I am furious (1 Viewer)

Nov 6, 2013
3,201
227,251
East Sussex
Funster No
28,906
MH
Hymer B574DL
Exp
Since 2011 (tugger for 20 before that)
I took my van in for hab check today after emptying it completely yesterday.
I got a phone call at about 10:00 to say there is some work to do on the inverter circuit as it doesn't meet requirements. I fitted this myself using the @Techno resource http://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum...over-relay-for-inverter-doc.36859/?version=11
The installation went very well and I used crimp connectors behind the Sargent unit to connect to the ring circuit. I said if it's not up to spec can they rectify it?
Yes she said so I gave the go ahead.
I have just picked the van up and they explained to me that they have disconnected the inverter and returned the van to original spec :Eeek::Eeek:
When I asked why, I was told that the inverter should have its own RCD (which I accept) and the insulated crimp connectors should be heat shrink covered. I then said I thought you were going to rectify the problems and was then told "we don't fit inverters ":banghead::banghead: At this point I lost it a bit :swear::swear:
"So" says I ."you have just charged me £150 to disconnect my inverter" The convoluted answer I got can be taken as "yes".
A letter will be forthcoming and I will not use the said dealer again.

Rant over
 

irnbru

LIFE MEMBER
Jun 27, 2013
13,503
31,101
Glasgow
Funster No
26,684
MH
Benimar 264
Exp
11 yrs
Thats awful. Knowing me I wouldhave asked them to put it back to the way it was rather than pay. They disconnected it all without your say so.

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Feb 16, 2013
19,505
51,186
uttoxeter
Funster No
24,713
MH
ambulance conversion
Exp
50 years
I took my van in for hab check today after emptying it completely yesterday.
I got a phone call at about 10:00 to say there is some work to do on the inverter circuit as it doesn't meet requirements. I fitted this myself using the @Techno resource http://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum...over-relay-for-inverter-doc.36859/?version=11
The installation went very well and I used crimp connectors behind the Sargent unit to connect to the ring circuit. I said if it's not up to spec can they rectify it?
Yes she said so I gave the go ahead.
I have just picked the van up and they explained to me that they have disconnected the inverter and returned the van to original spec :Eeek::Eeek:
When I asked why, I was told that the inverter should have its own RCD (which I accept) and the insulated crimp connectors should be heat shrink covered. I then said I thought you were going to rectify the problems and was then told "we don't fit inverters ":banghead::banghead: At this point I lost it a bit :swear::swear:
"So" says I ."you have just charged me £150 to disconnect my inverter" The convoluted answer I got can be taken as "yes".
A letter will be forthcoming and I will not use the said dealer again.

Rant over
Is this a newish van that has to have a hab check for the warrenty, if not , what's it got to do with them what you have in it.
 
OP
OP
Baycott
Nov 6, 2013
3,201
227,251
East Sussex
Funster No
28,906
MH
Hymer B574DL
Exp
Since 2011 (tugger for 20 before that)
Is this a newish van that has to have a hab check for the warrenty, if not , what's it got to do with them what you have in it.
Yes new in 2015.
Dealer is Marquis in Golden Cross.

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Minxy

LIFE MEMBER
Aug 22, 2007
32,488
66,011
E Yorks
Funster No
149
MH
Carthago Compactline
Exp
Since 1996, had Elddis/Swift/Rapido/Rimor/Chausson MHs. Autocruise/Globecar PVCs/Compactline i-138
You didn't give them permission to remove it but to rectify it, ie bring it up to spec, which they agreed the would do ... they haven't done this so they haven't done the work you were told they were going to so you shouldn't have to pay for it. If they won't play ball go to trading standards as they misled you.
 

Geo

Trader - Funster
Jul 29, 2007
11,757
14,563
Mansfield,Notts
Funster No
35
MH
Autotrail Tracker FB
Exp
45 +years with breaks
Sorry by your own admission you asked them to bring it up to spec, if they had rectified the install errors it would not be up to spec ie as original
you may have died with shock at the invoice had they done what you thought you had asked them to do
I agree what they did warranted a phone call at the very least to clarify matters
 
R

Robert Clark

Deleted User
Yes new in 2015.
Dealer is Marquis in Golden Cross.
That's where we bought our first van from - almost ended up having a punch up!!!
And that was trying to buy a new van.

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TheBig1

LIFE MEMBER
Nov 27, 2011
17,509
42,755
Dorset
Funster No
19,048
MH
A class
Exp
many many years! since I was a kid
I have to say, I am not surprised it was a branch of Marquis and their customer service remains at the bottom of a pretty deep barrel. I also agree that they did not carry out the work as agreed and overstepped their authority by removing the inverter.
its not rocket science to reinstall it and include a separate trip, but got to agree with them that the joints should be insulated with heatshrink tubing. only takes seconds and costs pennies
 
OP
OP
Baycott
Nov 6, 2013
3,201
227,251
East Sussex
Funster No
28,906
MH
Hymer B574DL
Exp
Since 2011 (tugger for 20 before that)
its not rocket science to reinstall it and include a separate trip, but got to agree with them that the joints should be insulated with heatshrink tubing. only takes seconds and costs pennies
With hindsight, I agree, but at the time thought that insulated crimps would be fine. My beef is that, if I was told they were going to disconnect the inverter, I wouldn't have given the go ahead.
 

Gorse Hill

Free Member
Feb 2, 2013
2,364
1,944
Stretford
Funster No
24,533
MH
Burnster Ixeo IT 734
Exp
2000
I took my van in for hab check today after emptying it completely yesterday.
I got a phone call at about 10:00 to say there is some work to do on the inverter circuit as it doesn't meet requirements. I fitted this myself using the @Techno resource http://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum...over-relay-for-inverter-doc.36859/?version=11
The installation went very well and I used crimp connectors behind the Sargent unit to connect to the ring circuit. I said if it's not up to spec can they rectify it?
Yes she said so I gave the go ahead.
I have just picked the van up and they explained to me that they have disconnected the inverter and returned the van to original spec :Eeek::Eeek:
When I asked why, I was told that the inverter should have its own RCD (which I accept) and the insulated crimp connectors should be heat shrink covered. I then said I thought you were going to rectify the problems and was then told "we don't fit inverters ":banghead::banghead: At this point I lost it a bit :swear::swear:
"So" says I ."you have just charged me £150 to disconnect my inverter" The convoluted answer I got can be taken as "yes".
A letter will be forthcoming and I will not use the said dealer again.

Rant over
Did they mean it's own MCB, rather the RCD as you already have a main incoming RCD covering the installation if so use an RCBO
Be very interested to know what they thought didn't comply with the regs

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OP
OP
Baycott
Nov 6, 2013
3,201
227,251
East Sussex
Funster No
28,906
MH
Hymer B574DL
Exp
Since 2011 (tugger for 20 before that)
Did they mean it's own MCB, rather the RCD as you already have a main incoming RCD covering the installation if so use an RCBO
Be very interested to know what they thought didn't comply with the regs
No. They specifically said RCD even though the system has its own protection :confused:
They said that although the crimp connectors were insulated, they have to be shrink wrapped too. Also not acceptable to have the plug connectors used in the system designed by Techno. :banghead:
 

Gorse Hill

Free Member
Feb 2, 2013
2,364
1,944
Stretford
Funster No
24,533
MH
Burnster Ixeo IT 734
Exp
2000
No. They specifically said RCD even though the system has its own protection :confused:
They said that although the crimp connectors were insulated, they have to be shrink wrapped too. Also not acceptable to have the plug connectors used in the system designed by Techno. :banghead:
As them to quote the regulation that they insist the installation doesn't comply with, load of BS
Recommendation is not the same as regulation
The installation probably has a main RCD incomer (protecting all circuits) so how can a seperate RCD for the invertor improve the safety of the installation
 

Abacist

LIFE MEMBER
Oct 15, 2013
3,649
10,041
Devon
Funster No
28,581
MH
N & B Tag Axle
Exp
since 2013
As someone completely unqualified in electrics I understand that mains work should be subject to rules and regulations as in a house and my van had an electrical certificate given to it when I bought it secondhand by the dealer. What are the rules and regulations that apply to 12 volt installations in cars, vans, motorhomes, boats etc?

I have also felt confident to follow the examples that @Techno has given us and have every confidence in the quality of his work as nobody has ever had other than praise for his work and projects.

This is a salutary warning to us all if our vans have to be inspected by a third party and what instructions we should give in the circumstances to protect our installations!
 

Bart

Free Member
Jun 4, 2016
3,188
1,396
Northern Ireland
Funster No
43,436
MH
Boxer L4H2 van build
Exp
Since 2016
I'd park my MH right through there front window into their reception :D

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Techno

LIFE MEMBER
Deceased RIP
Jul 28, 2010
15,475
20,752
Leeds the one up North
Funster No
12,905
MH
Rapido 7090F 3 litre 160
Exp
May 2010
Please explain to me what heat shrink sleeve would add to those connections
Insulation is protection against short circuit and direct contact and that is already achieved twice!
image.jpeg
 
OP
OP
Baycott
Nov 6, 2013
3,201
227,251
East Sussex
Funster No
28,906
MH
Hymer B574DL
Exp
Since 2011 (tugger for 20 before that)
Heat shrink on already insulated connections is completely unnecessary
My thoughts exactly Andy but my real argument is that they didn't explain that their way of "meeting the requirements " was to disconnect the inverter altogether :banghead:
 

eddie

LIFE MEMBER
Oct 4, 2007
8,126
41,034
Taunton Somerset
Funster No
540
MH
RV
Exp
since 1989
As them to quote the regulation that they insist the installation doesn't comply with, load of BS
Recommendation is not the same as regulation
The installation probably has a main RCD incomer (protecting all circuits) so how can a seperate RCD for the invertor improve the safety of the installation
The RCD on the incoming main before the output of the inverter they are correct that The output of the inverter should be protected with an RCD

Are the brass terminals on the back of the 13 amp sockets heat shrink protected? Of course not. Using insulated crimp terminals in a sealed box is perfectly safe

Most German vans have spade terminals, uninsulated, plugged onto fir tree connectors as distribution points
 

eddie

LIFE MEMBER
Oct 4, 2007
8,126
41,034
Taunton Somerset
Funster No
540
MH
RV
Exp
since 1989
Please explain to me what heat shrink sleeve would add to those connections
Insulation is protection against short circuit and direct contact and that is already achieved twice!
View attachment 113991
You are of course entirely right. They are making it up

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Gorse Hill

Free Member
Feb 2, 2013
2,364
1,944
Stretford
Funster No
24,533
MH
Burnster Ixeo IT 734
Exp
2000
The RCD on the incoming main before the output of the inverter they are correct that The output of the inverter should be protected with an RCD

Are the brass terminals on the back of the 13 amp sockets heat shrink protected? Of course not. Using insulated crimp terminals in a sealed box is perfectly safe

Most German vans have spade terminals, uninsulated, plugged onto fir tree connectors as distribution points
Plug in RCD on inverter, the insulated terminal comply and safe

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Welsh girl

LIFE MEMBER
Nov 7, 2009
3,658
3,036
Funster No
9,222
MH
Globecar
Exp
Since 2004
Marquis. Golden cross.

Ahhh the fun we've had at that dealership. NOT! !!
 
Mar 10, 2016
558
617
Scotland
Funster No
41,942
MH
A Class RMB 750HE
Exp
Three years and counting, 30 years a tent tower.
Have to agree with all of the above as a very qualified electrical engineer. The addition of heat shrink insulation would only be necessary to counter a specific additional contact or contamination hazard, for example we use adhesive lined heatshrink on crimp connectors that may be exposed to damp. In a dry contained environment with no finger access using insulated crimp terminals on stranded cable ends is perfectly acceptable.
 

TheBig1

LIFE MEMBER
Nov 27, 2011
17,509
42,755
Dorset
Funster No
19,048
MH
A class
Exp
many many years! since I was a kid
the reason I prefer to see crimped joints heatshrunk in motorhomes is the vibration aspect. especially if the crimps are not perfectly done and tight

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