Keep being drawn to a Auto trail Chieftan. (1 Viewer)

[Encantador]

Hi,

Following on from my introduction thread, we keep being drawn to the Cheiftan, initially we wanted 6 births even though it would be mainly me and the wife and the dog using it. Having said that, it seems that there is already plenty of storage so the extra births over the cab would probably make it more flexible.

Having `upped` our budget to around £35k it looks like we will be looing around the 2001-2004 area from what we have seen online.

I would be grateful for any tips/suggestions/observations, good or bad on the make/model.

Being a bit on the `large` size (me that is), luckily my wife is 5ft 2in and 8 stones, my only concern is the size of the fixed bed, not tried one yet. If we had one and had to resort to using the other bed on the lounge area that would not be ideal.

Being such a beast (the van that is, not me ) are the engines generally powerful enough?
Are there any accessories that you feel would be useful in case we get into a bartering situation with a dealer?

Have purchased the buyers guide which will be useful.

As it will be our first MH a little unsure about exactly how we will end up using it, but the plan is to have lots of weekends away in the UK and maybe 1 3-4 week trip into Europe in the summer.

I assume costs such as fuel/ferry/site fees will be more because of the size.
Have space on the drive so storage is not a issue.

Thanks in advance.

Steve

 

[trophychap]

Same as buying a new bed for at home, except this time take your own pillows with you - get in one take your shoes off and lie on the bed, roll over, curl up, pretend to do whatever you do in bed LOL (sit up, switch the bedside lights on, read your book, drink your cuppa, put your cup wherever there is to put your cup ....)

Pretend wash up, dry up and put stuff away - can you access cupboards/cutlery drawer with other person still at the sink? Our crockery cupboard is above the sink so I put the dried stuff on the driver and passenger seats when Pete's washing because otherwise he might crack his head on the corner of the locker door - plus for the pots and pans I'd need to keep squeezing past him all the while. It's not ideal but it works for us.

Put imaginary or real pans on the hob, if it's a gas kettle remember that will be there too fairly permanently whilst you are parked, then take an imaginary casserole out of the oven - where will you put it before you burn yourself? I keep seeing vans that appear to have no discernible workspace either side of the hob. Recipe for disaster IMHO.

Is the shower cubicle big enough to wash in, with all the doors/curtain/screen in position? Or do you bash your elbows? Can you sit on the loo comfortably with the door shut and can you reach the loo roll holder easily enough?

Some things you can compromise on. Some things, you can't ......

Jenny

 

[haganap]

with a budget of 35k I would not look at anything under 2005.

Be careful between adversed prices and what they are actually being sold for. With a budget of 35k you should be looking at vans in the 40k range and getting the money off to bring it to 35k.

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[Encantador]

Thanks Jenny, very useful.

To be honest, after seeing quite a vew vans including RV`s, I had pretty much ruled out using the shower except in emergencies. As we expect to be on camp sites mostly, I had imagined it would not be a massive problem.

Of course, using the shower is not something you can really `test` properly. I am sure people of my size probably manage in them. I am 6ft 5in and 19 stones, so although not massively obese, definitely not the size and shape that is forefront in the minds of MH designers that`s for sure.

Thanks again.

Steve

 

[JOHNSTEY]

As you don't have a van to trade in 35k should go a lot further than you might think.
I would definitely be looking for at least 3k off the ticket price and would be pushing to get up to 5k.:thumb: I also agree that you should be able to get a good post 2005 van for that kind of price. Good luck.

John

 

[aba]

dont be fooled by large storage areas as if you do happen to fill them you can be guaranteed to be overweight.
the payload even on the big euro vans is not great.
for example you may think that 600kg is a lot but if there are 6 of you in the van that don't leave much in the line for food and clothing never mind all the other bits and bobs like chairs, bbq's tv, water, toilet chem. etc. etc.

i would hazard a guess that nearly 80% of motorhomes and caravans for that matter with the exception of the big RV's are overweight.

some of the smaller ones are overweight as soon as a passenger gets in never mind all the bumf that people put in them.

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[Encantador]

Thanks for the input re price, that was probably going to be a question I was bound to ask sooner or later re what should we expect (hope) to be able to negotiate off the dealers window price.

As we have`nt seen one in the flesh for a while, can anyone confirm that if a 6 birth, in common with some other Auto trails, the over cab bed is not really designed for adults.

Steve

 

[Theonlysue]

Drawn to Autotrail Chieftan

Hi, well worth checking outthe bed and the size of the garage underneath.

Payload very important.

Some campsites in UK and abroad wont accept tag axels, so you may be limited in where you can camp.
I dont think that its a fullly winterised van, so I dont know how important that is to you.

Have you checked out a Bursnter 820 or 821? Similar size and price.
A large Hymer?

Importantly of all, as previuosly said, check it all. Stand and bend in the shower, sit on the loo- see how much legroom you have.
Get up and down on the bed. I'm sure Jim does a checklist that is available.

And do look at as many as possible, pictures will not be sufficient.

All good fun

Good luck, S:thumb:

 

[Encantador]

Thanks, I will take a look at those models.

Also thanks for mentioning about the restrictions, that was another question I meant to ask.

Is a tag axle likely to be a major issue when trying to get onto sites both here and abroad?

Starting with the Chester Food and Wine show I have just this minute booked, I did promise to get a van by then... but never asked if there were any size restrictions.

Steve

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[haganap]

Thanks, I will take a look at those models.

Also thanks for mentioning about the restrictions, that was another question I meant to ask.

Is a tax axle likely to be a major issue when trying to get onto sites bother here and abroad?

Starting with the Chester Food and Wine show I have just this minute booked, I did promise to get a van by then... but never asked if there were any size restrictions.

Steve

Steve, Yes and No,

certainly won't be a problem at the Chester food and wine or the Bring and buy meet or any other fun meet.
Ive not known any campsites refuse tag axle vans, but im sure there must be as Sue would not of said it.
I like the autotrail and Stig (member here) have one so might be worth PMing them.
As sue says the Burstner is a nice van and it does come in a coachbuilt model like the F man (member here has) Have you looked at the Hobby? IMO much better value for money but it's only opinion.

 

[Popeye]

Thanks for the input re price, that was probably going to be a question I was bound to ask sooner or later re what should we expect (hope) to be able to negotiate off the dealers window price.

As we have`nt seen one in the flesh for a while, can anyone confirm that if a 6 birth, in common with some other Auto trails, the over cab bed is not really designed for adults.

Steve

I have to say Steve that my best mate is 6' 7" and just shy of 20 Stone. He's a big fellah, and both he and his wife climbed up on the overcab bed in the Arrapaho (same bed) with no problems whatsoever.

My own Geist Spirit has a similar arrangement and he sleeps up there again with no problem.

Regards.......Griff:thumb:

 

[aba]

i havent had any problems getting on any sites in the uk some have a 8 metre limit but nobody has ever checked the length of my van although mine doesn't look as long as it is because its higher.

i do know of problems with RV's getting on to some uk sites though but that is again down to the assumption that they are going to use more and dump more.

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[Scout]

Thanks for the input re price, that was probably going to be a question I was bound to ask sooner or later re what should we expect (hope) to be able to negotiate off the dealers window price.

As we have`nt seen one in the flesh for a while, can anyone confirm that if a 6 birth, in common with some other Auto trails, the over cab bed is not really designed for adults.

Steve

We have scout with the same over cab as a chieftean, my son in law (v tall) and my daughter have slept up and said how much room there was.

One thing with cheifteans is theres not many with passanger seatbelts in the rear, in some the L shaped setee moves to produce a pair of belted seats against the kitchen bulkhead, but they are few and far bewtween. another thing is they come in full garage (high fixed bed) and half garage (lower fixed bed) modles, buy carefully as its expensive to change afterwards.

I fancy one my self so I probibly should not have give you these tips, there is one down the west coutry with the above buts nearly new and aver 45k.

 

[maz]

Have you checked out a Bursnter 820 or 821? Similar size and price.

Can only agree with Sue that if you are considering a Chieftain be sure to check out the Burstner Elegance 821 as well. Very similar in size and layout but IMO better build quality and equipment. Both the fixed bed and the drop-down bed are almost king size and very comfortable. Alde heating is great, and the Burstner is fully winterised with a heated double floor housing the tanks and pipework. If you go for the 5 ton chassis (look for yellow springs) you get a payload of over a tonne.

 

[Jaws]

I have a Miller States Alabama .. As anyone who has looked in my van will tell you, the shower is big enough even for a fat lumax like me !! In fact it is big enough for two normal people to get in at the same time !!

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[tonka]

it is big enough for two normal people to get in at the same time !!

Is that just bragging or trying to temp someone in ???

Autotrail overhead beds are definatly meant for adults as they keep putting me up there !!

 

[beachcaster]

Having bought our first motorhome ..a 2 year old 2009 696 Autotrail Cheyenne G the garage version.....I must say we do love it . It is plated to 4000 so can carry a bit more than standard and we only use it as a two birth.

Jane has the double made from pulling the two sofas together
and I have the fixed double over the garage....so neither of us get disturbed with any nocturnal visits to the loo

Im 6ft 2ins and a big bloke
and I find the bed over the garage really superb..........probably as good as our bed at home.

Jane who is small and lighter loves the other double bed.

The Autotrail is not perfect...........a few niggly design points but overall we are not in a hurry to change.The garage is just great but for me the star is the 3 litre auto fiat engine ...a real treat to drive.

good luck

barry

 

[Welsh girl]

I contacted swift re the weight a bed over the cab can hold as my daughter and her husband wanted to stay with us and they have a 4 year old at the time and he is quite hefty at 19stones and my daughter is also quite big at the time anyway (wont tell you her weight, she wouldn't be pleased!!) and they told me that the bed is designed to hold 33 stones in weight so it sound as if you are well under that weight combined, wouldn't do to do any aerobatics in there I don't suppose

PS I know yours is not a swift but the same applies to any overbed cab I suppose?

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[Wyaye wires]

they have a 4 year old at the time and he is quite hefty at 19stones

What the hell have they been feeding the four year old?

 

[Encantador]

Can only agree with Sue that if you are considering a Chieftain be sure to check out the Burstner Elegance 821 as well. Very similar in size and layout but IMO better build quality and equipment. Both the fixed bed and the drop-down bed are almost king size and very comfortable. Alde heating is great, and the Burstner is fully winterised with a heated double floor housing the tanks and pipework. If you go for the 5 ton chassis (look for yellow springs) you get a payload of over a tonne.

Looks like a nice vehicle, just done a quick search and does not seem to be many around though. Closest is about 50-60 miles away will have to go and take a look.

 

[Phill D]

one point to consider is the number of belted seats many UK vans claim to be 4 berth / 6 berth and only have belted seats for 2 / 4 . the Law is odd on this point.

just a thought......:thumb:

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[Theonlysue]

Keep being drawn to Autotrail Chieftan

As far as I understand, in forward facing seats adult passengers must wear a seat belt but on inward facing seats they are not required.

Can anyone clarify this?
S

 

[aba]

dont know on the seatbelt issue but ours has 2 lap belts on the rearward facing seats and 2 3 point over shoulder ones on the forward facing seats.

there is some grey area over side facing seats though.

 

[maxsdad]

We have the Autotrail Cherokee which has been excellent so far but there again it should be at 10 mths old,wash room abit on the small side but how long do you spend in there anyway.
Looked at the tag axles but felt the extra expense did not justify the small amount of extra space created.
As for the seat belts regardless of the rules and regulations would you be happy carrying passengers in side facing seats, if you have to brake sharply [and we have all had to at some time or other] they could be thrown forward and injure themselves or you and the missus.
Hope you enjoy your new van whatever you choose and don't forget to bargain hard with all that cash

dave e

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[Popeye]

I have a Miller States Alabama .. As anyone who has looked in my van will tell you, the shower is big enough even for a [HI]fat lumax like me[/HI] !! In fact it is big enough for two normal people to get in at the same time !!

It's true, it even says in the brochure and I quote >

"shower large enough for the fattest of lumix's ask Jaws of MHfun", I've read it I tell you!

 

[robnchris]

Autotrail Chieftian

Hi Steve,
The Chieftain is a good sized vehicle we have the Arapaho which is the same size and are very happy with it and never have any trouble getting on the Caravan Club sites.
Certainly the overcab bed is a good size and very comfortable as mentioned by other Autotrail owners.

We would add that the Autotrail range aren`t really what you would call winterized, we have done quite a bit of work ourselves to improve it`s thermal qualities and have to say it is ok but certainly wouldn`t like to be using it in the low temps we had last winter.
The standard heater fitted just isn`t powerful enough to heat a 8.5mtr van, you could help this by using an extra fan heater but be careful of the amount extra load you are putting on the wiring, if the water heater, fridge freezer and the single electric hob were all used at the same time you could be drawing as much as 5.5 kilowatts.

Yes the Burstner Elegance 821 is an excellent build quality motorhome, certainly better than the Autotrail but is at least £25k more expensive, we looked long and hard at the Burstner and found that as nice as it was it just didn`t work.
Example:- the lounge area is to the right as you walk in, utilizing the drivers and passenger seat which spin round to face the lounge, there is a long seat on the right hand side of the vehicle with a fixed table and “L” shaped seat opposite.
The table does move around on a sliding system but space is limited, ie there isn`t much room to get past someone sat on the long seat on the right hand side of the vehicle, yes you could push the table over to the left hand side but not if someone is sat on that side.
The tv is mounted by the door on a slide out, not really the perfect position for those sat facing across the motorhome.
Ok bed time well let`s say we have a family situation so time for bed kids, mmhh their bed is over the drivers and passengers seats which means when you pull it down you have lost your lounge area, you certainly wouldn`t want them sleeping in your lovely end bedroom.
The kitchen is first class though as is the loo and shower room, the end bedroom comes with 3 options, island bed, double bed to one side or 2 singles.
So as individual areas the Burstner is top quality it`s just as a package it doesn`t work for a family.

The Autotrail / Fiat engine combination is excellent though be careful of buying the newer 6 speed Ducato 3 ltr, they do have a problem with the reverse gear being too high a ratio which gives problems, Fiat did a fix for the smaller 2.2 engine but not for the 3ltr.
The older 5sp 3ltr has a very good reputation.

[FONT=&quot]Whichever you decide to buy we wish you luck, just look at as many as you can and try to move about the motorhome as if you were actually using it.[/FONT]

 

[Encantador]

Thanks Rob n Chris, very informative post.

I will do some research on the difference between the Chieftan and Arapaho.

Not really expecting to want to use the MH in the middle of winter, at least not to sleep in.

I assume the issues you mention with losing the lounge when putting kids to bed would be the same in the 6 birth Chieftan, or have I missed something?

The reversing problem you mention, as reversing is not something you do for that long, wouldn`t the 3 Litre engine be better overall because of the size of the vehicle?

Have you been abroad with yours and if you have, did you have any problems getting on any sites over there?

Thanks again.

Steve

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[JeanLuc]

Hello Steve, have been watching this thread with interest. The issue related to losing lounge space when the children go to bed refers specifically to the A-class design in which the over-cab bed is on cantilevers and pulls down. This is a brilliant system provided you do not need to use the front bed when others wish to stay in the lounge area. The big Burstner referred to earlier is an A-class - none of the UK manufacturers make this style.
I had thought earlier about suggesting you consider a large German A-class - a Burstner, Hymer (called B-klasse) or Euramobil for example - but stopped because of the potential children sleeping issue. If build quality and winterisation are important to you, then a second hand slightly older German motorhome will beat a UK-built one hands-down. Burstner and Euramobil both make large C-class vans (like the Autotrail) and I think you might find them a good alternative to consider.

Good luck with the search.

 

[Encantador]

Thanks Philip, I will take a look at those other makes.

There is no prospect of us needing to accomodate children in the forseeable future and no plans for winter use, so `build quality` is probably the only reason for going for a German A-Class as opposed to the Chieftan.

So I guess the next question is... `Is `build quality`worth paying extra for`?
I guess that is a decision only we can make, easier if we had the two models side by side but I doubt that is going to happen.

I appreciate that most members have never owned a Chieftan, but I don`t remember anyone suggesting there is any area where the Chieftan tops the Burstner, which is worth bearing in mind.

What it will come down to is how much older we will have to go to get the Burstner for the same money and local (ish) availability.

Thanks again for all the comments, they are certainly help the mist to clear a little.

Steve

 

[robnchris]

Thanks Rob n Chris, very informative post.

I will do some research on the difference between the Chieftan and Arapaho.

Not really expecting to want to use the MH in the middle of winter, at least not to sleep in.

I assume the issues you mention with losing the lounge when putting kids to bed would be the same in the 6 birth Chieftan, or have I missed something?

The reversing problem you mention, as reversing is not something you do for that long, wouldn`t the 3 Litre engine be better overall because of the size of the vehicle?

Have you been abroad with yours and if you have, did you have any problems getting on any sites over there?

Thanks again.

Steve

Hi Steve,
The basic difference between Arapaho and the Chieftain are the Arapaho has a large “U” shaped lounge at the rear against the end bedroom of the Chieftain.
Both models only come with the 3ltr engine, or the older models with the 2.8ltr 5 sp.
The reversing problem was caused by the reverse gear ratio being too big, ie too small a gear, apparently Fiat did a gearbox fix for the smaller engine but couldn`t fit the same gearbox onto the 3 ltr. Problem was the clutch would burn due to the high engine revs and severe engine judder whilst try to reverse uphill or on wet grass.

The overhead cab in the Chieftain would mean the kids could go to bed and the lounge area would still be able to be used, though I guess any conversation or the tele might well keep them awake.

As of yet we haven`t taken ours abroad so can`t comment on pitch sizes.

[FONT=&quot]Regards Rob and Chris.[/FONT]

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