Mot news Update (1 Viewer)

Geo

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I posted a couple of days ago about a forthcoming mot seminar

I hinted at the possibility of Pan European MoT Tests and or Certificates.

2015 And beyond

Well the story goes on, It would seem that all member nations have different mot standards and practices, and not much is going to happen untill all members agree a format, that in itself is going to be some achievment, to help us on our way The EU is sending out what appear insignificant directives to all member states
dictating what must happen during a test, eventualy Eu directives will be in place setting out all that should happen.
Our Boys at VOSA are realy not too best pleased with this system as there is little in the way of dialog, ther is some but not enough with guys on the ground

The directives are issued and VOSA has to make them work,
It will be at least 2015 andpossibly later before a workable Pan European MOT scheme will be in place, The the plan is there and it seem The EU are hell bent on pushing it though despite obsticales. The Dutch and Spnish are as we speak taking part in tests whereby a number of Duch vehicles have been tested and the results logged
These vehicles are being re tested in Spain and the results cross checked for acuracy, if all goes well then that wil be a possitive step in the right direction.

Jan 1st 2012

Will see a number of extras added to our MoT check list
dash board safety warning lamps, seat belt ,MiL, ABS, SRS,Steering control, brake fluid lights,etc if illuminated will Fail the Mot
These could be very expenive repairs.

Cat converers mut be in place for vehicle that have them, even if you can still pass the emissions without one, removal is a failure.

Electrical wireing inspection, unclipped or chafing lppms will be a fail item.

Tow bar electrics will be tested for correct function on 2008 and newer vehicles

Tougher brake test limits for 2008 and newer vehicles

Rear brake imbalnce is now a fail item, fronts always have been

ALL cv boots will now be inspected ie inner and outer front and rear (Only front outers are testable at the moment)

All rubber dust covers on ball joints, drag links, track rod ends, will be a fail item if split (only an advise at the moment) you cant just buy the boots:Doh:
I see some hefty bills in this dept
(example steering drag link typical 4 x 4 £100 - £150 for a rubber boot:Eeek:)
All doors must now open from inside as well as out (only front doors tested at the moment)

Hid Headlights must be fitted with self leveling suspension system OR washer and wiper system, Dont panick (nobody else understood that one either)

Thats it for now any question fire away
Geo
 

wasp

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[QUOTE=Geo

Jan 1st 2012

Will see a number of extras added to our MoT check list
dash board safety warning lamps, seat belt ,MiL, ABS, SRS,Steering control, brake fluid lights,etc if illuminated will Fail the Mot
These could be very expenive repairs.


Hi George I noticed MiL on the list why would she have anything to do with the MoT????? hehehe just a thought
 

trevosky

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Spain

Here in spain the dashboard warning light has recently come into force but one of the worst things is what they call the fisha techknical and that is the paperwork that states the details of your vehicle.I at present run a renualt kangoo mpv at ten years old this has to have itv (mot) every 6 months and the fisha tech states everything your vehicle should have,if you have a towbar fitted it has to go back have itv and registerd on fisha,my kangoo has an almost obselete tyre size fitted so absolute fortune 4 new tyres, for last 6 years the light that indicates eleci fault has been on ,goes off at higher end of revs but not certain whether will go through this time and tired of six monthly checks (now 13 years old) so changing car quick.
When i changed my old Hymer to Spanish plates engineer did report fot itv including the add on IE awning,i have since added a bike rack but this will be removed before itv as not registerd and fitted again after,problem being this could in event of accident invalidate my insurance,one of our work vehicles had ruuning boards fitted (never registerd) and passed for first 5 years and then noticed and failed. Typical Spain make nothing easy:good luck to you all in UK if it becomes like spain.
All the best Trev:Doh:

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G4GMO

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Jan 1st 2012

Will see a number of extras added to our MoT check list
dash board safety warning lamps, seat belt ,MiL, ABS, SRS,Steering control, brake fluid lights,etc if illuminated will Fail the Mot
These could be very expenive repairs.

Cat converers mut be in place for vehicle that have them, even if you can still pass the emissions without one, removal is a failure.

Electrical wireing inspection, unclipped or chafing lppms will be a fail item.

Excuse my ignorance but what are MIL and lppms? The wiring in the cab is a bit of a rats nest does this mean I'm going to have to tidy it up? It's safe enough now but..... :Confused:
 

moandick

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hi Jon - I think in this case - MiL stands for Mother - in - Law. :Doh:

Lppms is a bit technical but it is considered generally to be a problem with Geo's typing finger - should read 'Looms', methinks
 
Jan 11, 2010
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Well that`s our 13th year & still loving it.
brakes

Brakes arghh what brakes, when we bought our motorhome an Autotrail Cheyenne on a Merc sprinter base I asked about the brakes saying they seem rather slow in stopping the truck.
They fitted new pads and after the initial bedding in I didn`t think there was much difference, took it for a service and mot at a commercial van centre and they said eveything ok, when I mentioned the brakes they guy said it`s just Merc Sprinters they have what we call progressive brakes...

I guess I`m just used to the brakes on the car, but I always feel I`m planning ahead when braking in the motorhome...

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American Dream

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And we know EXACTLY where this is going.....

They have been trying for many years to get the owner and enthusiasts of older and classic vehicles off the road....

It also adds to boost the sales of new vehicles and garage profits for extra maintenance.

It also increases the cost of installing new equipment at the testing centres and the instruction of operatives to use such equipment.

At the end of all this, the only people that'll end up paying for this are you and me...

I am all for the safety and integrity of all vehicles on a Public Highway for everyone's safety.

Remember the Classic Vehicle tax where once a vehicle became over a certain age it became Tax exempt.....?

Even more nails in the coffin now unless there are exemptions in place for "older" vehicles?

I see these were mentioned...

Tow bar electrics will be tested for correct function on 2008 and newer vehicles

Tougher brake test limits for 2008 and newer vehicles
Remember the Classic Vehicle tax where once a vehicle became over a certain age it became Tax exempt.....?This was on a rolling basis until it was stopped???

It's cunning the way these laws are slipped in without any consultation of the masses.I guess it was seen as a way of EVADING one of the many taxes the population of this country are now subject to...

Any car built (as opposed to registered) prior to Jan 1 1973 qualifies to be a Historic car in the eyes of DVLA, and as such qualifies for zero rated road tax. Originally the cutoff was meant to be a rolling 25 years, but the current Labour government quashed this, setting the cutoff for Historic status as 01/01/73. You do still need to display a tax disc however, really just to prove that when you applied for the disc you had current insurance and MOT, but you will not have to hand over a single penny. This legislation can have some bearing on values of identical cars that were built either side of the '73 cutoff - buy a January 1973 build Triumph TR6 and you'll have to pay up even though the car comes out on sunny days only, whereas your neighbour with his/her '72 TR6 is in the fortunate position of paying £nothing, which, if totted up over a few years, can add up to a significant sum!
Compliance for a modern roadworthy vehicle is one thing but there are many "older" vehicles without abs and all round disc brakes that will be marginal or possibly fail if today's regs apply and yet test well within tolerance for the regs they were built to comply with.

There will be arguments for and against these comments but these are my feelings on this over-legislation society we now live in.

I was following a van of not to old an age the other day with such bad body rot and non-functional lighting and it was on the road.

Am I to assume this vehicle was illegally driven and, if so, who is "Policing" and enforcing the condition of such vehicles on our roads?:RollEyes:

Any comments on how the Regs apply to these?
 
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G4GMO

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hi Jon - I think in this case - MiL stands for Mother - in - Law. :Doh:

Lppms is a bit technical but it is considered generally to be a problem with Geo's typing finger - should read 'Looms', methinks

I haven't strapped mine as a mascot to the front of vehicle yet. Is this a prerequisite for the MOT? :ROFLMAO:
 
Oct 15, 2007
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Americandream, my thoughts too, 'they' just don't understand, nor want too, the enthusiast, or have any thought for the industry that supports the enthusiast.

In time I can see many vehicles coming off the road and being worthless, well apart from scrap value, simply because it's imposible to comply with one reg or another.


Better enjoy these vehicles while we can:Angry:

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moandick

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I think you are supposed to stand her on the bonnet - but only if she resembles the Rolls Royce Silver Lady :thumb:

In my case - I sit her on the front of the roof rack, she likes a bit of fresh air and to see all that's going on around her.

Bit like Michelin 'Mum', really! :ROFLMAO:
 

hilldweller

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Well the story goes on,
Geo

Although you can't argue with that from a safety point of view I can't help wondering how much pressure was applied by the manufacturers to ratchet up the tests so old cars get scrapped sooner to deliberately reduce their life.

And how much from money grabbing scumbag MOT testers out to double their profit per sale.
 

American Dream

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Although you can't argue with that from a safety point of view I can't help wondering how much pressure was applied by the manufacturers to ratchet up the tests so old cars get scrapped sooner to deliberately reduce their life.

And how much from money grabbing scumbag MOT testers out to double their profit per sale.

Some MOT Testers are very unscrupulous IMHO and I tend to avoid them.

Others are made to comply to the Regs or risk/lose their licence to test vehicles.

Between a Rock and a Hard Place in my opinion.

We all have a choice....I choose to go with Solid and Fair MOT Testers even if they do fail initially.

Better to know what failed or was advised than just go with them and pay through the nose by having the work done with them.

We all have a choice who does the repairs.I tend to check out the garage first.

There are so few out there now who know how the the "OLD" technology works and can diagnose issues.A lot of them just rely on plugging in a diagnostics machine and letting that pinpoint the problem..:ROFLMAO:This is an issue that can only get worse as engines become sealed blocks that can't be worked upon except by specialists with the right diagnostic equipment.

My LOTUS does not have one...Does that make it un-MOTable?:RollEyes:

My last fail on the RV was because the Horn made the wrong noise...There were 2 new tyres in the RV that I requested them to change as I was aware they were getting to the point of being on-the-limit. They said they would do it but couldn't be bothered...and gave me an advisory for them.

I know where I won't be going again.

OK I accept that under current MOT regs the horn is unusual but it is loud and monotone and will certainly let other users know I'm there...I have now fitted a "compliant" one. Nowhere hear as loud but "compliant"

But does that affect vehicle safety?I can't remember the last time I used it apart from per MOT and on the driver Pre-run checks.

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madbluemad

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Hi Geo, thanks for the info.

I have a rear fog lamp switch which was fitted in the UK, it is illuminated when the lamp is switched on. This is a legal requirement at the moment. Is this considered to be a dashboard warning light as it would then be a failure under the new regs.

Thanks
Jim
:Smile:
 
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Its frightening where this EU dictatorship is taking us continuous regulation for regulations sake just to justify their existence :Doh: a bloody nightmare :Eeek:
 

dazzer

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Hi Geo.

Can you clarify the dashboard lights thing for me please ::bigsmile:

At the moment ive got the following light on on the van (Vauxhall Vivaro)

Alarm light (goes on and off at will!!!)
Engine management light (telling me there is a fault with the heater coils/cold start system even though they have been replaced and the thing starts without problems even at -12 degrees!!)
Cold start system warning light (see above)
Airbag warning light (has a mind of its own and goes out when the moon is in alignment with Mars and Jupiter!!)

All of the above lights have been reset over the years on numerous occasions but after a few days they come back on again so ive given up with them.

Would any of them be a failure??

Cheers :thumb::thumb:
 

hilldweller

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Its frightening where this EU dictatorship is taking us continuous regulation for regulations sake just to justify their existence :Doh: a bloody nightmare :Eeek:

You said it and this MOT bit is just a tiny fraction of what they are doing. The Gestapo were clumsy amateurs compared to the new generation.


PS I got a nasty reprimand on The Dark Side for saying their moderators used Gestapo tactics, censoring and removing messages :roflmto:
 
Feb 22, 2008
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You said it and this MOT bit is just a tiny fraction of what they are doing. The Gestapo were clumsy amateurs compared to the new generation.


PS I got a nasty reprimand on The Dark Side for saying their moderators used Gestapo tactics, censoring and removing messages :roflmto:

We will soon learn what it would have been like if the result of ww2 were different :Eeek:
glad I'm too old for it to have too much impact on me :Sad:

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hilldweller

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We will soon learn what it would have been like if the result of ww2 were different :Eeek:
glad I'm too old for it to have too much impact on me :Sad:

But what about our children, grandchildren ? At least there is now little chance of European war for them.
 

madbluemad

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If and I stress if we could get a suitable and fair MOT across the board in Europe I for one would rate it as a good thing, however, If it happens I'm a Chinaman.

As far as EU directives are concerned, we've had a boat load of them through related to work over the last few years. They are a serious pain in the bum and are costly to apply, just what British business need right now.

Virtually all of the old British Standards are obsolete being replaced by ISO & EN Specifications and Codes. These documents are written in a different style of language to the old British Standards and instead of just having to read one specification there is always a reference to another specification that has to be read to make sense of the initial one.

Again very poor. We tend to go out of our way to use American Codes and Standards whenever we can, however, because of the disparities between the legislative requirements and America and European requirements its very difficult.

I hope the people who voted for us to become involved with all this nonsense take note.
Jim
 

Loddy

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In our area there is a company that supplies aftermarket gaiters that fit track rod ends and suchlike. I always thought a damaged gaiter should be a failure because of the ingress of dirt and dust causing an abrasive action on the joint, and I suspect the tyre depth will increase to 2mm, about time

Loddy

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Feb 22, 2008
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But what about our children, grandchildren ? At least there is now little chance of European war for them.

We don't need to be ruled by them to avoid war. We know what freedom is, perhaps our grandchildren will gradually grow into living under the thumb , but our children will realise what has been lost when its too late.
Must stop I'm going off thread
 

motor roamin

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First a big thanks to geo for this information, as I am no longer an MOT tester and not directly involved in the motor trade I usualy have to hunt for such information so again thanks for taking the time and trouble. Another whisky owed.

With us being involved with the haulage and training industry I know only too well what interfering Eu can do, including forcing rules on us that we have actually opposed, then rushung the legislation in because they have set a dead line they can't meet, hence some of the half assed regs we have got.

I am sure some one will soon start to manufacture dust boots for track rod ends ball joints etc as they become part of an MOT as you know warning lights have long been a part of the HGV test and personally I dont see a problem with that.

You know as well as I do some of what is coming in will be down to the MOT testers interpritation, as for getting the whole of europe singing from the same sheet it "ain't gonna appen" any more than it does (as it is supposed too) with driving tests, and that is since 1997.

It appears (with a bit of luck) that some parts of the test will as now be age related can't see an Austin seven ever passing a rolling road test, which will mean we are testing the car as designed, so failure rates shouldn't be any higher for a properly maintained vehicle, what are your thoughts on that geo.

Please keep us posted.

All the best Rick.
 

motor roamin

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Brakes arghh what brakes, when we bought our motorhome an Autotrail Cheyenne on a Merc sprinter base I asked about the brakes saying they seem rather slow in stopping the truck.
They fitted new pads and after the initial bedding in I didn`t think there was much difference, took it for a service and mot at a commercial van centre and they said eveything ok, when I mentioned the brakes they guy said it`s just Merc Sprinters they have what we call progressive brakes...

I guess I`m just used to the brakes on the car, but I always feel I`m planning ahead when braking in the motorhome...

I would hope this is how we all drive always, irrespective of the veicle we are driving, ask any motorcyclist on here, it is part of every driver training course and for the HGV if you are 44 ton up and dont plan you are going to kill someone within a week when they take your braking space in their car.

All the best Rick.

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motor roamin

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Looks like what we used to do in the late 60's early 70's for a summer convertable now might fail then.......Cut the roof off weld the doors up and hope it don't rain to hard. :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:

All the best Rick
 
OP
OP
Geo

Geo

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This is a bloody long reply so as usual spelling wil have to do as it is:roflmto:
Excuse my ignorance but what are MIL and lppms? The wiring in the cab is a bit of a rats nest does this mean I'm going to have to tidy it up? It's safe enough now but..... :Confused:
Malfucntion Indicator Lamp, lppms is how testers spell Looms:RollEyes:
Rats nests smell like a fail to me,But it depends where and how
The wireing examination may be restricted to engine bay, may be not, we will have to wait for the wording, we sell gaffer tape:thumb:
And we know EXACTLY where this is going.....

They have been trying for many years to get the owner and enthusiasts of older and classic vehicles off the road....

It also adds to boost the sales of new vehicles and garage profits for extra maintenance.

It also increases the cost of installing new equipment at the testing centres and the instruction of operatives to use such equipment.

At the end of all this, the only people that'll end up paying for this are you and me...

I am all for the safety and integrity of all vehicles on a Public Highway for everyone's safety.

Remember the Classic Vehicle tax where once a vehicle became over a certain age it became Tax exempt.....?

Even more nails in the coffin now unless there are exemptions in place for "older" vehicles?

I see these were mentioned...

Remember the Classic Vehicle tax where once a vehicle became over a certain age it became Tax exempt.....?This was on a rolling basis until it was stopped???

It's cunning the way these laws are slipped in without any consultation of the masses.I guess it was seen as a way of EVADING one of the many taxes the population of this country are now subject to...

Compliance for a modern roadworthy vehicle is one thing but there are many "older" vehicles without abs and all round disc brakes that will be marginal or possibly fail if today's regs apply and yet test well within tolerance for the regs they were built to comply with.

There will be arguments for and against these comments but these are my feelings on this over-legislation society we now live in.

I was following a van of not to old an age the other day with such bad body rot and non-functional lighting and it was on the road.

Am I to assume this vehicle was illegally driven and, if so, who is "Policing" and enforcing the condition of such vehicles on our roads?:RollEyes:

Any comments on how the Regs apply to these?
I think i disagree with 99.9% of your post Steve, The MoT test is well tailored to the older car, I cant thin of a sigle instance were a new regulation hasnt had a from 19?? etc date
As for the not so old van you followed it may have been in month 11 of its last test, so what will it be like in its 23rd month:Eeek:

Although you can't argue with that from a safety point of view I can't help wondering how much pressure was applied by the manufacturers to ratchet up the tests so old cars get scrapped sooner to deliberately reduce their life.

And how much from money grabbing scumbag MOT testers out to double their profit per sale.
Manf input very little belive it or not, that usualy comes in later, and to your defence:whatthe:
Example, Ford KAs were failing the test in droves, on excess play in top suspension mounts front and rear, untill ford intervened and said to Vosa they are suposed to be like that and Vosa backed of issuing a special notice telling we were to allow a massive tollerance, so we do, I just know when we fail them and fit new ones there is very little play
As for money making scumbag MoT testers, ::bigsmile:Someones got to do it:winky:
You may be suprised at te comments from a room full of testers to Vosa, We all thought the same thing, that all these new regs are going to look like a ticket to print money for the testing stations, we are aware of what you public think of us at testing time:RollEyes:
Hi Geo, thanks for the info.

I have a rear fog lamp switch which was fitted in the UK, it is illuminated when the lamp is switched on. This is a legal requirement at the moment. Is this considered to be a dashboard warning light as it would then be a failure under the new regs.

Thanks
Jim
:Smile:
The lights in question are manufacturers safety related items as stated warning lmps that tell you its gone wrong,
your fog lamp light is called a fog lamp tell tale and will fail if it dont work:thumb:
Hi Geo.

Can you clarify the dashboard lights thing for me please ::bigsmile:

At the moment ive got the following light on on the van (Vauxhall Vivaro)

Alarm light (goes on and off at will!!!)
Engine management light (telling me there is a fault with the heater coils/cold start system even though they have been replaced and the thing starts without problems even at -12 degrees!!)
Cold start system warning light (see above)
Airbag warning light (has a mind of its own and goes out when the moon is in alignment with Mars and Jupiter!!)

All of the above lights have been reset over the years on numerous occasions but after a few days they come back on again so ive given up with them.

Would any of them be a failure??

Cheers :thumb::thumb:
Hi dazzer you are my freind a prime target If you engine malfunction lamp is on I will not question "WHY" just fail it,:whatthe: same with the air bag and ABS lamp, Alarm or other spurious lights dont count
Other lamps that matter are brake fluid level,Power/electric steering warning lamp. power steering fluid levels, all now just an advise, but wil be a fail,as will be seat belt pre tensioners, if theve gone off, FAIL there going out as well:Doh:
In our area there is a company that supplies aftermarket gaiters that fit track rod ends and suchlike. I always thought a damaged gaiter should be a failure because of the ingress of dirt and dust causing an abrasive action on the joint, and I suspect the tyre depth will increase to 2mm, about time

Loddy
Hi loddy
Gaiters and CV Boots are a different thing to ball joint and track rod end dust covers,and of course gaiters and front outer cv boots are a fail item at present come Jan 1st all cv boots will be failable as will all dust covers, Im not aware of any Manf that supply dust covers on their own,subject to wording a glue repair may be possible
a lot of these rubber covers get split when distmantling to fit other items so that is going to run up a lot of peoples bills, the other disturbing factor is, its the proper distmantling tools that split the covers:Angry:, the other way is to smack seven bells out of your suspension, that saves the boot BUT:Doh:
Thanks Geo :thumb:



Is there an exemption or lower spec. for older vehicles?



I assume having the child locks on isn't a failure?

Older vehicle will allways be exemt from upper limits if by design they can not be met,
There are many examples Were not animals really:RollEyes:
Child Locks? Thats a funny one::bigsmile:
If the rear door wont open from inside it fails
If it wont open inside because of a child lock its a pass and advise:thumb:
BUT were not allowed to touch the child lock to prove that it is the lock preventing the door from opening
IE we cant flick it off to test it again, so we have to assume:Doh:
Not all cars have an indicater to show if the child lock is on or off and as said we cant touch em
Its the same for frontand rear seat belts, if youve a dodgy one put a child seat on it, we cant touch them either:RollEyes:
But dont try it with the Drivers one will you, we kinda guess 3 month old Jimmy didnt drive here:ROFLMAO:
Looks like what we used to do in the late 60's early 70's for a summer convertable now might fail then.......Cut the roof off weld the doors up and hope it don't rain to hard. :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:

All the best Rick
Not here it wont,Rick, No rules to say you have to have doors, just that if you do they must open:thumb:
Geo

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Landy lover

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Hi Geo as a MOT tester I appreciate that you are not allowed to dismantle any part for test - how would you be expected to test a brake fluid test lamp for safe operation without removing the top and therefore the sensor to see if it comes on ? not all show up on a test cycle before starting
 

Chani

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Older vehicle will allways be exemt from upper limits if by design they can not be met,
There are many examples Were not animals really:RollEyes:

Didn't think you were 'animals'! That doesn't mean the people who decide the rules aren't ::bigsmile:

Child Locks? Thats a funny one::bigsmile:
If the rear door wont open from inside it fails
If it wont open inside because of a child lock its a pass and advise:thumb:
BUT were not allowed to touch the child lock to prove that it is the lock preventing the door from opening
IE we cant flick it off to test it again, so we have to assume:Doh:
Not all cars have an indicater to show if the child lock is on or off and as said we cant touch em

Now that be why I were askin' ! Was wondering how that was going to work. Didn't even know there WERE child lock indicators on cars these days!
 
OP
OP
Geo

Geo

Trader - Funster
Jul 29, 2007
11,757
14,563
Mansfield,Notts
Funster No
35
MH
Autotrail Tracker FB
Exp
45 +years with breaks
Hi Geo as a MOT tester I appreciate that you are not allowed to dismantle any part for test - how would you be expected to test a brake fluid test lamp for safe operation without removing the top and therefore the sensor to see if it comes on ? not all show up on a test cycle before starting
Seemple
We Won't
Its only a fail if its illuminated :thumb:
as with checking brake fluid currently and Jan1st Power steering fluid level
it can only be checked if the resoviour is a clear see through one:Doh:
G

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