media.

At the end of the day, though, computers are merely tools. If they do what you want from them they are useful and if they don't do what you want they are useless.
 
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scotjimland

scotjimland

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(snip)
It may well be the case that CDs/DVDs won't be used much longer as distribution media but I still have several dozen genealogy/history data CDs which I refer to from time to time. The data they contain aren't available elsewhere in many cases or, if they are, it is at extra cost.

Yes indeed Graham.. :thumb:
I forgot about that when I was 'making the case' for optical drives.. we also have several data discs for family research .. 1881 Census being a good example, plus a few others and one with Scottish burial records..

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Popeye

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One thing I am sure of, that is PC Specialist is the very best I've ever experienced.

You don't ever find out how good they are until you have a concern. Brilliant bit of kit, and that is from someone who also has an iPhone and an iPad.
 

Geo

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And W8 Jim?
I took the plunge W 8 on my playtime PC then 3 days in and Just done Pams Office machine.
was a bit of a clunker but it now flys, probably more to do with the clean up but still well impressed annoying at first finding things but soon overcome any probs
My machine is a topish spec jobby (im an asus fan)and a speed improvement has been noticed on multitasking, I woulds say its as near to a Mac as ever :thumb:
Geo
 

Jim

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Yes indeed Graham.. :thumb:
I forgot about that when I was 'making the case' for optical drives.. we also have several data discs for family research .. 1881 Census being a good example, plus a few others and one with Scottish burial records..

If the data is valuable then copy it to some other media ASAP. Especially if the disc has been printed, has a sticky label or has been written upon:thumb: DVDs fail, I know to my cost.

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scotjimland

scotjimland

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And W8 Jim?
I took the plunge W 8 on my playtime PC then 3 days in and Just done Pams Office machine.
was a bit of a clunker but it now flys, probably more to do with the clean up but still well impressed annoying at first finding things but soon overcome any probs
My machine is a topish spec jobby (im an asus fan)and a speed improvement has been noticed on multitasking, I woulds say its as near to a Mac as ever :thumb:
Geo

Very interesting Geo .. but
I've decided to stick with W7 for the present .. maybe look to upgrade after the first service pack is released.. from what I've read it's not a big benefit without a touch screen .. ?

Just this week downgraded two older laptops to XP Professional .. they now fly along ..
 
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scotjimland

scotjimland

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If the data is valuable then copy it to some other media ASAP. Especially if the disc has been printed, has a sticky label or has been written upon:thumb: DVDs fail, I know to my cost.

good advice Jim , already have them back-up to a hard drive .. and also made DVD copies..
 
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Yes indeed Graham.. :thumb:
I forgot about that when I was 'making the case' for optical drives.. we also have several data discs for family research .. 1881 Census being a good example, plus a few others and one with Scottish burial records..


I have a large archive of tech magazines on DVD. The first thing I did when I got them was copy them to a hard drive. Faster, more durable and easier to access.

I wouldn't trust valuable data to a DVD rom...

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scotjimland

scotjimland

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One thing I am sure of, that is PC Specialist is the very best I've ever experienced.

You don't ever find out how good they are until you have a concern. Brilliant bit of kit, and that is from someone who also has an iPhone and an iPad.

thanks, it was after you recommended them a few weeks ago that I had a look at what they offered.. . took me a while to decide, but now bit the bullet ..
 

Popeye

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thanks, it was after you recommended them a few weeks ago that I had a look at what they offered.. . took me a while to decide, but now bit the bullet ..

In that case Jim I really hope you're as pleased with the end result as I have been.

I've never owned or run the same pc for over 5years before.
:thumb:
 

GJH

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If the data is valuable then copy it to some other media ASAP. Especially if the disc has been printed, has a sticky label or has been written upon:thumb: DVDs fail, I know to my cost.

Yes, they can fail but not all that often. I burned, printed and sold thousands when we had the business. There were a few which did not burn correctly (but were spotted straight away because I checked every and we only had a couple of after sales failures - because buyers scratched them :Smile: (but it was better customer relations to replace rather than quibble).

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scotjimland

scotjimland

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In that case Jim I really hope you're as pleased with the end result as I have been.

I've never owned or run the same pc for over 5years before.
:thumb:

Thanks
I'm sure I will be.. it' a big investment so I took a bit of time deciding.

I also looked at 'off the shelf' from Dell and Novatech.. dismissed Dell mainly due to cost as I could get more 'bang for my buck' from both PCS and Novatech ..

I also considered a self build, but for several reasons, one being cost, customer backup another, .. decided against. I'll leave that to the experts..

I'll certainly report back once I have it .. estimated delivery date is 5/12 :Smile:
 

Chris

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Off topic but what I miss with the iPad is a DVD drive.

Instead I have just bought a nice slimline Sony portable DVD player -£74.

Perfect for watching my war film DVD's:thumb:

Low tech I know, but that's me::bigsmile:
 
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A few weeks ago I was considering buying a new iMac, (not on sale yet, supposed to be released this month) but when I looked at the specs discovered it no longer has an optical drive..
Frankly, I think Apple have shot themselves in the foot.. this a classic example of style over function..

I wonder how many will buy one without realising that if you want to burn a movie made with Apple software you will need to buy an external drive ... :Doh:

Consequently I dropped the idea and have ordered a desk top PC from PC Specialists.. For about the same money I will have a far better spec computer with a 180GB SSD and 2TB Western digital HDD , Quad core i7 processor with 16GB Ram.. and ohh yes.. a 24 x Dual DVD writer .. [HI]complete with a 22" Monitor .. [/HI][HI][/HI]
Sorry Apple.. you must try harder .. I do like your products.. but ... that's too little for too much ..
I'm told that a touch screen is the way to go.:Smile: In for a penny in for a pound. Windows 8 is made for a touch screen:thumb:

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scotjimland

scotjimland

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I'm told that a touch screen is the way to go.:Smile: In for a penny in for a pound. Windows 8 is made for a touch screen:thumb:

I did give it some thought buttons.. .. for about a nano second ..

Touch screen, great for tablets and phones, surfing etc ... but have no desire for it on a desktop PC , don't see any benefit. Also... very messy... I'm forever cleaning the playbook screen...
 
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bfb

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DVD drive or not DVD drive

Hi all,

I have read all the posts about the lack of DVD drives on IMAC, and incidentally as I help a Mac refurbisher local to me refurbish mac machines I know that Apple are phasing out optical drives on all their machines.
So What!
My home machine is a 2005 power mac G5. It was rated as the most powerful home computer in its day and I still use it today. Photography is my main hobby other than parachuting accuracy which takes up half of my photographs. I am often asked for copies of pictures taken and pass them on via dvds, pendrives, or bluetooth them to other machines. How do I backup? Hard drive, DVD, Flashdrive?
Answer is I use all six for critical work!
Now I know the old farts among you are reaching for the keyboard to tell me I can't count (I am an old fart too)but I do a critical backup to two devices each. All the devices mentioned have a MTTF.(Mean Time To Failure). You will just have to live with it.
Why I ask myself do people get hung up with having the latest equipment.
One of my cameras is an old Sinar Monorail 5x4 from the last century. If anybody out there wants to go head to head with any modern camera they have I will happily take them on. My Hasselblad is still very capable up to 6 foot images. But whatever the media recording is used to save the information it will never last forever. Dyes in photographs are roughly ok for 100 years, Pendrives having no moving parts should beat Hard Drives which have a rotating platter with the ensuing wear and of course the Solid State Drives will be the ultimate to go for when their price drops.
So there you have it. You pays your money and takes your choice.
As for Mac v PC ask yourself why professional illustrators and graphic artists almost exclusively use Mac. Must be why Bill Gates tried to buy out Mac but only got a none controlling interest. Must be why he is trying to make windows act like a Mac.
Whatever the technology if it works for you enjoy it. Life's to short and unless you are a millionaire it's to expensive keeping up with technology.
Still prefer my '96 Hymer to modern ones but that's what being a stick in the mud old fart is all about.
Bet this thread stirs the fertilizer,

BFB:Eeek:
 
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scotjimland

scotjimland

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Hi all,
(snip)
As for Mac v PC ask yourself why professional illustrators and graphic artists almost exclusively use Mac.



BFB:Eeek:

appologise for snipping your post, but only wanted to address that point..

Not being a graphic artist I personally couldn't comment , but am very familiar with both platforms.. best of both worlds perhaps ?

I think the reason is more historic than anything.. in the early years Macs were indeed better or perceived to be better for graphic work, while PCs were considered office machines, more at home crunching numbers .. but times have moved on a pace.. both Macs and PCs use almost identical hardware.. the only real difference nowadays is in the operating systems..

anyways.. I did a quick Google, not to prove one way or the other but to see what was being said.. interesting, if not predictable answers..

Mac vs PC For Graphic Designers

For me it is definitely 'bang for buck' If the price of a Mac was comparable to that of a similarly spec PC.... I'd buy a Mac .. but to get the same spec of Mac as you do in a PC you have to spend at least 50% more.. probably nearer double..

How can Apple justify the prices ..

Labour costs .. . they are built in China .. so that can't be it ..
More expensive components.. I don't think so, they both use Intel processors, WD drives, etc etc ..

Or perhaps its just to keep them a wee bit exclusive ? Like expensive perfume that can only be sold from expensive outlets. ?

I recall the big fuss when one of the high street chemists starting selling expensive branded perfumes at cut price .. the makers stopped supplying as it was devaluing the brand.. that's my theory as to why Macs are expensive..

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bfb

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Reply to Scotjimland

Hi,
I read your reply and and agree wholeheartedly with most you say. The internals are the same as both PC and MAC ie Hard drive, Optical Drive, Memory and Processor. Mac prices for the same product are astronomical but the build quality of the unit is different as chalk and cheese.
The one difference, and the reason why the Mac always tends to be quicker is the PC runs on a Registry and the more programmes that run on the machine the slower it runs. Macs don't have a registry. They maintain their speed.
Back in August a friend of mine with more money than sense(wish I was a millionaire) asked me over to his home to help him with processing a picture which he had taken badly. His machine is a similar spec to my laptop but a PC of questionable parentage (mine is a macbook pro 2.4ghz Quad Core 16g ram 17" Screen). When he saw the speed of my laptop his jaw dropped. Two days later he told me he had bought a Mac Pro 12 core with 64 g ram and 4 x 500 gig SSD drives.(Bugger) Very nice machine and a bit of a screamer but I upset him yet again because mine is portable and his isn't and I can still use mine better because I am more practiced with it..
Mind you I must admit to a bit of jealousy.
Whatever floats your boat remember part of my thread. Use whatever you are happy with. It's not always necessary to update technology every time something new comes out. Being great with what you can afford is far better than useless with the latest gizmo.
The person who taught me to use a Mac and Adobe Photoshop still uses a Power Mac similar to my home machine with the power pc chip and he runs rings around me but there again he is a professional user and has been using them for the past 20 years in his business. As he says it just works and has been 100% reliable.

Happy days, enjoy life

BFB
 
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I think Apple see this as the way forward. Physical media becomes much less important than the cloud. Films made on Macs can be transfered between devices. But you're right, much of the rest of the world is still using "traditional" technology. My dad still plays cassettes and prints out photographs.
Why won't the older generation listen?:RollEyes:

Thats ageist, I have a perfectly good up to date Dansette wireless that never lets me down :RollEyes:
 

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