Electric hook up in europe - Page 2

Galway · 21-07-2008, 11:05 PM

JayDee
Would it be possible to show us a diagram?

JayDee · 22-07-2008, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galway

JayDee
Would it be possible to show us a diagram?

Easy to do a diagram, not so easy to post it - I'm just getting my head around using Linux and I've not yet worked out all the differences. So it may take some time

John

JayDee · 22-07-2008, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayDee

Easy to do a diagram, not so easy to post it - I'm just getting my head around using Linux and I've not yet worked out all the differences. So it may take some time

John

I'm not very good at this sort of thing,

but I hope you can make sense of it.

Had the devil's own job getting the document from Open Office Drawing format into something that would be recognised and would fit - but here it is.

John

xgx · 22-07-2008, 11:39 AM

That's very clear and understandable John

... maybe Jim should make it a sticky somewhere as it often comes up...

Picked up a male and female 16A plug/socket at a show (thanks for the pointer Jim) for only £1.50 each...

djchapple · 04-08-2008, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moandick

Hi Solitaire

In terms that I can understand - not being an electrician.....

You are already aware that some European sites use two pin plugs rather than three - the third pin being an earth lead.

Each English lead contains three wires - a live, a neutral and an earth - all of which must be located in their proper place in order to make the equipment work properly - and that is done by the shape of the plug - it will only fit into a socket in one particular way.

On a two pin site there is NO earth wire (just a live and a neutral) and that means that it is possible to fit the plug into the socket the 'wrong' way round - hence 'Reverse Polarity' - in theory it could mean that your appliances works backwards.

Seriously - it actually means that the appliance could still be live even when it is switched off.

Go to any caravan dealers where they have a spares shop and they will be able to supply a polarity tester and a specially wired cable which fits between your lead and the socket - and corrects the polarity to that which you need.

I spend over two months each year travelling around France inspecting sites for a campsite guide and I have NEVER found a site with a two pin connection and hence no earth. can anyone name a site they have found with just a two pin, no earth connection. if so this site contravenes local and EU laws and should be shut down.

The standard French plug does have only two pins, one each for the live and neutral. However it does have a female socket to receive the earthing pin fitted to the socket. So though these plus look like a two pin connection they are a three pin connection.

The problem with reversed polarity is very common in France and on any particular campsite you may find some sockets are OK and others have reversed polarity. This is because the French do not worry about reversed polarity. What you need is a blue plug and blue socket connected with a short cable wired so that live on the plug is connected to neutral on the socket and visa-versa. You can then place this adapter between your motorhome and the normal hook-up lead correcting the reversed polarity.

In countries such as Germany they use the Schuko plug which again only has two pins for live and neutral but it also has two side terminals for the earth - again giving a three wire connection. If reversed polarity is experienced this plug can be taken out, turned 180 degrees and put back in thus correcting the polarity.

You should by a polarity checker from shops such as B&Q as they do give some idea of the state of the connection.

Finally you should never use the standard holiday-type travel adapter that fits onto our 3-pin plug for the following reasons.

1. They are usually only designed for low amperage
2. They are not intended for use out doors and are not waterproof
3. Many do not have an earth connection as they are intended for e4lectric razors, tooth brushes and battery chargers which nearly always only use a two wire connection.
4. Almost all reverse the polarity

djchapple · 13-08-2008, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moandick

Hi DJ

I am not detracting from anything you say BUT it IS perfectly possible to put a two pin plug into a two pin socket the wrong way round for an English connection - irrespective of what wires are where.

That was the whole point of the discussion about reverse polarity and how to overcome the problem.

The Schuko plug, used in Germany and other countries, has earth connectors on the side and can be plug in with reversed polarity but this is easily remedied by taking it out, rotating 180 degrees and refitting.

As I stated i was talking about the electrics in France which us a plug that has two pins and one (earth) "hole". This type of plug is often referred, misleadingly, to as two pin but in reality there are three pins, two on the plug and the other on the socket. This type of plug can only be inserted one way. If there is reversed polarity then, either the plug must be rewired or an adapter lead must be used.

Some travel adapters sold for use in France sometimes have the earth connection missing so that when used a true two pin (no earth) connection will be made. This type of adapter is intended for low amperage use with such things as electric razors These are double insulated and only have two wires.

madbluemad · 14-08-2008, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djchapple

I spend over two months each year travelling around France inspecting sites for a campsite guide and I have NEVER found a site with a two pin connection and hence no earth. can anyone name a site they have found with just a two pin, no earth connection. if so this site contravenes local and EU laws and should be shut down.

The standard French plug does have only two pins, one each for the live and neutral. However it does have a female socket to receive the earthing pin fitted to the socket. So though these plus look like a two pin connection they are a three pin connection.

The problem with reversed polarity is very common in France and on any particular campsite you may find some sockets are OK and others have reversed polarity. This is because the French do not worry about reversed polarity. What you need is a blue plug and blue socket connected with a short cable wired so that live on the plug is connected to neutral on the socket and visa-versa. You can then place this adapter between your motorhome and the normal hook-up lead correcting the reversed polarity.

In countries such as Germany they use the Schuko plug which again only has two pins for live and neutral but it also has two side terminals for the earth - again giving a three wire connection. If reversed polarity is experienced this plug can be taken out, turned 180 degrees and put back in thus correcting the polarity.

You should by a polarity checker from shops such as B&Q as they do give some idea of the state of the connection.

Finally you should never use the standard holiday-type travel adapter that fits onto our 3-pin plug for the following reasons.

1. They are usually only designed for low amperage
2. They are not intended for use out doors and are not waterproof
3. Many do not have an earth connection as they are intended for e4lectric razors, tooth brushes and battery chargers which nearly always only use a two wire connection.
4. Almost all reverse the polarity

Hi, Nobody has mentioned Spain, were off there in a few weeks, what do I need to look out for.

Thanks

Jim

dazzer · 14-08-2008, 10:19 AM

The 1 thing not mentioned on here is that in 99.9% of cases reverse polarity will have no effects at all on your motorhome or stuff inside.

The only time it MAY become a problem is if there is a fault on a very old electrical installation with no earths.

I know a fellow RVer who has an earth spike

that they knock into the ground and is connected to the distribution board to be extra safe.

If anyone has had any equipment failures/problems due to rev pol can they let us know as I have never heard of any problems because of it.

madbluemad · 14-08-2008, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dazzer

The 1 thing not mentioned on here is that in 99.9% of cases reverse polarity will have no effects at all on your motorhome or stuff inside.

The only time it MAY become a problem is if there is a fault on a very old electrical installation with no earths.

I know a fellow RVer who has an earth spike

that they knock into the ground and is connected to the distribution board to be extra safe.

If anyone has had any equipment failures/problems due to rev pol can they let us know as I have never heard of any problems because of it.

Thats comforting Dazz, I was getting a bit worried by all of the adverse comments

Jim

Phil · 14-08-2008, 01:09 PM

It's not unusual ( Tom Jones ?? ) to find that the built-in battery charger will not work if live and neutral are reversed.

Phil.