ant & Linds
Free Member
Our acid test arrived with a 300 mile old MH doing 4500 on our Moroccan Honeymoon.
The problem with a computer controlling the clutch and engine power is that it wont allow you to be harsh with the engine when you need more power and less clutch.
I think Fiat have got something wrong here. The new tiptronic (or whatever they call it) gearbox has a computer model for setting off. No more racing starts, the fly by wire accelerator means that even if you floor the accelerator nothing happens, whilst the clutch is fed in at a predetermined rate and power is added at a similar rate, until the machine moves forward.
Morocco is pretty hilly in places, I learned to dread any loose surfaces or inclines, especially when cold, I even flew up the loading ramp to the ferry at 15 mph to avoid any chance of a hill start.
I ordered my machine with ASR but was told it had ESP as standard. Only, when I checked, it doesnt have a warning light, so cant have ESP, and i know from wheel spin it doesnt have ASR.
Imagine climbing a hill with loose chips under one wheel, the engine is reving around 2000rpm so the turbo is 'in' and the engine is developing a nice climbing power, wheelspin under one wheel, OMG, and the vehicle stops moving and smoke starts erupting from the front wheel. STOP. Arrgh. Buggerit. hand brake on , hill start, b***ocks, wheelspin, smoke, tramping, 6ft bouncing along, hard surface under both wheels, yippee (she canny tek anymoh capn) off we go again (curses from all the vans behind now also doing a hill start with far less drama.
Imagine a similar hill without the loose surface, maybe a tad steeper. handbrake off, floor the accelerator, engine revs drop, clutch comes in, vehicle does not move, engine is groaning around 1200-1300 revs. !!! (again just to reinforce this, vehicle does not move)
Perhaps i'll take a run at it and get to the magic 2000 rpm. zoom zoom, 15mph here we come (Give it everything she's got Scotty, aye aye capn), dust everywhere, whee around we go, judder, judder, (low engine oil pressure, EGR over pressure, engine stalls)
Enter trusty Land Rover Discovery and the mandatory queue of fellow travellers watching with chairs, G&T and side bets of will he wont he. The combination managed perfectly at 15mph all the way to the top. This wasnt weel spin but a lack of recognition that the vehicle is doing a hill start on a steep incline and needs more power and a feathered clutch. Try explaining to a German motor cyclist that the automatic clutch is isnt working properly!when he is insisting you need more gas and less clutch and simultaneously to the land rover driver who is roping up to the plastic grill that you need the towing eye, if you want to see how easily you can loose your temper and all this is schoolboy french. Why is it that the harpies descend exactly when you need them least.
I have a little switch on the dash which has a small weight perched on the back of a motor home as a symbol, the book says 'use this when hill climbing'. When pressed a little E appears on the Display. This button makes no difference whatsover to the behaviour of the engine or clutch. I tried it on and off, when starting off, when climbing, when descending, when on the loo!!(Thinks! maybe i was a little looser that day but i thought it was Djheli Belly, "Aha! Dr Watson", said Holmes in one of his more melancoly tones "its a new form of laxative"), i got so mad with it I pushed it so hard it fell into the dash and we had to fish it out and re fix it in place.
I have my own EOBD now as i am fed up with warning lights. The trick is to RTFM. which says 'do not expect full performance from the machine whilst cold', this is straight after the paragraph which says 'do not allow the engine the warm up before setting off as this wastes fuel'. My trick was to allow the engine to idle for 10 minutes before setting off. This always made me nearly tail end charlie of the convoy as, as soon as my engine started everyone rushed to set off, except Guy hwo actaully enjoyed being last???!!! Andys general rule of thumb "A warm engine never gets EGR warning lights"
So the moral of the tale
If you want a specification applying do not be put off by the salesman who says it has it as standard
Beware little buttons which light up and say 'do not push the button again' (unless you are going to the loo)
Always have an EOBD which turns off those annoying lights when you are destroying the engine
Always take a run at inclines of at least 15mph and always try to make the ferry loading staff jump out of the way. (it makes a real mess of the tyres)
Always park a long way away from your fellow travellers so they cant hear you warm up the engine.
Always place side bets that you wont make it up this time
Sack Scotty, he's nowt but a barrack room lawyer anyway
Love to you all
The problem with a computer controlling the clutch and engine power is that it wont allow you to be harsh with the engine when you need more power and less clutch.
I think Fiat have got something wrong here. The new tiptronic (or whatever they call it) gearbox has a computer model for setting off. No more racing starts, the fly by wire accelerator means that even if you floor the accelerator nothing happens, whilst the clutch is fed in at a predetermined rate and power is added at a similar rate, until the machine moves forward.
Morocco is pretty hilly in places, I learned to dread any loose surfaces or inclines, especially when cold, I even flew up the loading ramp to the ferry at 15 mph to avoid any chance of a hill start.
I ordered my machine with ASR but was told it had ESP as standard. Only, when I checked, it doesnt have a warning light, so cant have ESP, and i know from wheel spin it doesnt have ASR.
Imagine climbing a hill with loose chips under one wheel, the engine is reving around 2000rpm so the turbo is 'in' and the engine is developing a nice climbing power, wheelspin under one wheel, OMG, and the vehicle stops moving and smoke starts erupting from the front wheel. STOP. Arrgh. Buggerit. hand brake on , hill start, b***ocks, wheelspin, smoke, tramping, 6ft bouncing along, hard surface under both wheels, yippee (she canny tek anymoh capn) off we go again (curses from all the vans behind now also doing a hill start with far less drama.
Imagine a similar hill without the loose surface, maybe a tad steeper. handbrake off, floor the accelerator, engine revs drop, clutch comes in, vehicle does not move, engine is groaning around 1200-1300 revs. !!! (again just to reinforce this, vehicle does not move)
Perhaps i'll take a run at it and get to the magic 2000 rpm. zoom zoom, 15mph here we come (Give it everything she's got Scotty, aye aye capn), dust everywhere, whee around we go, judder, judder, (low engine oil pressure, EGR over pressure, engine stalls)
Enter trusty Land Rover Discovery and the mandatory queue of fellow travellers watching with chairs, G&T and side bets of will he wont he. The combination managed perfectly at 15mph all the way to the top. This wasnt weel spin but a lack of recognition that the vehicle is doing a hill start on a steep incline and needs more power and a feathered clutch. Try explaining to a German motor cyclist that the automatic clutch is isnt working properly!when he is insisting you need more gas and less clutch and simultaneously to the land rover driver who is roping up to the plastic grill that you need the towing eye, if you want to see how easily you can loose your temper and all this is schoolboy french. Why is it that the harpies descend exactly when you need them least.
I have a little switch on the dash which has a small weight perched on the back of a motor home as a symbol, the book says 'use this when hill climbing'. When pressed a little E appears on the Display. This button makes no difference whatsover to the behaviour of the engine or clutch. I tried it on and off, when starting off, when climbing, when descending, when on the loo!!(Thinks! maybe i was a little looser that day but i thought it was Djheli Belly, "Aha! Dr Watson", said Holmes in one of his more melancoly tones "its a new form of laxative"), i got so mad with it I pushed it so hard it fell into the dash and we had to fish it out and re fix it in place.
I have my own EOBD now as i am fed up with warning lights. The trick is to RTFM. which says 'do not expect full performance from the machine whilst cold', this is straight after the paragraph which says 'do not allow the engine the warm up before setting off as this wastes fuel'. My trick was to allow the engine to idle for 10 minutes before setting off. This always made me nearly tail end charlie of the convoy as, as soon as my engine started everyone rushed to set off, except Guy hwo actaully enjoyed being last???!!! Andys general rule of thumb "A warm engine never gets EGR warning lights"
So the moral of the tale
If you want a specification applying do not be put off by the salesman who says it has it as standard
Beware little buttons which light up and say 'do not push the button again' (unless you are going to the loo)
Always have an EOBD which turns off those annoying lights when you are destroying the engine
Always take a run at inclines of at least 15mph and always try to make the ferry loading staff jump out of the way. (it makes a real mess of the tyres)
Always park a long way away from your fellow travellers so they cant hear you warm up the engine.
Always place side bets that you wont make it up this time
Sack Scotty, he's nowt but a barrack room lawyer anyway
Love to you all