London LEZ and Unweltzone (1 Viewer)

[Braunston]

Hi,

Just thought I would raise this looming problem again, it appears Boris may have suspended the second phase for now but I assume that is only a temporary stay of execution and the Unweltzones in some of the Germany cities apparently may be changed later this year or early next thus raising/lowering the emission limits.

So my question is has anyone been looking at retro fitting filters, it appears there are some companies in Germany that have filters that may suit our motorhomes, but the British companies all seem to be concentrating on the larger HGV market.

Here's a link to a Germany site that may have suitable equipment for our older Fiats/Fords etc but my German is non existent so any one who can interpret the information and perhaps the costs involved would be very help full.

Link Removed

I have used Google to translate which is great but when you get more into the detail it starts to get complicated to understand.

 

[Ralph-Dot]

The answer is to avoid these places altogether if at all possible, I never go anywhere neer London.

 

[Braunston]

Hi,

I agree in principal with what you suggest, but

The problem as I see it, is if this spreads as its quiet likely to do, as I believe its a European requirement backed by a lot of green members, quiet a lot of us could find ourselves in difficult positions either by:-

(1) Inadvertently entering a zone either here or in Europe not just Germany and London and receiving a fine.

or

(2) Having difficulty in selling our vehicles in the future.

There are probably more problems but those are enough at present

The answer is to avoid these places altogether if at all possible, I never go anywhere neer London.

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[Snowbird]

Hi,

Just thought I would raise this looming problem again, it appears Boris may have suspended the second phase for now but I assume that is only a temporary stay of execution and the Unweltzones in some of the Germany cities apparently may be changed later this year or early next thus raising/lowering the emission limits.

So my question is has anyone been looking at retro fitting filters, it appears there are some companies in Germany that have filters that may suit our motorhomes, but the British companies all seem to be concentrating on the larger HGV market.

Here's a link to a Germany site that may have suitable equipment for our older Fiats/Fords etc but my German is non existent so any one who can interpret the information and perhaps the costs involved would be very help full.

Link Removed

I have used Google to translate which is great but when you get more into the detail it starts to get complicated to understand.

Please forgive my ignorance, but I have spent so little time in UK over recent years I have no idea re motorhome regs, requirements re, unwell zones, I know that am not suposed to leave M25 when travelling north to M1 becouse of weight restrictions, am 7.5 ton. But don`t know about this pollution ripoff they have in London.
Does it affect motorhomes? thought it was just for trucks.

 

[GJH]

Please forgive my ignorance, but I have spent so little time in UK over recent years I have no idea re motorhome regs, requirements re, unwell zones, I know that am not suposed to leave M25 when travelling north to M1 becouse of weight restrictions, am 7.5 ton. But don`t know about this pollution ripoff they have in London.
Does it affect motorhomes? thought it was just for trucks.

I don't know anything about weight restrictions when leaving the M1 but all the information on the London LEZ is Here.

Graham

 

[ourcampersbeentrashed]

There was supposed to be a consultation coming out in September but havent seen it yet on the website.

Am keeping an eye because I think motorhomers should be exempt xxxx

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[Snowbird]

Hi all, We were thinking of spending some time in London with the RV.
I know there is a campsite there,but how on earth do you get to it without paying all these charges, do you have to pay now, or is it on its way.Its all very confusing.

 

[Brisey]

Hi Snowbird,
The following has been copied from the TFL website.



The Mayor of London, Boris Johnson, has proposed in his Air Quality Strategy ('Clearing the Air') to continue the suspension of the Low Emission Zone (LEZ) regulations for large vans and minibuses until 2012. The LEZ, which requires vehicles to meet Euro III standards for particulate emissions, has been in operation for lorries, buses and coaches since 2008. It was originally intended to extend the LEZ to include large vans (LGVs) and minibuses from October 2010.
The Mayor suspended the 2010 deadline as, given the economic climate, he felt that the cost for operators of complying with the LEZ within that timeframe was more significant than when the LEZ was first introduced in 2008. Deferring the scheme for large vans and minibuses will give operators and owners of large vans and minibuses more time to comply with the requirements and ease the financial burden on operators in the Capital.
All proposed changes to the LEZ scheme will be subject to public consultation, and will need to be considered by the Mayor once he has reviewed the outcome of the consultation.





The Low Emission Zone (LEZ) affects older, diesel-engined lorries, buses, coaches, large vans (exceeding 1.205 tonnes unladen weight) and minibuses (over eight seats plus the driver's seat and below 5 tonnes).
Cars, motorcycles and small vans (under 1.205 tonnes unladen weight) are not included in the LEZ

It also affects other specialist vehicles that are derived from lorries and vans, including motorised horse boxes, breakdown and recovery vehicles, refuse collection vehicles, snow ploughs, gritters, road sweepers, concrete mixers, tippers, removals lorries, fire engines, extended-cab dual purpose pick-ups and some light utility vehicles. Motor caravans, ambulances and large hearses (over 2.5 tonnes) are also included.
The LEZ applies to all vehicles, irrespective of whether they are used for commercial or private use.
Cars, motorcycles and small vans (under 1.205 tonnes unladen weight) are not included in the LEZ.

 

[pappajohn]

hi Dave,
if you mean Abbey wood i think its just outside the zone but not 100% sure.

Abbey wood

i could be and very likely am confused but the LEZ is only for diesel engines.
cant remember if you're diesel or petrol.

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[Snowbird]

hi Dave,
if you mean Abbey wood i think its just outside the zone but not 100% sure.

Abbey wood

i could be and very likely am confused but the LEZ is only for diesel engines.
cant remember if you're diesel or petrol.

Hi John, Thats the one Abbey Wood.
Problem is am 7500kgs and diesel, even though I am ZERO emissions on bio, but they wont except that.
If I have to pay congestion charge to get off M25 into London, and then LEZ on top of that, plus campsite fee, plus tube to go in and out of city it would be cheaper to stay at the Ritz.
Will try to talk herself out of it.

 

[pappajohn]

Dave,
open the webpage again, click on 'see map' then click on 'other sites within 20 mile radius' above map.

quite a few outside the zone.

 

[Snowbird]

Dave,
open the webpage again, click on 'see map' then click on 'other sites within 20 mile radius' above map.

quite a few outside the zone.

OK chears John, If I have to pay all these charges theres no cash left for important things like beer, and I like to take one somtimes.

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[GJH]

Abbey Wood is inside the LEZ as is the other CC site at Crystal Palace.

Of the two Lee Valley sites, the one on the west at Edmonton is inside the LEZ and the one on the east at Sewardstone is outside the LEZ (don't know if it will take a 7500 Kg RV though).

The sites can all be reached without going through the (much smaller) Congestion Charge zone.

Graham

 

[pappajohn]

Abbey Wood is inside the LEZ as is the other CC site at Crystal Palace.

Of the two Lee Valley sites, the one on the west at Edmonton is inside the LEZ and the one on the east at Sewardstone is outside the LEZ (don't know if it will take a 7500 Kg RV though).

The sites can all be reached without going through the (much smaller) Congestion Charge zone.

Graham

cheers Graham....could be what i was thinking of. oh:

 

[Braunston]

Hi,

It would be very interesting to see any consultation, but I do wonder who will be asked to provide input, will it be opened up to everyone affected and if it is will they be able to compile an effective collective response (I doubt it).

Or will it just be left to the same people they must have consulted before and if that is the case then we don't stand much chance in changing the rules e.g. getting Motor-homes Excluded it hasn't been possible in Germany.

That's why I raised the thread, as rather than just waiting to get the same conditions applied in 2012, I felt it would be very helpful if we could get some of the people with engineering knowledge from this web site, on the case, as we may be able to find a cost affective solution for those of us that will be affected.

Hence the link to the German site that appears to make after-market equipment that may resolve a lot of our problems, if i could just understand German.

Link Removed

There was supposed to be a consultation coming out in September but havent seen it yet on the website.

Am keeping an eye because I think motorhomers should be exempt xxxx

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[Losos]

The answer is to avoid these places altogether if at all possible, I never go anywhere neer London.

Yes Ralph, I have also vowed to never enter inside the M25 again, even if I live to be 100 never, never, never well TBH that vow relates to driving but it would need to be a pretty compeling reason to go in by public transport too

 

[pappajohn]

havent driven in london for the last 20odd years and have no desire to do so now or in the future.

for all i care they can erect a big wall around the M25 and stop people going in....or out.

oh no...that was tried in berlin wasnt it. oh:

 

[Braunston]

Hi,

I know threads go off at tangents, but it could be very important to some people if we could find solutions the the engineering problems, as its not just London,

I wouldn't be surprised if it spreads to other major cities/towns in the UK as its doing in Germany and the Netherlands and some other countries.

If you are thinking of visiting Germany you should read this

Link Removed

If you are thinking of traveling in Europe its worth checking if the areas you are thinking of going have introduced Low Emission Zones here:-

http://www.lowemissionzones.eu/


Thanks

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[olley]

Hi the LEZ isn't just about Co2, its the particulates that you get with diesels that are also the problem, and that's why diesels and not petrol engines are being targeted.

I presume that as large petrol lorries are almost unheard of, they haven't included us petrol engined RVer's in their calculations.

Olley

 

[pappajohn]

they haven't included us petrol engined RVer's in their calculations.

Olley

but it'll cost you an arm and a leg to get to the big city anyway. oh:

 

[staging lady]

Hi,

I know threads go off at tangents, but it could be very important to some people if we could find solutions the the engineering problems, as its not just London,

I wouldn't be surprised if it spreads to other major cities/towns in the UK as its doing in Germany and the Netherlands and some other countries.

If you are thinking of visiting Germany you should read this

Link Removed

If you are thinking of traveling in Europe its worth checking if the areas you are thinking of going have introduced Low Emission Zones here:-

Europe-wide information on Low Emission Zones


Thanks

Thanks for an interesting and helpful thread. I hadn't realised there were so many LEZ zones in Germany and you are right this could eventually spread to more towns in the Uk
Unfortunately I can't speak German but hopefully some one will?
Lucille

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[olley]

hi the German umwelt system is much cheaper, cost €5 for a sticker that's valid all over Germany, I got a yellow although it should be a green, I don't think they could believe that I had an 8.1 petrol, and probably assumed it was a mistake, and was actually a diesel. :Sad:

Retrofit Particulate filters, are never likely to be a viable option, and that's they only way older diesels will meet the regs.

In brief they are a filter which sits in the exhaust pipe and collects the soot, but like all filters they get blocked so need cleaning, the way this done is either passive or active, see here if you want the full sp. Diesel particulate filter - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

But basically they need to be designed for your engine, and certified as such, without the certification the LEZ will still apply, and then theirs the cost, probably at least £2000 or more.

Olley

 

[schojac]

Visited Abbey Wood recently; it is in the LEZ. On the web site you are able to enter your reg details and it will tell you if you are liable for charging. My modest Autotrail Mohican is exempt for the moment but that may well change in the near future.

 

[ourcampersbeentrashed]

Hi,

It would be very interesting to see any consultation, but I do wonder who will be asked to provide input, will it be opened up to everyone affected and if it is will they be able to compile an effective collective response (I doubt it).



Hi Braunston

The original mayoral plan was to post a consultation open to all, so everyone could comment and comments could be done on the TFL website consultation link too.

If the consultation ever emerges I will update everyone on fun xxxxx

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[ourcampersbeentrashed]

Hi all, We were thinking of spending some time in London with the RV.
I know there is a campsite there,but how on earth do you get to it without paying all these charges, do you have to pay now, or is it on its way.Its all very confusing.

Hi Snowbird


I am just down the road from the Lea Valley (Sewardstone Road) site. It is outside the LEZ. There is a bus service on Sewardstone Road itself with Chingford train Station not too far away which can take you into central london.

Here is the link

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There is also a site at debden which is outside the LEZ. The link is below. I understand that a lot of money is likely to be spent on this one for the olympics. Its quite popular. Debden Train Station is on the Central Line again taking you into central london.

Link Removed


The next one is a small site - never been and dont think it is near any public transport but here is the link

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Hope you find these helpful

 

[jakeontour]

Umwelt Zone

Hi
I agree with the comments about keeping clear of cities and emission zones, but after driving around Germany for a few weeks in the 'van, trust me it's easier said than done.

On a few occassions we encountered diversions off major roads (for carriageway re-surfacing) that took you straight into an Umwelt Zone. We have a sticker, so no problem, but friends who didn't had no choice but to risk the €40 fine in the post.

And they'd spent weeks telling us we were wasting money buying one! Turns out they had called into somewhere just over the border from Belgium and been quoted €64 for a sticker, when you can get them for as little as €5.