Single Mum needing reassurance... (1 Viewer)

scotjimland

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I received this email from a single mum who is seeking advice about travelling alone in France and Italy ..

Rather than give her only my opinion I thought it be better if you good people gave her some advice and reassurance ..

I will reply to her email with a link to the thread and advise her to join Fun ..

Thank you in advance for your replies :Smile:

here is her message

I am a single parent with four small children.

Last year I bought a motorhome to enable me to camp offsite and intend to travel France and Italy this year.

A number of people have told me it is not safe or wise for me to stay outside camps.

I have been told lots of horror stories of how I will be mugged or worse.

I have been told that East Europeans will spray starter fluid in my air intake to render me and my children unconscious.

How much of this is true, from your experience please?

I was so excited about going away and camping wild, now I feel like the most irresponsible parent in the world!

From: singlemum
 
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artona

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Well Jim this is a hard one. You can't go telling someone its safe when it isn't. But then again its not any more unsafe than going into town at night.
 

artona

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ps, what sites do you go on that single mums contact you :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:

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Personally l think that the gassing stories are rubbish, so l would rule that one out. You are just as likely to be mugged in the UK as anywhere else, so reduce that risk as much as possible, and camp / park sensibly. If it doesn't feel right, move on. Not everybody out there is a robber, or mugger! The horror stories you hear, are probably just that, stories. Be sensible, be aware, but don't be put off. Go out and enjoy, with the children, its great! Don't let a few scaremongers put you off enjoying yourselves. l wish you well, and happy travels!
 

Jim

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Well Jim this is a hard one. You can't go telling someone its safe when it isn't. But then again its not any more unsafe than going into town at night.


On the contrary; you can't go telling someone it isn't safe when it is. :Smile:

You are a good person to ask Stew, you are well travelled, you fulltimed for a while.

What is the worst thing you heard/saw/witnessed happen to someone touring Europe that was not covered by their insurance.
 
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Well Jim this is a hard one. You can't go telling someone its safe when it isn't. But then again its not any more unsafe than going into town at night.

WHY isn't it safe?

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JeanLuc

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All the usual stuff really I suppose. Don't use motorway aires; aires in small towns and villages should be fine; municipal sites are a good choice in season; the community of 'camping caristes' is pretty friendly. We have used aires and public car parks in winter when it is dark (as well as summer of course) without disturbance or problem.

N.b. most campsites, especially municipales in France, and Italy will close on 30 Sept and not reopen until Easter - hence the need to use aires anyway if travelling over Autumn / Winter.

Never stay anywhere you don't feel comfortable - move on. I would not pitch in an area where there were lots of itinerant East Europeans. Try and stop where there are other 'family' / 'mature' / single motorhomers - not on your own miles from anywhere.

Gas attacks are, so far as we can tell from expert opinion, urban myths.

Consider joining France Passion and the Italian equivalent (forget its name) then stay on farms, where there is a local family, and which are away from busy towns.

Finally, either on Fun (or possibly the dark side) I have seen posts from single ladies asking if there could be a common interest group to travel together. There must be an opportunity here, even if it is just to agree occasional rendez-vous points during a trip.

Enjoy it, and provided you ae sensible - all should be fine.

Philip

p.s. get Ringleader Jim's book which, I understand, contains a lot of advice on personal safety and awareness of your surroundings.
 

rainbow chasers

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Just an idea - why not have a chat with some ex-pats? She may get a few nights stay for a nominal fee on land that they have?

The ex-pats could rent her a part of their feild for a few nights i am sure - good way of making friends too!
 

hilldweller

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I am a single parent with four small children.

>> I am a single parent with four small children.

That sounds pretty dangerous to me. How on earth can she supervise 4 small children and supervise a motorhome on the move ?

Sounds like a disaster waiting to happen.

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Peter James

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I read that statistically, the type of person most likely to be attacked or mugged is a male between the age of 18 and 25.

I am sure there are very few people who would attack a single woman with children. Even criminals usually have some standards.
 
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scotjimland

scotjimland

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Thanks for your replies so far, hopefully Alison will be on to thank you and to explain to Brian how she manages with four kiddies in tow, but provided they all have secure seating.. I don't see how it's any different to driving a car with four kids..

Good luck to her :Smile:
 

hilldweller

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but provided they all have secure seating.. I don't see how it's any different to driving a car with four kids..

Quite simple. Size.

They are very confined in a car, always visible and within touching distance of the driver. Quite different in van. Much bigger distances are involved here. Huge stress for the driver.

She doesn't have to explain to me or anyone else on FUN for that matter. I've done my bit of risk analysis and she can take note or not, it's her choice.

She must be quite a person to cope single handed with four kids.

I think she can improve her plan a lot by staying in the UK. Smaller distances. Closer to friends and family. If they are small kids then they'll hardly notice the difference. Go abroad when they are bigger.

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Spacerunner

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I read that statistically, the type of person most likely to be attacked or mugged is a male between the age of 18 and 25.

I am sure there are very few people who would attack a single woman with children. Even criminals usually have some standards


Not in my world they don't!
 

Haaamster

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Just an idea - why not have a chat with some ex-pats? She may get a few nights stay for a nominal fee on land that they have?

The ex-pats could rent her a part of their feild for a few nights i am sure - good way of making friends too!

What a great idea, maybe someone could extend it further and start a scheme supplying ex pats with food they miss from home for a free night stay.


"Two bottle of Daddies and last weeks newspapers for a night stopover guvnor"
 

Bulletguy

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Quite simple. Size.

They are very confined in a car, always visible and within touching distance of the driver. Quite different in van. Much bigger distances are involved here. Huge stress for the driver.

She doesn't have to explain to me or anyone else on FUN for that matter. I've done my bit of risk analysis and she can take note or not, it's her choice.

She must be quite a person to cope single handed with four kids.

I think she can improve her plan a lot by staying in the UK. Smaller distances. Closer to friends and family. If they are small kids then they'll hardly notice the difference. Go abroad when they are bigger.
I agree entirely with Brians observations Jim. My first thought when I read Jims initial post was what the hell is a single mother thinking of touring around foreign parts and unfamiliar territory in a mh/campervan with four small children in tow?

Personally i'd see it as irresponsible.

If she must do this....then as Brian says, stick to the UK, smaller distances and close to friends and family.

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Small children need space to run and play especially after a day's driving. From what I've seen aires are not places to run around, there are often vehicles moving about, people have barbecues out, and space can be tight. Again from our experience France Passion sites are not necessarily suitable for children, the parking areas can be near machinery, or the hosts homes and business premises. Were I travelling with 4 young children I would see municipal and other campsites and off season discount ASCI sites as being far more suitable.
What m/h does Alison have. Does it have 4 fully belted front facing passenger seats suitable for children. If not and two of the seats are backward facing she will have difficulty seeing them unless she rigs up some sort of mirror arrangement. The point made about the distance from her that the children could be seated is very valid.
I would think about this very carefully,
Violet
 
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scotjimland

scotjimland

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I know only what I posted in my first post, I don't know what kind of van she has, what seating arrangement it has or how old the kids are .. I suspect she may have an RV as the email was via the RV Fulltiming web site.. but that's only a guess.

Regarding safety, I would say that France is generally safer than the UK, we have travelled extensively with children, during 2008 we spent nine months touring using aires exclusively.

Many are indeed no better than a Tesco car park, but there are many that are very safe and suitable for kids.. however, I certainly wouldn't recommend wild camping either here or abroad with kids..

It's good to hear others views, thanks again, I've no doubt you have all given her much food for thought ..
 

artona

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On the contrary; you can't go telling someone it isn't safe when it is. :Smile:

You are a good person to ask Stew, you are well travelled, you fulltimed for a while.

What is the worst thing you heard/saw/witnessed happen to someone touring Europe that was not covered by their insurance.

Probably the way I wrote my answer. I meant it to sound that it probably isn't any more dangerous than doing most other things in life.

I guess it depends on the ages of the children. Europe is a big place and it would be important to know what to do in the case of an emergency. If for example all the children were really small what would she do if one got ill and needed treatment. Who would look after the others. I remember buying a speed boat once and taking my three little children out, it was just me and them. We all had life jackets on but as we took off over the waves I suddenly considered which of the three I would let drown if I could only save two. Nothing is too dangerous if you know the way out in the event of it going wrong

stew

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Jim

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I agree entirely with Brians observations Jim. My first thought when I read Jims initial post was what the hell is a single mother thinking of touring around foreign parts and unfamiliar territory in a mh/campervan with four small children in tow?

Personally i'd see it as irresponsible.

If she must do this....then as Brian says, stick to the UK, smaller distances and close to friends and family.

She's hardly being irresponsible as she is thinking ahead and asking the right questions. Mostly that is all that is required to ensure your personal security.

travelling alone with young kids is not as difficult as some might imagine and as long as the daily distances are very short its easily doable. . As for touching distance this does not matter, you won't be touching or turning and looking at the kids when you are driving so a mirror is always a good idea.

Very young kids normally sleep throughout, as they get a little older if they are not asleep they are arguing or being sick.. This is when you will find it difficult on your own but its not a show stopper and she will know all this already. Touring in a modern motorhome with 4 kids will be hard work, but she will be used to looking after them anyway.

in 1942 my Grandmother travelled from West Ham to Woodstock in Oxfordhire in a mixture of horsdrawn vehicle train and bus. She travelled with her 9 children, the oldest of which was 12. She then looked after them, in a strange town in one room 14ft by 10 for 3 years with a war on.
 

davejen

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She's hardly being irresponsible as she is thinking ahead and asking the right questions. Mostly that is all that is required to ensure your personal security.

in 1942 my Grandmother travelled from West Ham to Woodstock in Oxfordhire in a mixture of horsdrawn vehicle train and bus. She travelled with her 9 children, the oldest of which was 12. She then looked after them, in a strange town in one room 14ft by 10 for 3 years with a war on.

With all due respect, 1942 was a world away from 2010!

Cheers, Dave:thumb:
 

haganap

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I can't understand the judgemental attitude of some.
I don't recall scotjim saying that the lady was driving with a baby on her lap whilst breast feeding:whatthe:
Lighten up guys and give some proper advice. Before we know her oldest could be 12/13/14/15 years old and more than capable with mucking in with the younger ones.


My advice for Alison, would be take head about the aires sittuation. Both parking and finding space for youngens to play can be difficult if you have not researched the aire first.

Would be much better to do municiple sites that cost next to nothing with everything that is required, stop a few nights, and off you go to the next one :thumb:

Stay off the tolls and get a good sat nav, learn to read signs that advertise BIS (tourist route) and teach one or two of the kids to read maps.
Alison should register an join a forum as soon as. My last 5 trips to France have involved taking others with us. Im sure she could hook up with some others who have a bit of experience if she got her self known on the forum
 

thehutchies

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I started and finished this reply several times until I found an inner calm that would allow me to post without being banned forever.

Anyway...

My wife and I travel with four young children.
Each year, we go to France for two or three months, wildcamping or staying on aires and campsites.
Neither one of us would have the slightest hesitation in doing the same thing solo.

One adult looking after four kids in a motorhome on a long journey is a damned sight easier than in a car - everything you would have in your home is there at hand. If there's a problem, stop and sort it out then continue.

There is no extra stress involved in travelling with children as long as you are thoughtful enough to consider their needs.

The problem with asking for advice on the average motorhome forum is that the average motorhome carries a couple of purblind owld gimmers, close to retirement, who have never done anything unconventional or even imagined that anyone would want to live in a way even slightly different from their own.

For example, threads on here asking about whether it's safe to stay in Calais will have a hundred replies about how you will be murdered in your overcab beds by illegal immigrants. We always 'wildcamp' in Calais at the start and end of our holidays (once for 6 nights) and it feels far safer than taking the kids to any British town on a Saturday afternoon.

Have a look at this happy family: Link Removed
Unconventional, maybe, but is that bad? Irresponsible?

When you do take the time to consider other people's chosen ways of living, you realise that just about anything is possible and so the world becomes a slightly less scary place.

:Smile:

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wayfarer

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Tell her to go for it. We stay both in aires and sites for the month of June all over France and we meet couples with children regularly. We also meet single girls and older ladies who travel on their own and I have the greatest admiration for them, you cannot live life worried about what might happen, get out there and enjoy it while you can.
 
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scotjimland

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Just to illustrate a point ..

An Aire im SW France, safe, plenty of space for kids, a mini market at the entrance and you only pay for water..
This is not an exception, but just an example of one of the many great aires France has on offer, just waiting to be found .. an enjoyed

This pic was taken in July .. the high season

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Good luck to her and her children! l say go for it!
They will probably, as my children have done, remember the adventures for the rest of their lives. l don't think she is being irresponsible at all. Sounds like she is being responsible, asking before she goes.
The kids maybe very well behaved, and very well brought up. l can think of nothing finer than camping with kids. Well, mine certainly, they loved every minute of our camping days, and now have a great admiration for the outdoors.
They remember with fondness the camping holidays with us, as l remember mine with my parents. Now they take their children camping, and they can't wait to be buying motorhomes their selves. And l can't wait to be buying our next MH!
 

artona

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Just as potentially dangerous as a crowded campsite in some ways. Easier to keep an eye on your children as you are the only ones there but as you are the only ones if the local crook is on the look out you are the only target.

We can argue for and against for ever but in the end if you want to do something and analyse and prepare for any dangers, being forewarned is armed and you have minimised the dangers. Its like crossing the road, its a dangerous place but we all know the green cross code, Jess knew it by the age of two

stew
 

JeanLuc

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Ah Jim, but what, or who is lurking in your picture at the extreme right and casting their shadow? Must be a local ne're do well waiting for the unsuspecting Brits to lower their guard and relax the stiff upper lip. Better to stay safely parked in the drive at home surely, and not risk attack in 'foreign parts'.

And then of course, the trouble with Johnny Foreigner is that he doesn't speak English (only a lot of them do nowadays - and in any event, we should make a fair attempt at speaking their language).

Recently, we saw that France has the highest rating as a 'good country in which to live' and that is based on various parameters including safety and social systems.

As others have said, let's lighten up and support someone who is going to enjoy travel and give her children a broader perspective on life than that dreadful example of youth thuggery in Manchester shown on last night's news. We should help her achieve her goal, not try and find reasons why she should not!

Philip

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